Question on the V Engagement.

#1
Hi
have been sent a letter from unit asking if I would like to change Engagement from Open to the new V eng. I have asked the question about Pensions a few times via the RAO but get vague answers. Question would I have to change my Pension from the old to the new pension arrangement if I opted to change to the V eng?

Thanks in advance.

thesunjock
 
#2
No, you can stay on AFPS 75.
 
#3
No you wouldn't have to change but to be honest it would be a bonus if you could.

For those who opt for Veng the AFPS 05 is the best option, as long as you really want to do the full whack.

You will now have to remain on 75 (if that was your choice) and watch those that went onto 05 get 10's of thousands more than you.
 
#6
THESUNJOCK said:
Thanks for that, AFPS 75 sounds a better option in my point of view.
It is, as long as you don't stay until 55. I am in the same boat right now. When OTT came out I had 2 years to do and was told there was no chance of LSL/Continunce/Veng etc, I was even told, as many others were, that we had too many of my particular trade (pilot) and that the chances of staying in past 22 were nil.

I made my decision on OTT based purely on info given and opted to stay on 75.

Since that time I have been offered LSL, Continuance and now Veng!!!!!

I'm relatively happy with my lot and had I known this was coming (or even had an inkling) then I would have obviously opted for 05. The difference in my case on todays money is £20k on my lump sum and about £3k a year in pension. Not to be sniffed at.

I am beginning to wonder wether the possibilities of Veng were purposely kept back from us older types in order to make sure we stayed on 75, saving an absolute fortune in the long term. The more i think about it the clearer it seems to be the case.
 
#7
Pocoyo said:
No you wouldn't have to change but to be honest it would be a bonus if you could.

For those who opt for Veng the AFPS 05 is the best option, as long as you really want to do the full whack.

You will now have to remain on 75 (if that was your choice) and watch those that went onto 05 get 10's of thousands more than you.
Why would it benefit you that much if you had changed to 05. :?

I was looking at doing VENG up to 2012 (due to get out 2010) so would leave at 42 then get my gratuity. Surely staying on 75 would be more beneficial or is there something I missed. Confusing.
 
#8
The_IRON said:
Pocoyo said:
No you wouldn't have to change but to be honest it would be a bonus if you could.

For those who opt for Veng the AFPS 05 is the best option, as long as you really want to do the full whack.

You will now have to remain on 75 (if that was your choice) and watch those that went onto 05 get 10's of thousands more than you.
Why would it benefit you that much if you had changed to 05. :?

I was looking at doing VENG up to 2012 (due to get out 2010) so would leave at 42 then get my gratuity. Surely staying on 75 would be more beneficial or is there something I missed. Confusing.
It only makes a difference if you stay for the 37 year career. In your case 75 is the best option (by a long way)
 
#9
Pocoyo said:
The_IRON said:
Pocoyo said:
No you wouldn't have to change but to be honest it would be a bonus if you could.

For those who opt for Veng the AFPS 05 is the best option, as long as you really want to do the full whack.

You will now have to remain on 75 (if that was your choice) and watch those that went onto 05 get 10's of thousands more than you.
Why would it benefit you that much if you had changed to 05. :?

I was looking at doing VENG up to 2012 (due to get out 2010) so would leave at 42 then get my gratuity. Surely staying on 75 would be more beneficial or is there something I missed. Confusing.
It only makes a difference if you stay for the 37 year career. In your case 75 is the best option.
Cheers mate, didnt think they'd put a pension scheme out that would benefit us all :wink: Dont think Id opt for 37 year service though thats at least another 12 tours in this current climate. :x
 
#10
The_IRON said:
Pocoyo said:
No you wouldn't have to change but to be honest it would be a bonus if you could.

For those who opt for Veng the AFPS 05 is the best option, as long as you really want to do the full whack.

You will now have to remain on 75 (if that was your choice) and watch those that went onto 05 get 10's of thousands more than you.
Why would it benefit you that much if you had changed to 05. :?

I was looking at doing VENG up to 2012 (due to get out 2010) so would leave at 42 then get my gratuity. Surely staying on 75 would be more beneficial or is there something I missed. Confusing.
Same here :wink: best on the 75. but im sure your right about the buggers holding the info back on us oldies, you just have to look at the way the brown letter policy was used/abused to nagate the pension commitments. :roll:
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#11
THESUNJOCK said:
Hi
have been sent a letter from unit asking if I would like to change Engagement from Open to the new V eng. I have asked the question about Pensions a few times via the RAO but get vague answers. Question would I have to change my Pension from the old to the new pension arrangement if I opted to change to the V eng?

