Redress of sjar/sc

[Slater]

Hi,

I have been looking at the SC system for redress of the SJAR. I did not fill out the comments box as everyone told me not to as its the box of death.

I have never challenged a SJAR. After 24 hours I realised I made a mistake and should have done the comments.

The SJAR was referred to the CO for his bit almost straight away. I requested an interview with the CO who went against the 1RO and changed my grade from a dev to a yes, just by a small chat.

I then went through the SJAR and what I had done etc. I found 8 areas of in factual information and much factual information left out. I now know the the SC system but worry I am doing the right thing. I have 65 MB of data to back my facts.

Will this bite me in the arse? Should I back down and be grateful of my CO's bit. I just have an SJAR that is in factual 1RO says dev the 2RO says yes, the board will not look at this SJAR favourable.

Cheers

 

[DesktopCommando]

how long in rank are you, bearing in mind that you have to be 2+ to promote

 

[Lizard_Lips]

how long in rank are you, bearing in mind that you have to be 2+ to promote

3 years plus isn't it?


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[sup rec]

3 years plus isn't it?Posted from the ARRSE Mobile app (iOS or Android)

Depends on Cap badge and current rank. For example for a RIFLES Cpl to promote to Sjt it is 4 years

 

[Slater]

3 and a half years, I am able to select.

 

[The_Duke]

Harsh reality check -

Your CO changing a "Dev" to a "Yes" doesn't really mean that much without a strong write up to support it. "yes" on its own is not likely to be good enough to promote on. If he really thought your SJAR was wide of the mark, he would have sent it back to the 1RO for a re-write.

You could ask for an interview with the 1RO to review his comments and present your evidence of incorrect or missing information. If he isn't willing to do this, then you can start more formal procedures.

What you really need to consider is whether this will do you any good. The fact that you have enough time served to get to the board is only one part of it. Where were you graded in terms of position? Is a new SJAR including your preferred content likely to dramaticallly change that? If it is not going to get you into the top 3 in a Coy/Sqn then you are highly unlikely to be above the line once the Regimental pecking order is established.

Only you can answer that, but you should also consider whether you would be better served by doing a better job of managing your input into the SJAR process next year.

 

[Slater]

Well I did the best job I could in my input my notes were ignored. My line managers were not even asked, bottom line I can prove the in factual information. I have been in the Army 16 years and had good SJARs, bad SJARS and excellent ones. I have never complained but in this case I have been wronged. I am lucky as it is the first time it has happened and the Army has always treated me fairly. I am not to concerned about coming off the board at this time but a few officers have told me that a Dev will hold me back.

You are right in saying what will it achieve? If it could harm me in the near future then I should lodge a complaint based on factual evidence. The problem with this sort of thing is that everyone thinks they should get a better SJAR or be positioned higher, so looking on this site people are hostile towards those who have an issue with their SJAR.

I was top for the last two years but now I am 3rd (different command group). It is the last chance of those above me to get their Warrants and is political. This opinion is felt by the line managers who have been ignored. I am experienced and know what warrants a mention in an SJAR what it takes for promotion. However when a write up is wrong and evidence to support it is there should I continue with the SC or leave it alone? The guys above me need this for their SSM and its their last chance. I am pleased for them but my SJAR is wrong and it could hold me back.

What I was hoping for was someone with experience with SJARS to help me consider the impact of a Dev. I have never had a Dev and have always been in the top 3 whether I was able to promote or not. It is the weakest report I have ever had yet its been one of my strongest performances with critical information left out. I know he did not want me promoted yet and he was worried I would promote if the SJAR was written so. The promotion policy is one thing but sometimes an OC can be wrong in thinking you should do a set time in rank before he considers you ready, regardless of your merits. This was told to my face. Is this the right of an OC or is it wrong to against policy and apply his own rules? When your peers have not done what you have done but have done 4 years more than you and are friendly with key people is it right that a unfair report is sanctioned?

When I talked with the CO he told me his part counted and that he can disagree with 1 RO. This was an informal chat. The 1RO said he would not budge on grades. I was happy with grade not the Dev, I did not deserve a unreservedly recommendation but I really really did not deserve a Dev and 90% of my achievements left out. The CO said I would have to make a formal complaint to get anything further changed. My mistake for not doing the comments box as I advised not to by people above me??

 

[The_Duke]

In simple terms:

"No" means "definitely not".

"Dev" means "no".

"Yes" means "yes, but only if you have room left after everyone else has promoted" and

"High" means "Yes".

