QA entry rank

#1
I am still waiting on attestation but want to get a move on with training as soon as possible.

On previous visits to TA units I was told that experienced RN's (I am qualified > 20 years) tended to enter as Captain but am now being told I am more likely to enter as a 2nd Lt.

Because I am currently working as an agency nurse to give myself the time and flexibility to do the training necessary to deploy I need to have a clear answer so I can decide whether to continue with my application. At the level of 2Lt pay it's not going to be economically viable, TA pay will not be extra pay for me, it will be what I live on. Any guidance on current regulations for entry rank as the recruiting team seem unclear in the unit I am joining.

Many thanks.
 
#2
You should be able to find this out from your recruiting unit, but I think QA'a start at 2Lt. You get seniority, backdated as it were, for previous experience, but I don't think extra rank usually comes into it.

That said, if you had a required sub-specialist nursing skill (say neuro-rehab, or similar), it might be different.

If a TA 2Lt's pay is not enough for you to live on (with no other civvy income), why not join as a regular and save a considerable part of your cost of living? You're already working agency in preparation for deployment (and you're not even attested yet! wow).


FF.
 
#3
Moaning about not getting straight to captain? Hmm this is the British Army you are talking about?.........right? The way i understand it, on sucessfull completion of selection and training, you are promoted to the lofty height of 2nd Lt, then once you have put in some work (no jokes from please) you are promoted to Lt after about six months onwards and then a a year or so after that Captain. Oh, and you shouldnt join for the money, its not that good, well unless you are happy being compensated with a tan and some sand
 
#4
Thanks FF - i'm 44 - not going to be a regular
bnb - it's clarity I'm after - not moaning, asking - on at least 4 previous visits to units over the last 6 years have been told that experienced nurses can expect to come in as a captain, now the story's changed. It's something I'm keen to do and am willing to make sacrifices (already am doing), but there are limits. I'm not doing it for the money, that would be silly as you quite rightly say. But the bills need to be paid. If anyone has something definitive on the subject or access to regs I'd be grateful.
 
#5
Are you attesting, or going before a commissioning board?

If you're attesting, then your unit may be bringing you in as an OR nurse. Give me a day or two and I'll get the definitive answer on the commisioning thing.
 
#6
If you have been qualified in excess of 6 years, as I see you have, then you will be commisioned as a capt. you will be put somewhere suitable on the pay ladder - perhaps as a three or five year Captain.

At the interview - ask lots of questions to demonstrate that you are keen and eager, such as - what point will I be on the pay band!!

good luck and enjoy
 
#8
Thanks Bedpan2zero - that's the other version I had heard
Not that I take it for granted - I just need something reasonably firm to plan on and things seem to be in a state of flux these days if Arsse is anything to go by
Whatever happens, I'm going to do it (assuming I keep getting over the hurdles), I want to be deployed and get all I can out of it, the amount I can put in will be dictated by ££££'s to some extent though

Thanks again
 
#9
you'll wear those lovely white tabs until all the paperwork is done, but youll go to Sandhurst as a Capt!

good luck


youre Reg Nursing Officer should be feeding you plenty info - if not - Ill have a word in her shell like for ya
 
#10
Thanks again! Fingers crossed!

Should be attested next week and then can get more info one to one in the unit
 
#11
Friendly_Fire said:
That's a bit of an ambitious timescale. You can't do the PQO until after your commissioning, you can't be commissioned until after your pre-commissioning (SUPC?) courses, and you can't do them until you're attested.
Didn't I say so? ;)

Edited by accident!
 
#12
As I say I'm not taking anything for granted as everything seems to be in flux. I am relying on the unit ROSO who assures me that he can place me on PQO in April (as long as I don't mind doing it as an OCdt), but then nothing I have heard has yet happened as initially intended so .... Fingers crossed!

Thanks, FF - good luck to you too
 
#13
Lawnt, just out of interest and completely off topic, what is the relevance of the Shropshire crest when you are in Co. Down. Are you originally a Shropshire Lad/Lass??
 
#15
Lawnt said:
As I say I'm not taking anything for granted as everything seems to be in flux. I am relying on the unit ROSO who assures me that he can place me on PQO in April (as long as I don't mind doing it as an OCdt), but then nothing I have heard has yet happened as initially intended so .... Fingers crossed!

