Reloading / Handloading topics

Discussion in 'Shooting, Hunting and Fishing' started by Alsacien, Aug 25, 2009.

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  1. Alsacien

    Alsacien LE Moderator

    Maybe we need a sticky for this as it seems to come up regularly sending other threads off course?

    I am currently working up some loads in .270win for 130 & 150gn Nosler ballistic tips.
    I am trying to get exactly the same ballistic performance with the 2 different rounds out to 200mtrs.

    A rifle is a beautiful Mannlicher designed light for the alps with a 20 inch barrel, happily 3 shot grouping sub MOA with factory ammo which I hope to also improve on.

    Loads I have settled on are:
    Norma brass, Fed 210, 130gn Nosler, 56gn Vectan T8000 (=H4831)
    Norma brass, Fed 210, 150gn Nosler, 54gn Vectan T8000 (=H4831)

    Both give a 10-11cm drop at 200 when zeroed at 100 (tbc on the range)

    Both these loads run a chamber pressure of just over 52,000 psi - but both fall well short of factory loadings and factory velocities (even when I calculate for a 25/26 inch barrel). I will measure them on the crono next week and comparing to the Norma factory loading.

    .270win advantages are in its flat trajectory (great in the mountains) which depends on high velocity, 3000fps +, I am 200fps short of that.
    How close to factory loadings do others load to in these sort of calibres?
  2. Unless you're going for head-shots, you might want to reconsider those ballistic-tipped Noslers. I changed to Hornady SSTs because of the ballistic tip's huge meat damage.
  3. Alsacien

    Alsacien LE Moderator

    Good to know. It was an Austrian recommendation for their tough mountain goats/rams - a wounded animal can easily put itself somewhere to dangerous to retrieve.
    How do you rate the SST's against Gamekings?
  4. More stopping power, more meat damage, but a lot less than the ballistic tips. BTs are great as you say for dangerous game, and very accurate (some use them and go for head/neck shots), but they do make a mess of a carcass. I saw a roe that had been chest shot with a 150gr BT and it was almost torn in half, the gralloch sucked out through the exit wound (the size of a football) and spread over about 10 feet.
  5. Alsacien

    Alsacien LE Moderator

    Norma brass, Fed 210, 130gn Nosler, 56gn Vectan T8000 (=H4831)
    Norma brass, Fed 210, 150gn Nosler, 54gn Vectan T8000 (=H4831)

    Both give a 10-11cm drop at 200 when zeroed at 100 (tbc on the range)

    The 130gn load turned out to be shiite 6-7 groups at 100mtrs - velocity around 2600fps (2580-2610).

    The 150gn load turned in 3cm groups - bullet seating depth did not seem to make any difference. Groups were hitting higher (5cm) on the target than the 130gns.

    Going to keep the 150 BT's for boar this winter. Will bin the 130 BT idea.

    So now I need a lightish load for roe/chamois and something a little heavier for larger deer.
    Options on the SST are 130/140/150gn or Gameking in the same sizes.

    Anyone out there loading .270win?
  6. Is T8000 not a bit on the slow side? Wouldn't you get better results with a slightly faster powder?
  7. Alsacien

    Alsacien LE Moderator

    H4831 is meant to be "the" powder in .270win, Tubal 8000 is the Vectan equivalent (I can only get Vectan at the moment).

    You may be right about the faster powder, especially in 20 inch barrel. Its a fussy tool and I reasoned that a known starting point that worked would be my baseline.

    Testing is not easy as the barrel is also fluted and gets very hot after a dozen rounds.
  8. Talking of Vectan, does anybody have the complete Nobel sport book? I can't find a copy anywhere, and the little pamphlet that is reproduced online and given out free issue by stockists is not exactly substantial.

    I would love to buy a copy if I could find one...
  9. Alsacien

    Alsacien LE Moderator

    I have paid for a copy on backorder from a Dutch bookshop (English version) - 4 months and no sign......
  10. I'm reduced to using comparison tables, other data, starting significantly low and then working up while looking for pressure signs.

    It works, but it is time-consuming and expensive.

    Some of their powders do very strange things -- I managed to get a whole load of Sp7 a while back very reasonably. They list this powder for .222 and 5.6x47, but strangely not .223. I developed a 55 grain FMJ load which was adequate for IPSC, and tried to develop a 52gn Sierra match King load. I couldn't get it not to string vertically. I also went after a 62 grain load suitable for IPSC, but acceptable accuracy was only attained at .3gn less than I started getting over pressure signs, so this was definitely not a goer. As a result, the plan for a 69 grain MK load was dropped...

    I also can't seem to make an acceptable 7.62 x 39 cast load with Sp3, although this may have something to do with me casting too soft.
  11. Alsacien

    Alsacien LE Moderator

    I am able to reproduce the data on Nobel Vectan in Quickload on the range - albeit with extrapolation like you have to.

    I am coming close to perfect with a 6.5x55 load in my Mauser - but would not try such high pressures in a non-military rifle.

    IMO there is not enough published or discussed data from a big enough user base - I think Dynamit Nobel know how to make powders, we have not figured out how to best use them......
  12. Perhaps... however I am so used to the simplicity of using Vit ( fairly comprehensive data for free, normally does exactly what it says on the tin, and the starting load is often the best, and if not it is normally already quite good) that Vectan doing slightly strange things on occasion troubles me. There also don't seem to be any gaps in the Vit data, as in a powder with a good burning rate being not present for a given calibre.

    Maybe it is something odd about ball/flattened spherical powders compared to Vit stick powders. I have certainly had no trouble with the fast Ba (single-base, cut-tubular) pistol powders (aside from Ba9 giving lots of unburned powder in 45 Colt Cowboy action loads -- switching to the faster Ba10 fixed that one straight away!), and I have not tried any of the Vectan cut- tubular rifle powders yet.

    In about a year or so I'm going to be on about a kilo of drawn down South African 7.62 x 51 powder, my data point for which indicates that it should load as N140. Should be good for IPSC loads in the 223, and may even go well in the 303.
  13. Stoaty, what you need is "Le Guide Malfatti 6", it is LE reloading guide used in France and biensur uses Vectan as the reference powder range.

    I might order it some time too.
  14. le reloading guide est sur sa route, vieux fruit, et ton copy also.

    Vive le franglais!
  15. Those guys actually work out at cheaper than ordering from the US and paying postage/duty. I didn't quite get the mould I wanted, but it will certainly do!

    By the way, I also ordered a hardness tester and a thermometer, which takes some of the guesswork out of it!