"Racism? No such thing, just moaning ethnics, mate"

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by LawyerSquaddie, Nov 17, 2006.

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  1. Oh really?

    Ignorance = fear = hatred = racist tw4ts.
  2. Rascism knows no boundaries. It is amazing how many people think that Sikhs are muslims and are very ignorant of the fact that the Sikhs were loyal soldiers of the crown.
  3. As a slight aside. Why are Sikhs not allowed to cut their hair?
  4. Makes my blood boil.

    Racism, including references to Sikhs as OBL/Taliban, deters many young Sikhs from following their ancestors into our Army.
  5. Tiffy,

    As I understand it, Sikhs keep their hair long for the following reasons:

    1. traditionally, Indian holy men kept their hair as a sign of the acceptance of God's will; and

    2. more significantly, it is a part of the distinctive '5Ks uniform' for the 'Khalsa' (the 'saint-soldiers') - the Sikh army formed in 1699 to defend against the Mughal empire's oppression of non-Muslims.

    Good overview sources:

    Sikhism; and

    BBC - Sikhism

    Hope this helps.
  6. Strange comparison between Sikhs and Muslims there me Old China. Had it been a Muslim would he have been fair game in your opinion?
  7. Cheers LS. This is copied from the BBC page:

    Kesh - uncut hair
    Various reasons and symbolisms have been put forward for the Sikh practice of keeping hair uncut.

    Throughout history hair(kesh) has been regarded as a symbol both of holiness and strength.
    One's hair is part of God's creation. Keeping hair uncut indicates that one is willing to accept God's gift as God intended it.
    Uncut hair symbolizes adoption of a simple life, and denial of pride in one's appearance.
    Not cutting one's hair is a symbol of one's wish to move beyond concerns of the body and attain spiritual maturity.
    A Sikh should only bow his head to the Guru, and not to a barber.
    It is a highly visible symbol of membership of the group.
    It follows the appearance of Guru Gobind Singh, founder of the Khalsa.
    Sikh women are just as forbidden to cut any body hair or even trim their eyebrows, as Sikh men are forbidden to trim their beards.

    Before you ask: A Sikh is not allowed to cut hair from any part of the body.
  8. No mention of what Colour the attackers were, it's a basic recogintion factor after all, odd that :?
  9. Rayc

    Rayc RIP

    Guru Gobind Singh, the tenth Guru of the Sikhs, formed the Khalsa (“the Pure,” from the Persian khalisah, also meaning “pure”). He is accredited with the bestowing on the Sikhs their warriorlike tradition. It was done to fight against the increasing and oppressive Mughal tyranny of the time.

    He made the Sikh embrace the “Five Ks”—kes or kesh (uncut hair), kangha (comb), kacch (short trousers), kara (steel bracelet), and kirpan (double-edged dagger)—did not become an obligation of all Sikhs until the establishment of the Singh Sabha, a religious and educational reform movement of the late 19th and the early 20th century.

    The practical reasons were basically to ensure that Sikhs were always ready for battle.

    By having distinctive hair, no Sikh could flee from battle since he would be recognised and be seen as a coward. Therefore, none fled.

    By having long hair, no time was wasted in visiting the barber and the kangha ensured that his hair and beard was always neat. The kara and kirpan were weapons and the kaccha ensured that he has some clothing on even if surprised!

    The above is one of the views as to why the Sikhs follow the five Ks.
  10. Sikhs, by and large, aren't the greatest fans of muslims.
  11. "the victim was subjected to verbal racial abuse by four young white males and then punched and kicked to the ground."
  12. Just goes to show that the majority of Sikhs are the same as the majority of Christians then. Just follow those bits of the religion that you feel like.

    How many Sikhs with untrimmed beards have you ever seen?
  13. I think we heard it the first time.
  14. You may have heard it Biscuits. Some, it would seem, did not.
  15. Rayc

    Rayc RIP

    They have been in the vanguard in the fight against Mughal tryranny.

    Just two examples to indicate as to why the aren't the great friends historically.


