PTSD - Calling the bluffs

#21
Well, after a brief chat with the defence barrister he says,

Generally PTSD comes up as a mitigation in violence court cases

Courts look very leniently sentencing cases where PTSD is presented as a mitigation,

in violence cases this is validated with report/diagnosis from a psychiatrist.

Apparently it’s a fairly standard tool to reduce a sentence

I suppose the question is, are the psychiatrists used to confirm a diagnosis doing a proper job or looking at a history putting two and two together , multiplying by what an offender “adds into the mix” and getting PTSD
 
#22
@dingerr,
The military reject those that are not physically fit, and train those that are selected to the required physical standards to carry out their role. They do not do the same with regard to mental robustness/fitness. They are starting to get there with things like Amputee actors for more realistic first aid training, but that only goes some way to preparing you for a No Duff incident.

I know one guy (ex chunky) with PTSD, who didn't cope well with exhuming bodies from Bosnian mass graves, I guess having kids bodies fall apart as you attempt to pick them up is a bit difficult to train for.

You have been through a very traumatic experience which would be a PTSD trigger for most people, but I'm guessing your EOD and CIED training helped you rationalise what happened.
Is that R** S*******m?
 
#23
As if by magic:

None unless PROPERLY evidenced and clearly relevant to the crime and/or sentence.

Yes, one of many cards played.

Cards rarely work and often piss off the bench. The vast, vast majority of offenders have some form of life issues: MH, crap upbringing, addictions, brain injuries. Or all of the above unfortunately.
I’ll refer you to my last paragraph, are the professional getting it right or just piling up the mess below

form of life issues: MH, crap upbringing, addictions, brain injuries. Or all of the above unfortunately

Adding military service and making PTSD

You don’t need the brains of an archbishop to reel off a list of symptom related to PTSD. I suppose this is the problem with psychiatry it’s based mainly on history taking which is provided by the patient
 
#24
Excellent topic & i see your point Dingerr but i think i agree with many of the other posters. I don't think you can isolate one 'form' of PTSD from the rest, its a very individual thing.
I remember a couple of years ago something about RAF drone pilots having MH issues (too early to diagnose PTSD) due to the work they were doing offing Talibs & seeing the imagery. I was a bit sceptical & said so but who am I to judge. I got diagnosed a fair few years ago so I suppose I felt a bit, 'if you haven't had rounds flying over your head or been up close & personal in a blood & gore site you can't have PTSD' about it. That was wrong.
I've got a mate who worked in the QE2 hospital for a fair while. He ended up broken seeing all the lads & lasses coming in from Telic & Herrick. Was diagnose & had to leave the job cos of the effect it was having on him. Again I struggled to understand that but if its looked at by a pro & thats the diagnosis then fair one.
 
#25
Back in 2016 the Guardian printed this article questioning many PTSD claims.

Many military veterans' PTSD claims 'fabricated or exaggerated'

The following American article is circa the same period

Why I’m Skeptical Of PTSD Claims… And Why You Should Be Too • The Havok Journal


I remember both articles and they were derided by many, often by those who have no comprehension of the seriousness of people with exaggerated claims and the damage it does to genuine sufferers.

The Havok journal article is doing the rounds again, especially amongst the injured community, but this time it appears to be more readily accepted, even applauded in some areas.

It’s an emotive subject, often leading to arguments, my own opinion is that we need to separate PTSD and combat stress (battle stress, sheep shock, whatever term seems most appropriate), from the stresses and strains of every day life.

Undoubtedly I’m going to cop flak for this, but in my opinion, if you have PTSD as a result of anything that can be encountered in everyday life, such as an RTA, growing up issues or just because you lack the mental robustness to be a member of the British Forces, then don’t put yourself on a par, or demand the same treatment as those who genuinely suffer as a result of their service.

I’m not alone in this opinion.

It’s about time there was a full and frank discussion about this, but with honesty and not abuse.

PTSD is the new Dyslexia, hadn't you heard?
 
#26
I’ll refer you to my last paragraph, are the professional getting it right or just piling up the mess below

form of life issues: MH, crap upbringing, addictions, brain injuries. Or all of the above unfortunately

Adding military service and making PTSD

You don’t need the brains of an archbishop to reel off a list of symptom related to PTSD. I suppose this is the problem with psychiatry it’s based mainly on history taking which is provided by the patient
I’m not qualified to comment on the competence of MH diagnostics but agree that it is easy to google PTSD and other MH symptoms. The judiciary will sentence on the evidence, not just ‘but, but, but...’ from the dock and the number of excuses used to attempt to justify crap behaviour/decisions is almost infinite. However, unless an offender is actually unfit for trial they are generally held responsible for their choices and decisions.
 
#27
I can easily see the mental logic:

I made them MFD.
Because they were MFD they went to HERRICK.
Because they went to HERRICK they were blown up and injured.
Thus, if I hadn't made them MFD then they wouldn't have gone to HERRICK and wouldn't have been injured.
Thus it is my fault that they are injured (missing out several steps of logic).

