Re-roling of battalions

Discussion in 'Staff College and Staff Officers' started by alfred_the_great, Sep 10, 2010.

Welcome to the Army Rumour Service, ARRSE

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial military website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Given that some battalions are tasked outside of their specialism (I'm thinking primarily RA acting as Inf), how long does it take to conduct the cross-training? Or is there an assumption that everyone can "do" infantry, because it's the default setting of an Army?
     
  2. msr

    msr LE

    That's the pin pulled and the grenade thrown... :)
     
  3. Im not gonna bite however it takes non inf about 9 months to a year to rerole and train to a basic inf standard as a unit.

    Just to add to that all the rank structure in a non inf unit have to try to learn the jobs of inf counterparts from the CO to Coy Comds and CSM's CQMS, Pl Sjt's and Sect Comd's.Inf section commanders and Pl Sjt's have to do a 4 month and 3 month tactics and weapon courses to earn thier stripes, lance jacks have to learn the role of a 2i/c which takes 6 weeks as you can see to re role would take a long time to even get to a basic standard accross the board.
     
  4. It's not a question of biting, I honestly have no idea. One of the reasons I placed this thread here was it generally lacks the crayoning element you find on other forums.

    The other reason was an idea that had been floated was the (possible) reduction in CR2 and AS90 regiments will release some line numbers that *may* be available for increase in Inf strength. It was an intellectual exercise, and one that has been answered to a "80%" standard.
     
  5. A little clarity if I may. Firstly it needs to be made absolutely clear that non-infantry sub-units may conduct tours dismounted and outside their core role however this most certainly does not make them infantry.

    In terms of how long it might take to re-role a non-infantry sub-unit into an infantry company; I would suggest in the region of 5 years. The reason for this is the time taken for the whole chain of command to conduct the dull range of infantry career courses and gain sufficient experience (e.g. Pl Sgts would need to do Juniors and Seniors and spend time in role to realistically do the job).

    Clearly this is not the case for a sub-unit employed in a non-infantry dismounted capacity for a tour (I.e. Not employed in deliberate dismounted close combat).
     
  6. As part of a cav unit used in an inf role, it took us about 4 months, but that was urban patrolling in bricks and multiples, sangar, VCP and with some vehicle drills thrown in, type role, not full bore inf trg. At no time would we have claimed to be inf equivalent
     
  7. 'The reason for this is the time taken for the whole chain of command to conduct the dull range of infantry career courses and gain sufficient experience' - brave coward

    A great Freudian slip or a very witty hidden gem?
     
  8. The obvious problems are numbers and rank structure.

    An RA Rgt has a lot less men than an Inf Bn but similar numbers of officers and SNCOs.

    So to convert an RA Rgt to an infantry Bn you have to recruit a lot of Pte soldiers.

    If we are talking about transferring RA pers to Inf, then it will take several Rgt to make one Bn and a lot of the officers/SNCOs will need to be demoted/sacked.
     
  9. Just mong typing should have been full range..., I'm afraid!

    In the same way that you could not turn an infantry Bn into a CR2 regt in a few short months, I would suggest an element of arrogance in claiming that a non-infantry sub-unit can become a fully effective infantry Coy in the same period. While we are of course all soldiers first, the infantry skill set is beyond the basic soldiering skills (in theory) held by all. A parallel is the oft heard claim that infantry WR commanders could slide straight across to become tank commanders, again the skill set of a tank commander is beyond that of a basic AFV/IFV commander.

    In summary there is a very good reason the army has so many specialised trades (the infantry among them), if everyone could do the job to the same standard we wouldn't need the infantry. I suspect we agree that is not the case.
     
  10. Mr_Fingerz

    Mr_Fingerz LE Book Reviewer


    Really? c250 men per Battery, 4 Batterys to the Regiment = 1000 men plus attachments (REME/RLC/etc)
     
  11. Er I like a bit of fiction as much as the next bloke but this is well OTT. 8 gun SP bty at WE is about 160 all ranks, but the difference in RA between WE and PE is huge, PE is around 100, 6 guns with 6 pers dets. There's also only 3 gun btys per regt, and if there is a 4th non-HQ bty it only has FSTs, at best a very few dozen bodies.

    Then there's the matter of reversion to role. One of the unstated lessons of the 1970s when RA was over-commtted to NI was the drop in gunnery standards when regts were back in role.