    After Aurangzeb's death, his successor Bahadur Shah I tried to reduce the conflict as the Deccan wars had extended the Mughal armies. He tried to negotiate with the disaffected parties, including the Marathas and the Sikhs. Guru Gobind Singh went to Nanded in Maharashtra to discuss with Bahadur Shah. While camped there he was stabbed in the chest by two muslims from the Mughal army who came to see him on the pretext of offering him a gift. He survived inititially but eventually the wound reopened and he died in Nanded.

    Even though Guru Nanak had refused to wear the sacred thread when he was young, the Gurus still believed in the freedom of religion and the right of the Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs to live in peace and practice their own religions. With this Guru Tegh Bahadur laid down the gauntlet in the fight for freedom of religion and told the Pandits to inform Aurangzeb that the Brahmins would gladly accept and embrace Islam if Guru Tegh Bahadur can be convinced to do so. Guru Tegh Bahadur made preparations to leave for Delhi. he bid farewell to his family and followers and dictated that his son Gobind Rai should be installed as the next Guru. Accompanying the Guru on his journey and also prepared to accept the consequences of whatever happened were Bhai Mati Das, Bhai Dyala and Bhai Sati Das. As soon as Aurangzeb heard the news he ordered the immediate arrest of the Guru. Guru Tegh Bahadur and his party were arrested soon after they left Anandpur Sahib and taken in chains to Delhi.

    When brought before Aurangzeb, he was asked why he was hailed as the Guru or prophet and called �Sacha Padsah� (the True King) and if he really believed in his being one he should perform a miracle to justify his claim. Guru Tegh Bahadur reprimanded the emperor for his blind orthodoxy and his persecution of other faiths, �Hinduism may not be my faith, and I may believe not in the supremacy of Veda or the Brahmins, nor in idol worship or caste or pilgrimages and other rituals, but I would fight for the right of all Hindus to live with honour and practice their faith according to their own rites.� The Guru answered further, �Every ruler of the world must pass away, but not the Word of God or His Saint. This is how people not only call me a True King but have done so through the two centuries before me in respect of my House and also in respect of others who preceded them and identified themselves not with the temporal and the contingent, but with the eternal and the ever dying.� The Guru refused to perform any miracles saying, �this is the work of charlatans and mountebanks to hoodwink the people. Men of God submit ever to the Will of God.� Guru Tegh Bahadur refused to embrace Islam, saying �For me, there is only one religion - of God - and whosoever belongs to it, be he a Hindu or a Muslim, him I own and he owns me. I neither convert others by force, nor submit to force, to change my faith.� Aurangzeb was enraged and ordered Guru Tegh Bahadur to be forced to convert to Islam through torture or be killed.

    Guru Tegh Bahadur was subjected to many cruelties, he was kept in an iron cage and starved for many days. The Guru was made to watch as Bhai Mati Das the devoted Sikh was tied between two pillars and his body split in two by being sawn alive. Bhai Dyala was boiled alive in a cauldron of boiling water and Bhat Sati Das was wrapped in cotton wool and set on fire. The Guru bore these cruelties without flinching or showing any anger or distress. Finally on November 11, 1675 Guru Tegh Bahadur was publicly beheaded with the sword of the executioner as he prayed. The Gurus body was left in the dust as no one dared to pick up the body for fear of the emperors reprisal. A severe storm swept through the city and under the cover of darkness a Sikh named Bhai Jaita managed to collect the Guru�s sacred head and carried it off to Anandpur Sahib to the Guru�s son. Another Sikh Bhai Lakhi Shah who had a cart, was able to smuggle the Gurus headless body to his house. Since a public funeral would be too dangerous, Bhai Lakhi Shah cremated the body by setting his house on fire. Meanwhile the head was taken to the grief stricken young Guru Gobind Singh and the widow Mata Gujari. On November 16, 1675 at Anandpur Sahib, a pyre of sandalwood was constructed, sprinkled with roses and the head of Guru Tegh Bahadur was cremated by young Guru Gobind Singh.


    There are many more such event in history including the walling up alive of one of the Guru's two sons!