Reprise - Combat Badges

Discussion in 'Infantry' started by barbs, Sep 5, 2007.

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  1. Combat Badges have been referred to quite a bit, not least here : Afghan Bling Thread

    I thought I could add to the discussion with some more info and my thoughts by comparing the origins of the US CIB and CAB with the German equivalents from WW2.

    The US CIB had the following four tenets in mind; do they ring any bells? My bold.


    More Here

    Combat Action Badge

    My bold - being bombed, shelled, mortared doesn't cut it - the opportunity to take the battle to the enemy does.

    More here

    Wehrmacht Close Combat Clasp

    Only around 600 (depending on your source) wehrmacht soldiers were awarded the Gold clasp.


    There are likely to be major complaints about these awards because of it being potentially divisive, but quite frankly so it should be. As far as cooks and bottle washers are concerned the CIB wouldn't be available because they are not infantry and the CAB would not be available because they wouldn't be returning fire. The CIB wouldn't go to an RLC driver but he could get the CAB where he was sharing the risks.

    Personally I would like to see infantry soldiers rewarded for the unique role of the Army infantryman, the only soldier whose daily mission is to close with and destroy the enemy and to seize and hold terrain.

    I see no objection to the RAC instigating a tank killing badge!
  2. Aussies have the ICB - Inf Combat Badge for Inf fellas who have been in combat, they also have the ACB for the rest of the army who have been there too.

    Maybe the British Army could follow suit, personally I think it's a bit 'American' to have all these badges for doing, in effect, your job.

    It really has gone a stage too far in Aus, where you get a Recruit Instructor Badge and a Military Instructor badge too, if you are in either role...
  3. Why do we need to big tme about it. I don't like this idea. We don't need more medals, badges and certificates. It's all very Cold War Russian Tank Commander.

    You know yourself what you have done. If Chefs want to go on Myspace and tell women they're sticking it to the fuzzy wuzzys so be it.

    I already have three badges I have to sew on my shirt... don't make it any worse!
  4. I know what I have done but dressed in combats just like the rest how else will my peers or superiors know? When I stand next to a bloke who stagged on with the rear party we both know what we did, but how can you tell us apart?

    Personally I think that the badge system that died with the battle Dress should be brought back. We are a small enough army now to be able to have a decent barrack dress uniform where we can proudly display our hard earned badges
  5. join the scouts they have plenty of badges
  6. Why do you need them to know??? I'm proud of myself for some of the things I have done and I'm angry with myself for some things i didn't.

    Its not going to make you famous and its not going to earn you anything other than the approval of walts.

    As has been suggested on another thread, I don't think i deserve a badge for getting shot at. Why should I earn more for being stood behind a skip taking small arms when there was a chef hiding underneath a bit of canvas sweating her tets off recieving incoming IDF just so I could have some munch when I got back in.
  7. They also have beautifully smooth, hairless thighs.

    Ditto on the penis front too.

    We've enough bling and badges as it is. We're going to end up going down the American way of doing things. If you and your mates know what you went through that's good enough. Sod the civvies, they don't know a wound badge from a sherrif's badge.
  8. I'll drink to that. I suppose the next idea will be logging confirmed kills and recieving a bar on your medal for every 5 BRDM-2's you Destroy.
  9. rusty Sherrif's badge?
  10. RP578

    RP578 LE Book Reviewer

    Fair enough, but if you extend that logic, why have ANY medals? After all YOU know that you were on Telic/Herrick/Banner/Whatever, why do you need to wear ribbons etc.?

    Given the number of threads generated over the years by people quibbling over qualification rules for the Queen's Golden Jubilee Medal and LSGC, I'm surprised that everybody seems to have come over all superior about recognising such a fundamental element of infantry soldiering. My view? Let's have a Combat Infantryman's Badge. There's a world of difference between getting IDF'ed whilst working shifts at the APOD on the one hand, and closing with and killing the enemy on the other.

