Repayment of overissue in TA

Discussion in 'Army Pay, Claims & JPA' started by IrishDoris, Oct 18, 2006.

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  1. I have been scrolling through some of the older threads to do with overissues and I am still confused.

    Can they just take any money overpaid to you in one fatal swoop without any warning? Or do you have to be informed and agree to a fair amount being taken from you pay?

    Due to various reasons, the TA is my only job, ie. it's the only pay i have coming in. I found out a couple of months ago that i was getting paid too much in travel ( the distance to my former unit was a hell of alot more). Now as I had done nearly a full months works and the fact that i was on a higher rate of pay, plus the fact I received the pay statement for that month about 4 months later, I did not know that i had been over paid at the time. When the clerk pointed it out, i stopped claiming for travel by the normal means and put in a seperate form. My travel should've been sorted out when i got taken on strength but of course, it hadn't and now i'm paying for it. Literally.

    I realise i will have to pay the money back. But now they have not paid me this month at all. nada, zilch, bupkiss. So i have no money to live on for the next month and possibly the one after that.

    Can they do this?? Aren't you supposed to receive some sort of warning? or a percentage taken? or anything?????? 8O

    Help :(
  2. Can't offer any advice ID, but if what you say is correct, it stinks. Whoever designs the MOD payroll system to work in this way, needs a f*@king.

    Hope it gets sorted for you.
  3. cheers for that.

    Surely someone out there must know. Why is it some units will take the whole whack off you in one go and other units will give you a warning and take a percentage of your pay leaving you with something to live on?????

    once again

    Help :(
  4. In short, the answer is no they should not be able to do this. Forgive the long-winded reply but the detail is crucial to your resolving this issue.

    Recovery of overpayments to both Regular and TA soldiers is governed by the Personnel Administration Manual (TA section = Pt 7, Chap 2, Sect 1). In your case it appears the overpayment is covered by the procedure dealing with either delay or abnormal delays or mistakes.

    The problem with the TA procedure is that it is not as detailed as the Reg procedure, as demonstrated below.

    Regular Procedure:

    02.05553. Overpayments Caused by Delays.

    Many overpayments are the result of late reporting of occurrences by units to APC Pay Div. If the period of overpayment started within the last paid month, it will be recovered in full from the current month's emoluments. If this recovery is seen to cause hardship, the CO may direct that an appropriate cash payment be made.

    02.05554. Overpayments Caused by Abnormal Delays and Mistakes.

    If the start of the overpayment period is earlier than the last paid month and therefore the result of an "abnormal delay" it will be recovered in the current month but the AF O9639 will bear the legend "BELATED DEBIT INCLUDED". In such cases, or if the overpayment is the result of a mistake or of circumstances other than in paras 02.05552 or 02.05553, the soldier is to be invited to make a refund and has the right to raise a "Notice of Objection".

    TA Procedure:


    07.03050. Notification of Debit Balances.

    Units will be notified of debit balances, resulting from errors and/or overissues, as follows:

    a. Debts under £100. On individual’s AF O9639, the clearing of which is solely the responsibility of the unit.

    b. Debts of £100 and Over. On AF N9282, issued in duplicate, as follows:

    (1) £250 and over. Monthly until the debit balance is below £50.

    (2) £100 - £250 for more than 3 consecutive months. Monthly until the debt falls below £50.

    Details of all AFs N9282 issued are held by AFPAA(G) for control purposes.

    07.03051. Action by Unit.

    a. The responsible officer is to endorse and certify both copies of AF N9282 with the following information:

    (1) Balance agreed or disagreed. If a notice of objection to an overpayment has been submitted, this is to be stated.

    (2) That submission to AFPAA(G), in support of disagreement, is being prepared (if applicable).

    (3) Brief explanations as to the reason/cause of the debt, eg excessive cash issues, unexpected debit voucher, fine etc.

    (4) Reference to any omitted or delayed occurrences that would offset the level of the debt.

    (5) Method of recovery of the debt, if applicable, or other statement in amplification.

    (6) Expected date the debit balance will be cleared.

    (7) If the individual is warned for posting or discharge - the effective date/new unit details.

    You will see that whilst there is a clear procedure for the regular soldier there does not appear to be one for his TA counterpart. In fact there is, and it is roughly the same as for the Regular soldier. The key sentence is the statement at para 7.03051a(1) which states "If a notice of objection to an overpayment has been submitted, this is to be stated".

    Were you given the opportunity to object to the recovery or has the RAO just gone ahead without reference to you? You really need to pop along to the RAO and discover what has happened. If you do not get a satisfactory explanation request an interview with your OC. If you really need to get heavy, although it should really not come to this, then submit a redress of grievance iaw AGAI.

  5. I won't disagree with the last post as I can't speak for the TA and my reg exp is a little out of date but I can say that they have most definitely have taken money back enmasse and cuase mayhem in the doing.

    I remember a certain pay clerk who completely cocked up money on a Lion Sun, blokes came back skint as they had a 6 week holiday in a tourist resort only to discover most didn't get the next months pay as they owed so much, in the end there were guys queueing up outside RHQ getting AR payments to cover their costs (BTW this included pads who had to explain the money spent to the other halfs)