Prisoners to get vote

#1
Just seen on sky news that prisoners are to get the vote. It has been decreed by Europe and therefore it becomes law. If we do not obey the Europe then the government [we the taxpayer] would be fined hundreds of millions of pounds. Creeping control by the EU. Parliament will become redundant in the next 10 years IMHO.
 

rampant

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#3
That depends whether or not the Govt. choose to implement the ruling:

The Council have pointed out that the UK is now “out of step with many other countries. Eighteen European countries have no restrictions on prisoners voting while in France and Germany a decision to disenfranchise a prisoner is left to the courts. In Australia and New Zealand the length of a prisoner’s sentence determines their right to vote. Other countries where prisoners have the right to vote include South Africa, Poland, and Canada
The continued pressure from Europe may finally make a difference to government policy, and the threat of compensation claims will focus minds. However, a change to the law may not be popular with the public, and the Coalition Government may choose to save its energy for more pressing concerns, such as the economy.
Prisoner voting back on the human rights agenda this week « UK Human Rights Blog

It is likely it will be left to the courts to decide on an individual basis, or dependent on the length of sentence, under 4 years was the mooted I believe.
 
#5
There are two issues here: the issue of sovereignty and the question of whether we believe that prisoners should have the vote.

On that second issue, if a prisoner is to be released and we want him/her to become a good member of our society then it must be right that we allow him or her to shape that society through participation in the democratic process.
 
#6
Another example of genuflection to the UNELECTED, UNACCOUNTABLE monster that the 'Traitor' Heath foisted upon us with the greatest lie ever.

When are we going to see the pre General Election promises of RECLAIMING SOVEREIGNTY from Europe being implemented?

If it cannot be done because of the Limp-Dims in the coalition, then call a General Election and ask:

WHO GOVERNS GREAT BRITAIN? PARLIAMENT or FACELESS AND CORRUPT EUROPEAN BUREAUCRATS?

This decision is disgraceful. What about peers? Are they going to seek the right to vote as well? Oh! and lunatics?

Cameron get a grip; you are as simpering a ninny as could ever have been imagined 'leading' the Conservative Party.
 
#7
If you read the story, this was a decision of the European Court of Human Rights, which is:

1. Not part of the EU
2. Something we signed up to after WWII not in 1973
3. Covers Switzerland, Norway, Turkey and plenty of non-EU countries
4. Works on the basis of a Convention on Human Rights drafted by English lawyers after the second world war
5. Is not part of the EU at all in any way.

I don't have a problem with the Court of Human Rights, because I think human rights are a good idea, but if you're worried about national democracy it's actually less democratic than the EU, since EU decisions are taken by a Council of Ministers (all elected Prime Ministers, including ours) and a European Parliament (also elected, every five years, by us). The ECHR on the other hand has a group of unelected judges appointed by the different countries which are part of it.
 
#8
Calm down, calm down. It's nothing to do with the EU. It's the European Court of Human Rights. They are not connected. We are signatories to the European Convention on Human Rights (which was British drafted), which is an international treaty, not an instrument of the European Union.
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
#9
There are two issues here: the issue of sovereignty and the question of whether we believe that prisoners should have the vote.

On that second issue, if a prisoner is to be released and we want him/her to become a good member of our society then it must be right that we allow him or her to shape that society through participation in the democratic process.
Why must it be right? By putting someone in prison, we're not, by definition, allowing them to participate in society - that's the point.
 
#10
I'm talking about rehabilitation. Preparing him for life on the outside. Feeling part of society, willing and able to contribute. Not feeling like a total outsider upon whom society has turned it's back.
 
#11
Which constituency would they be voting in? Princetown, Wandsworth, and Strangeways? I couldn't see the point of it until the weasle word 'compensation' cropped up.

Be honest Schweik, how many prisoners vote when they are at liberty?
 
#12
I'm talking about rehabilitation. Preparing him for life on the outside. Feeling part of society, willing and able to contribute. Not feeling like a total outsider upon whom society has turned it's back.
The criminal is the one who places himself (or herself) out of society by their own voluntary actions. No one forces them to commit crimes, the criminal doesn't worry about the human rights of his victims when he is robbing/raping/murdering etc. THEY are the ones who turn their backs on society with their criminal actions.

Rehabilitation clearly doesn't work anyway as the amount of rapes and murders committed by early released prisoners points out.

Hanging works.... it is 100% effective at preventing reoffending.

What we will see in future is the unedifying spectacle of prospective MP's scrabbling around for the prison vote in their constituencies and no doubt making grubby little promises to their fellow criminal scum.

On another note.... it is also another attack on our democracy by the unaccountable and unelected foreign courts who have no genuine legal rights to tell us how to run our country.

Who the f*ck do these people think they are?
 
#13
I'm talking about rehabilitation. Preparing him for life on the outside. Feeling part of society, willing and able to contribute. Not feeling like a total outsider upon whom society has turned it's back.
Why?

The point that is being made and the one I agree with is the fact that by breaking the law of the society in which you live, you forfeit the rights enjoyed by that society. Voting being one of them. I understand the need to rehabilitate prisoners but why does this involve allowing them the vote? Why should my life be influenced by people who hold no regard for the law (yeah yeah politicians tish tish!)? I want to see prisoners getting less rights not more!
 
#15
I don't mind prisoners being allowed to vote, as long as soldiers don't have to pay council tax when on operations...
 
#16
pericles and Schweik

Thank you correcting my latest rant. I hold the European Court of Human Rights to be a putative infringement of my 'rights' as a Subject of Her Majesty our Sovereign. (Does HM have to curtsey to Adolf von Rumpelstiltskin - 'President' of the non existent State of Europe?)

I thought that Cameron said he would repeal our 'Human Rights Act' (a.k.a - trough for Mrs. Blair). When will this happen?

Having a replacement central heating system installed today, so I am likely to be even more demented come 'gin time'.
 
#18
On that second issue, if a prisoner is to be released and we want him/her to become a good member of our society then it must be right that we allow him or her to shape that society through participation in the democratic process.
When they are released they can regain the right to vote. Not while they are banged up though.
 
#19
So who does the prisoner vote for? Presumably he votes in the constituency in which he's (or she's) incarcerated, in which case where you have two or three prisons grouped together and, given that they're all likely to vote because that will muck the wardens about and take some organising, we're likely to see some very odd candidates elected in some areas. Ronnie Biggs MP anyone?
 
#20
Oh my God - it has finally happened, I'm in agreement with Stacker1! I am all for rehabilitation otherwise why would you let them out of prison ever again? Yet the right to a vote needs to be seen as the cherry on the democratic rights cake. So day one in prison, you explain that if they rehabilitate and do their learning and changing properly - then a vote will be one of the good things awaiting them.

Personally I think universal suffrage is bollocks and votes should be earned and/or awarded.
 

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