Thanks in advance.

thesunjock
The reason you get vague answers is that half of these c*nts employed in that role haven't a clue what they are talking about and rather than tell you that they don't know...they waffle. You're sometimes better off collaring one of the Sgts.

Mate of mine is on it, he stayed with the old scheme but couldn't care less if he loses out in the end, as he is on £40k plus right now, and wouldn't expect to be anywhere near that as a civvy if he took his pension now and did one.

Do it for the money mate. Guaranteed income. You know it makes sense.
 
#12
Biscuits_AB said:
THESUNJOCK said:
Hi
have been sent a letter from unit asking if I would like to change Engagement from Open to the new V eng. I have asked the question about Pensions a few times via the RAO but get vague answers. Question would I have to change my Pension from the old to the new pension arrangement if I opted to change to the V eng?

Thanks in advance.

thesunjock
The reason you get vague answers is that half of these c*nts employed in that role haven't a clue what they are talking about and rather than tell you that they don't know...they waffle. You're sometimes better off collaring one of the Sgts.

Mate of mine is on it, he stayed with the old scheme but couldn't care less if he loses out in the end, as he is on £40k plus right now, and wouldn't expect to be anywhere near that as a civvy if he took his pension now and did one.

Do it for the money mate. Guaranteed income. You know it makes sense.
Fcuking hell Biccies youve got your sensible head on tonight, as you say though its better for us older ones to stay on 75. I was offered a decent job in civvy street the other month but when you weigh up how much pension and the possibility of V Eng decided that its a lot to lose when so close.
 
#13
Hi
interesting point I am in a similar situation last year opted for the 75 pension as i would be leaving at my 22 point ,that was the best choice at the time, given the limited advice . I applied for LSL and was basically told you have 2 hopes.As if by magic having put the LSL totally to the back of my mind (and completed resettlement) i have been offered a further 5 years on LSL. My questions are will I now be offered VENG and if so does that make me re-employable and postable back in my mainstream Corps(they weren't interested in me after 22 years in a continuance post), and if a lot more guys are now being offered VENG up to 37 years will ,should they now have the option to change pensions again (i think not). My view at the moment is that i have just completed all my resettlement as long as i keep myself cuurent i will do at least another 2 years LSL re qualify for resettlement and do the next level up,whilst (lets be honest ) filling a LSL which is not the most difficult job in the world, knowing that i have the 22 year pension in the bag all i will do now is take 35k a year and increase my pension.
 
#14
I Have Just had the VENG Brief today and my understanding is as follows:

1. If you have more then 9 years to go before your 22 year piont then you have the automatic right to transfer over to VENG. If you change your mind you still can sign off at 21 Years and still get a full Pension at 22 years (You need to give 1 years Notice to get out of the army).

2. If you have less then 9 Years then you will need to sit on a Unit board then a Divisional board. You will also need to have a clean (???) record. All applicants should find out the results by 24/25 Oct 07.

3. All personal on LSL or Continuance you will need to apply for VENG as they are being discontinued. This will also mean that they will become eligible for operational tours if there skill set was required!!!!.

4. I have got a hand out about (but left it at work) which has a help line number on it.

5. I hope this has been of use to people.
 
#15
Cheers for that Madpad, hopefully the roadshows coming to Colchester in the next monthor so. At least I have a few years left so will watch the guinnea pigs over the next year and see. I bet there are some Senior Recruiters and estate Wardens on LSL a bit worried now with possible tours :roll:
 
#16
At what stage are they offering the V-Eng
Ive got 4 years left and was wondering if it'll be sooner rather than later
 
#17
Taken straight from the horse's mouth...

Introduction. Since the previous issue of this bulletin in June 06, the detailed implementation plan of the Versatile Engagement (VEng) has been endorsed by the Army Policy and Resources Committee (APRC). All Arms and Service Directors (A&SD) and the Army Personnel Centre (APC) Glasgow remain fully engaged in the process.

Structure. Soldiers will initially enlist on a Short Career (Stage 1) for 12 years service. During that time, they will be considered for conversion to a Full Career (Stage 2) and service to a total of 24 years. Selection for a Long Career (Stage 3) will extend the soldier’s service to 30 years initially, and thereafter in 6 year blocks as required by the Army and up to the Normal Retirement Age (NRA) of 55 years where appropriate. The Long Service List (LSL) will be filled by regular soldiers on a VEng Long career.