Thanks, FF - good luck to you too
Well, you live and learn. I didn't realise you could do the PQO course as an O/Cdt. They didn't offer me that option, anyway.

FF.
 
#16
I visited a ward at Haslar where the OIC was a young Captain who was nice but appeared a bit clumsy. As a result the RNs around her ranging from Sgt to WO felt patronised and humiliated.

I am not a nurse but I sympathise with Nursing Officers in that they are AMS PQO Officers who have to command soldiers who are qualified to do their job. Doctors, Vets and Dentists don't experience this and so their lot is easier.

The commissioning rationale in the AMS is up its aarse!!!!! As are CRs, OJARs and promotion boards for all ranks.

My advice...............worry about the rank and the money!
 
#17
suspect you maybe starting a whole other thread there trousersnake (trousersnake? are you sure you want to call yourself that?)

At present I have no idea about the politics of how AMS works (other than generally) - I do know that I want to be involved in what the AMS does. I bring 27 years health care experience as clinician, researcher, manager, leader, educator, facilitator and author at all levels from auxiliary to senior member of university staff. I have no doubt that I am qualified and credible. My main concern is that I am not seriously out of pocket. I know I will be earning less than I have in the past, that is a trade off I am happy to make to do something different that promises diversity and well, sand.

The rank system may be very evident in the Army but believe me the NHS is also full of people, qualified and unqualified who feel they could do the jobs of those paid more than them. After all this time I have come to the conclusion that we have to deal with our own shoulder chips and do our best to do our jobs with integrity, put the people we care for first and do our best to contribute to an environment in which others can do the same. That's what I try and do and it's how I will use whatever position I may get with the AMS.
 
#18
LtTrousersnake said:
I visited a ward at Haslar where the OIC was a young Captain who was nice but appeared a bit clumsy. As a result the RNs around her ranging from Sgt to WO felt patronised and humiliated.

I am not a nurse but I sympathise with Nursing Officers in that they are AMS PQO Officers who have to command soldiers who are qualified to do their job. Doctors, Vets and Dentists don't experience this and so their lot is easier.

The commissioning rationale in the AMS is up its aarse!!!!! As are CRs, OJARs and promotion boards for all ranks.

My advice...............worry about the rank and the money!
you'll probably find that the poor little Captain was out qualified by the SNCOs around her - and it may have been her first posting as an Officer

It is a test of character - and really is a test of her ability as an Officer to 'get a grip' of the situation
 
#19
Lawnt said:
suspect you maybe starting a whole other thread there trousersnake (trousersnake? are you sure you want to call yourself that?)

At present I have no idea about the politics of how AMS works (other than generally) - I do know that I want to be involved in what the AMS does. I bring 27 years health care experience as clinician, researcher, manager, leader, educator, facilitator and author at all levels from auxiliary to senior member of university staff. I have no doubt that I am qualified and credible. My main concern is that I am not seriously out of pocket. I know I will be earning less than I have in the past, that is a trade off I am happy to make to do something different that promises diversity and well, sand.

The rank system may be very evident in the Army but believe me the NHS is also full of people, qualified and unqualified who feel they could do the jobs of those paid more than them. After all this time I have come to the conclusion that we have to deal with our own shoulder chips and do our best to do our jobs with integrity, put the people we care for first and do our best to contribute to an environment in which others can do the same. That's what I try and do and it's how I will use whatever position I may get with the AMS.
I take your point re your experience and that I may have touched a nerve. I apologise for this. I was making a candid comment about the Army as I see it. There are many problems in our frim, some worse than others. It is also true that the door is open to leave through and we who are still in have voluntarily chosen not to exit via said door! This means that we all (me included) share a common sense of purpose and wish to be part of the AMS.

There is a lot of frustration around, in the NHS and the DMS but sites like ARRS allow us to vent our frustrations mostly in a light hearted way.

No offence intended!
 
#20
no problem Trousersnake

the AMS is a little micro-culture - things happen that wouldnt dare in the big army

such as a SSgt and a Sgt pulling a new Lt into the office to point out, in no uncertain terms, the error of his ways!! top drills

try that in an Inf Regt - gowd help ya
 

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