  11. Good answer mate, it takes all various parts of the Army to win a contact. Why try and belittle a chef, or armskote storeman. Yes it takes guts to close in and kill the enemy, but at the end of the day, is that not your job?
    Food, logistics etc are vitaly as important.
    As for barrack dress, when in this day and age do you think you will have the time to wear it. My Bn scrapped it in 1986 as it was inpractical. Hard to put in a days training etc wearing barrack dress. More a bullshit factor than anything else. As for proudly displaying your badges, does your campaign medals not do that for you. Not something you can wear everyday of the week, but brings a sense of pride when you wear them.

    ps I wonder if we reverted back to this badge system of yours how the SF guys would manage to get all these badges on there nice barrack dress :lol:
  12. Nige, having a badge you wear only when you are in a specific role, that allows people to spot the DS (really shouldn't be necessary in recruit training but may be helpful on career courses) isn't de facto a bad thing. It shouldn't be a permanent wear badge (and probably not worn on SD or 1s), though.

    Like the old wearing of staff gorgets for officers in staff appointments (so you could spot the REMFs coming and hide, I suppose), perhaps?
  13. I would like to know what the criteria would be for such a badge, at the moment everyone makes a the asumption that it would be an Infantry only award, bt being a member of the Royal Regiment who very often finds its self plodding the streets I would be a little miffed at people along side me wearing a badge that I am unallowed to wear.

    Also are we talking being in the area or actual combat experienced ? The reason I say is how do you measure combat ? If 2 soldiers are in a FOB one in the sagers exchanging tin the other in the CP do they both get the badge or only the rifleman, and where does that leave the mortors? Also willl we be picky with tours ? I haven't been to either Iraq or Afganistan. but I did do 4 tours in NI, will I qualify ? If you say no then how came I had more contacts on one tour whilst in Belfast for 4 months in 92 than a group of our lads who have just finshed 7 months in Basra ? Whos the bigger combat vet ?

    I understand the sentiment, but the Chefs, Logies and Scalies are just as soft and vunrable to being turned into a crimson cloud as the next man (or woman)
  14. If your infantry You already have a badge.. its on your Beret !! Why have another on your tit?
  15. wellyhead,

    The answer could be in the first post.

    As correctly said before there is so much carping about LS&GCs and Jubillee medals that it would suggest an underlying feeling that service and speciality is no longer acknowledged.

    If they are not important why do people insist on wearing wings and daggers - "its just a course", in the same way SNCOs in my experience are fiercely proud of their PSBC and SCBC badges and the little stars that go above them (... actually quite an impressive achievement!). In one of the units I worked in the top student on the JNCO cadre was allowed to wear a SNCO capbadge (yes, we have different ones for SNCOs). These little things do make a difference. Why have a sniper's badge? Why do you need to be acknowledged amongst your peers as a well-disciplined and highly trained battalion asset when you know you've done the course?

    Yes, we wear CS95 a lot: probably too much; but that doesn't stop ATs, BDOs, ATOs, Tank Transporters and Divers showing their speciality.

    I think a badge to acknowledge combat action approved by the Bde Comd is doable. It would acknowledge that soldiers from all parts of the Army are engaged in close combat - imagine the look on the face of a visiting general who has never heard a shot fired in anger to be faced by three cooks and a clerk wearing a combat action badge (not for being mortared) but for actually taking the fight to the enemy - after all the accounts of 3 PARA in Sangin would suggest that the cooks and bottlewashers were standing up tyo be counted, not to get a medal or a badge, but because it was the right thing to do, to fight alongside their mates. Soldiers don't fight for these mere baubles and trinkets (those that do would be found out quick sharp) but we should acknowledge it.

    I am very impressed by how understated about it the Americans actually are. You can look at a US soldier in his ACUs and glean a lot of information about him and actually build up a rapport pretty quickly - how often do you see a supply officer with a CAB? That's worth a dit over a coffee and a smoke isn't it? I would like other people and look at my scraggly soldiers and make an assessment based on a greater analysis that "oh, look! another undernourished jock".

    Oh and before we go down the 'we'll start to look like americans' gag, remember that they acknowledge their soldiers' service far better than we do, award a greater range of medals and awards for service to individuals and units than we do and teh understand that which we are trying to get our head around (as a nation) i.e., what the military covenant is.