Transfer to the VEng. The VEng will replace the Open Engagement (OPENG) for all regular recruits due to start Phase 1 Training on or after 01 Jan 08. Soldiers already serving on that date will remain on their current engagements, unless offered the option of transferring to the VEng Full (24years) or Long Career (30 years). To be considered for conversion from one stage to the next, a soldier must meet certain criteria laid down by both the Army and their A&SD. Those who are eligible will be graded in direct competition with each other, and the best soldiers above the quality line will be offered the vacancies on the next career stage.

Career Management. Whilst serving on VEng, soldiers will enter a Conversion Zone (CZ), during which those that meet the relevant criteria will be considered for conversion to the Full or Long Career. Soldiers eligible for conversion will be graded against their peers to identify those above the quality line and the number to be selected for conversion will be dictated by the manning requirement identified within their capbadge. Individuals will be made an offer to convert and must accept it before their service is extended accordingly. Each Arm and service has decided upon the CZs that best meets the needs of the capbadge balanced with the need of the individual. These CZ fall within the constraints of the following Pan Army guideline:

•CZ from Short to Full Career is from 3 to 10 years service.
•CZ from Full to Long Career is after 3 years service (from conversion) up to 22 years service.
•Individuals will be considered for extensions of the Long Career after 1 year (from conversion) and up to 2 years before their current Run-Out Date.

A soldier will not be considered for conversion whilst on either continued service (under VEng ToS) or in the last 2 years of service.

Residual Service. The Residual Service rule relating to soldier promotion will still apply. This will require a soldier to have 12 months of service remaining from the start of the promotion year, in order to be eligible for substantive promotion. If selected the individual will be granted continuance in order to complete 2 years in their new rank.
VEng Terms of Service (ToS).

Key points:

•Recruits will have a Discharge As Of A Right (DAOR) period.
•Service and pension dates will start from the 1st day of paid duty (ie start of Phase 1 training).
•The Unhappy Under 18 Scheme will remain.
•Minimum Commitment will remain at 4 years (from the end of the DAOR period).
•12 months notice to terminate will be required at all points on the VEng.
•The soldier will receive a minimum of 12 months notice of either discharge (after not converting to the next stage) or the offer of continued service.
•The soldier on continued service will not be eligible for conversion to the next stage, or promotion.

Pensions. The VEng structure is tied to the provisions of both pension schemes (AFPS 75 and 05). This ensures that the soldier who is discharged at the end of a short or full career, will have reached either the Resettlement Grant (12 years) or an Early Departure Payment point if on AFPS 05 (between 18 and 24 years service), or the Immediate Pension of AFPS 75 (22 years).

Further Information. Implementation of the VEng is now underway, with respective A&SD planning the details for their transition to the new engagement. Specific questions on offers to transfer and conversion zones should be addressed to your relevant A&SD. The VEng Defence Instruction Notice (DIN) will be published in July 07.

Questions can be addressed to Director of Manning (Army)
 
#18
An intresting point about security and civvy wages etc. I realise every individuals circumstances vary and it depends on what trade/s you may have behind you, but in general guys I would say, dont sell yourselves short in terms of what you can earn in civvy street. The 22 year pension is a nice addon on to any civvy salary, plus lest not discount the lump sum. In addition to that, if you are wise, you are investing in a second pension scheme once you have left. the Army pension is good, but doesn't increase as sharply after 22. If you can look at retiring at 55 then thats great, but if not, its harder to get a job at 55 than it is 40. For my first 2 years out I worked as a contractor, and that is big bucks (75K year 1, 94K year 2) even now I have settled down as a permy, my salary with my army pension is 44K, plus Private Health Care, Company Pension etc. Its really not that hard to get that middle management type job after 22 years.
 
#19
This morning, i have just had a phone call offering me the option to transfer to the V Eng, i currently have exactly 2 months left for my 22 and am on my resettlement, what will be the rules on resettlement, if i decide to do 2 more years, which they are currently offering me?

Sparky
 
#20
Sparky, it isn't just an extra 2 years, that is just to make you eligible for a further 6 years on veng which you should be offered very soon. You will be re-entitled to resettlement.


Edited to add.....but just because I'm telling you that doesn't mean I don't agree with every single point that IT-geek has made.
 

Latest Threads

Top