Prisons Exposed (Not sure where this would go)

Discussion in 'The Intelligence Cell' started by soldiers-daughter, Sep 2, 2012.

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  1. My brother in law Michael has written a book called Prisons Exposed and it includes a chapter about veterans in prison and how they are treated.

    Prisons Exposed by Michael O'Brien, published by Y Lolfa

    The book is available direct from the publishers Y Lolfa and from Amazon priced £7.95
  2. CountryGal

    CountryGal LE Book Reviewer

    Theres quite a big book section on here - and lots of reviews too
    You should get in contact with old fat snd hairy and arrange to give arrse a copy to review on here :)

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  3. I could probably write a book about prisoners who said they were veterans but weren't.
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  4. Does the book explain why being a veteran magically makes them less guilty?
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  5. No It explains about those that were suffering from PTSD that were jailed when they should have been treated, which is not neccessarily a failure of the justice system rather a failure of the civvy healthcare system, if these guys had been treated then maybe they would not have gotten themselves in trouble to land them in jail. My brother in law spent 11 years and 43 days in some of Britain's toughest jails for a murder he didnt commit. He was later aquitted and dedicated his life to campaigning for miscarriage of justice victims and families. He changed the law five times and successfully sued two home secretaries. He wrote his first book on his personal story which was released in 2008. The Death of Justice. There is so much misunderstanding about prisons he decided to write his second book about that.
  6. So nothing showing being ex-forces proves they're not guilty?

    If I seem harsh it's because I'm getting fed up of people punting stuff on the back of the current fad for Armed Forces popularity. Squaddies are cut from the same cloth as everyone else and sometimes they commit crimes. I don't see why criminals shouldn't wind up in prison.
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  7. I think this not so much about what they did, more about why they did it.
  8. This is my point. And My brother in law's
  9. Because we're all bally heroes and it's a well known fact that one of the main symptoms of PTSD is to go out and murder or assault people.

    We recently had a bloke who was nicked for public disorder or something similar whilst out on the piss. His girlfriend started screaming at the Police that he was a war hero and had PTSD, he'd never been on tour and if his girlfriend had kept her trap shut the Police probably wouldn't have had to phone camp.

    I'm not detracting from the book, I'm sure the author has taken many stories of claimed ex-servicemen on face value, but without proof of their service I would be skeptical of any claims of service.
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  10. The same as everbody else. Prisons weren't responsible for putting vets in prison - what needs to be addressed (and is being) is the provision of adequate medical care post-service to prevent any clinical condition-based crime.
  11. I can understand why that might interest people, but the same goes for any criminal. Understanding why they did what they did is the key to stopping them doing it again and possibly even preventing others going down the same road. It's no different for ex-mob than for never served.

    Punting a book which " includes a chapter (a whole single chapter!) about veterans in prison and how they are treated" on a forces oriented website strikes me as just a bit opportunist with more eye to sellling copies than explaining the situation of veterans in prison.
  12. To Counter Bluffer Ops, i do believe i have already conceded your point in an earlier post.

    And to smartascarrots yes it may be a little oportunistic, but as I have not read the book I was simply trying to do something nice for my brother in law who has had a tough few months. But then again you have not read the book either so you are hardly one to judge.

    My family is a forces family and we still have members of our family that are on active service, that is why i like this website. I thought that some arrsers may be interested in what this book has to say. But then again maybe all you are interested in is critisising me for a benign post about a book that may or may not do some good in this country.
  13. Agreed about the scepticism. Don't forget, however, that as Jarrod's post shows, quite a number of our prison staff are themselves ex-service and have no difficulty at all in telling the difference between a genuine 'veteran' and a PTSD walt.

    Not to mention that genuine 'veterans' in prison are not necessarily that tolerant of prison 'walts'...

    Not so easy of course to tell the difference between a genuine 'veteran' whose past service has nothing whatsoever to do with his (usually his) crime, and those where it might be relevant.

    Past service issues aren't confined to PTSD. There are less glamorous issues like alcohol abuse, and pre-service factors like abuse in childhood. For some people, the service IS their family - which works as long as they are serving.

    One prison officer suggested to me that a factor in some individuals getting into bad ways was our tendency to operate in "gangs", a tendency which sometimes spills over inappropriately into civilian life.

    A common myth in these discussions is that all these crims are making up or exaggerating their PTSD or whatever in order to get off, or to get their sentences reduced. No doubt it does happen. Past military service would rightly be mentioned in a plea in mitigation after someone has pleaded or been found guilty. Claims of diminished responsibility due to PTSD etc would be examined far more rigorously than that.

    There's more I could say on this. I totally agree with the scepticism. However, it should not deter anyone from shedding light on this particular area.
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  14. I've read your post and can tell from that what a small portion of this book is dedicated to ex-forces in prison, though.

    I don't wish your brother anything but the best but I suspect the public are going to start to suffer from compassion fatigue any minute now and cramming the slightest incidental connection to 'our brave lads' down their necks is only going to hasten that. If it winds up lessening the intention that directly relevant matters receive will it still seem such a good idea?
  15. Define "veteran"? To my knowledge, and I stand to be corrected - The armed forces is the only occupation that has stats collected wrt inmates. What percentage of ex-ASDA employees wind up in jail? We do not know as the stats are not collated. Also, as far as these stats are concerned - anybody who has spent more than 2 minutes in basic is classed as "ex-forces". Now how many prisoners are gonna say: "yeah I was in the army but left after 7 weeks"? They aren't. They will glamourise and the inevitable dodgy knee or freaked out after seeing a mate fragged in "The Ghan" will be slipped into conversation.
    Amazing how so many people in the forces, when pinged for a crime all of a sudden develop PTSD. There is also an industry growing around this. I've said it before - PTSD - it's the new ADHD.

    I stand to be corrected on any of the above.
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