"Excep" means "really must promote"

There are then the subtle nuances such as a "Yes" with comments along the lines of "Will promote in due course" means "I have given you a "yes" so that they start to appear in your report book, but you will not promote until I am ready to improve your comments". A "Yes" with a "should promote at the first opportunity" puts you slightly higher up the pecking order in case a sudden load of PIDs to promote into become available.

A "Dev" is very likely to hold you back as a board would usually like to see a couple of years of "yes" or higher in rank. If you don't have that, and others do, then down the pecking order you are likely to go.

All as clear as mud, isn't it?

If you are not happy about the factual content then complain and get it changed. You can't however force a change in opinion, which is what your 1RO's "Dev" is. Your CO may be able to influence it however.

Good luck.

 

[Slater]

Yes, so he has tried to hold me back.

Thanks for your notes, its normally for year 1 Yes building from yes recommended to yes high strongly year 4 that is the average at the moment. This grade will set me back 4 years.

WOW there is no way the OC meant for this but due to him being the first time in a command slot I can see how he has done it. Higher 3rd Yes middle third Dev, lower third no

 

[The_Duke]

Yes, so he has tried to hold me back.

Thanks for your notes, its normally for year 1 Yes building from yes recommended to yes high strongly year 4 that is the average at the moment. This grade will set me back 4 years.

WOW there is no way the OC meant for this but due to him being the first time in a command slot I can see how he has done it. Higher 3rd Yes middle third Dev, lower third no

Not necessarily. The board will look at your last 3 SJARs, and if one of them is obviously out of line they will pay a bit more attention to try and find out why. You might miss out this year, but if you get back to your usual report levels next year then they may well discount the duff report as exactly that - duff.

That does not mean that you shouldn't try to get the content resolved though. In fact, it is even more reason to get it right even if you can't get the "Dev" changed.

 

[Slater]

Duke this I appreciate the advice. My hope is that once the 1RO and the investigator sees the evidence I have, they will see I did a lot better than suggested. I cannot do anything about the opinion as its his right.

Thank you

 

[The_Duke]

No problem - remember it is YOUR career you are looking after so do everything in your power. The others hoping to pick up can look after themselves.

 

[blobmeister]

No problem - remember it is YOUR career you are looking after so do everything in your power. The others hoping to pick up can look after themselves.

That's the best advice I've read for a while. Looking out for number one doesn't come natural to a NCO/SNCO, if I did, you wouldn't be wearing the rank. However, sometimes enough is enough and you have to speak up over the usual 'subjective performance measures' that are reports. Sometimes, you will not come between the favourite, irrespective how well you've done.

Speak out and have courage in your convictions...you clearly have evidence.


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[Donny]

Duke offers good advice on this. If I was on a seniors board (I've done quite a few) my eye would certainly be caught by a change from Dev to Yes between 1RO and 2RO. Net result is that I'd look more closely at previous reports in more detail than I might otherwise have done. A gently worded repudiation of this years report could help this but the key point would be what the last couple of reports said. If you have generally been reported on as average then that's the score you're going to get. If you've previously been a star and this report is viewed as a rogue then you may well get the benefit of the doubt.

Only you can judge what to put in a redress but it's worth thinking hard about how to word it, and taking advice from people you trust (who, ideally, can write well).

 

[Slater]

Thanks for the advice and the insight.

 

[FreddyFlintstone]

Hi,

I have a similar situation. Our sjars were sent to the board before we had seen them and the people put forward were asked to email the guy writing them stating what they had done. None of the others were or given any inclination as to what was happening. This implies a predetermined outcome decided by both the OC and 2ic (the 1RO) even before they had been written. By all accounts the usual case at my unit. Do I have any redress

 

[The_Duke]

Hi,

I have a similar situation. Our sjars were sent to the board before we had seen them and the people put forward were asked to email the guy writing them stating what they had done. None of the others were or given any inclination as to what was happening. This implies a predetermined outcome decided by both the OC and 2ic (the 1RO) even before they had been written. By all accounts the usual case at my unit. Do I have any redress

It depends. It is normal to "pre-filter" for a board, to ensure that only those with sufficient time in rank, qualifications and previous recommendations are considered. A board is busy enough without having to look through folders for people who cannot possibly promote because they don't meet the criteria.

If that is what happened, you don't really have much to complain about. If you meet the criteria for consideration by a board (time in rank, qualification and previous reports) but weren't put forward for grading then you do.