It is what it is.

I presume many on here have either have PTSD, or know someone close to them with it. They know how hellish it can be. Would you want to condemn your friend, loved one or yourself to that torment because it wasn't the "correct" PTSD?
I cant see where its PTSD though -

Im not disputing the woman has serious feelings of guilt and its resulted in a mental health issue for her - My comment is intended in no way to demean or lessen her problems.

Im just not seing the Trauma aspect as it applies to her, - I would say the same of for example an aircraft mechanic who signed off a passenger jet which subsequently crashed - Mental health issues arising from feelings of guilt / responsibility stress etc yes and support needed - just not sure a PTSD label is really applicable.

I think this goes back to what the gimp and others have said - PTSD is used as a catchall rather than really address issues.

Edit to correct frogenese spelling that had snuck through
 
Last edited:
#28
Causes

according to the NHS, it can be caused by a very stressful incident, not just a traumatic one. It can also have physical roots apparently.

I know of people who have PTSD who never 'experienced' trauma, yet have clinically diagnosed (by the military) PTSD.
 
#30
Think the difference is the duration being under fire for 6 months and suffering emotional / physical harm equals to same in an abuse situation - isn't the same as being in a car crash and one term PTSD fits all hats
So does that mean that someone who was under fire for six months is less real than someone else in a similarly stressful situation in civvy street for a year or two?

Lots of things can lead to PTSD, not just military events or sudden/short events.

I will add that in the last year or two I have found that mention of military service has led various NHS professionals to jump straight to an army related PTSD assumption, this has been quite frustrating.
During conversations with health professionals the mere mention of PTSD has brought the response 'did you get that in the army' on three occasions.
I was once also referred to the RBLfor support before I'd even given many details!
 
Last edited:
#32
@dingerr

I echo your viewpoints on this sensitive & emotive subject, have you been in contact with the consultants at the recently opened Stanford Hall?




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
No. To be honest I found the military’s attempts at providing support for mental health woeful.

I wouldn’t have access now that I am ex service.
 
#33
So does that mean that someone who was under fire for six months is less real than someone else in a similarly stressful situation in civvy street for a year or two?

Lots of things can lead to PTSD, not just military events or sudden/short events.

I will add that in the last year or two I have found that mention of military service has led various NHS professionals to jump straight to an army related PTSD assumption, this has been quite frustrating.
During conversations with health professionals the mere mention of PTSD has brought the response 'did you get that in the army' on three occasions.
I was once also referred to the RBLfor support before I'd even given many details!

This is precisely the thing that needs sorting. The right diagnosis followed by appropriate treatment.
 
#34
I read a very interesting study once which concluded that para or commando trained personnel were much less likely to develop any kind of mental health issue, particularly ptsd, as a result of combat. On my phone and away from home for a while so can't link.
Any ideas why that might be?
 
#35
We have a friend of the family / grand kids, who was allegedly bullied at school growing up. She has issues and went to special school although she is on the high intelligence side of autism spectrum. She says she has been diagnosed PTSD, and at one point was applying for a disability dog to help.

No doubt it’s a huge issue with many facets, and the catch all PTSD doesn’t really cover it.
 
#36
I read a very interesting study once which concluded that para or commando trained personnel were much less likely to develop any kind of mental health issue, particularly ptsd, as a result of combat. On my phone and away from home for a while so can't link.
Any ideas why that might be?
I suspect it’s because they have a better support structure, look at the commando and airborne ethos and mentality. There’s still plenty of people suffer though.
 
#37
No. To be honest I found the military’s attempts at providing support for mental health woeful.

I wouldn’t have access now that I am ex service.
Headley court (which is obviously relocating to Stanford Hall ) also treated veterans, according to a 2016 BBC article.

When did this cease?

Excuse if slightly out of touch with updates.

Sent from my SM-A500FU using Tapatalk
 
#38
I read a very interesting study once which concluded that para or commando trained personnel were much less likely to develop any kind of mental health issue, particularly ptsd, as a result of combat. On my phone and away from home for a while so can't link.
Any ideas why that might be?
I’ve seen both with PTSD, and SF, it’s not complete protection.
 
#39
Headley court (which is obviously relocating to Stanford Hall ) also treated veterans, according to a 2016 BBC article.

When did this cease?

Excuse if slightly out of touch with updates.

Sent from my SM-A500FU using Tapatalk
It hasn’t cease, it’s just poor.
 
#40
They get the best care available on the NHS, no different from a civilian.

It’s also quite difficult to genuinely bluff cancer.
At least one arrser tried it for a while.
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
chuggafugga The Intelligence Cell 47
ExREME..TECH The NAAFI Bar 72
SandyFrog Armed Forces Pension Scheme 0

Similar threads


Latest Threads

Top