Presentable Watches

walrusboy

War Hero
Let me explain. 'Flippers' buy watches that they never intend to wear and sell them to grey market sellers for a profit. Grey market sellers hike up prices and sell them to 'end users', who are people like us who buy watches to wear but who can't always buy them at retail from ADs. The reason for this is in order to buy a high-demand or ultra-high demand watch from an AD, you need a purchase history, i.e. you need to have bought stuff from the AD before, preferably stuff that is hard to sell. If you buy unpopular products you might get on a wait list for a desirable watch such as a Rolex sports watch in steel.

A recent example is a friend who wants to buy a new model Rolex Submariner but he can't get on a wait list because he has no purchase history. The AD agreed that if he bought a Brietling Superocean for over £5k he would put him on a Submariner wait list. The Brietling was worth £3,600 as soon as he walked out of the AD but if he is able to buy a Submariner at Retail (£7,150) it will be worth £12.5k - 13k with box and papers.

I refuse to fuel this market so if I can't get it at retail, I'll pass.
 
Let me explain. 'Flippers' buy watches that they never intend to wear and sell them to grey market sellers for a profit. Grey market sellers hike up prices and sell them to 'end users', who are people like us who buy watches to wear but who can't always buy them at retail from ADs. The reason for this is in order to buy a high-demand or ultra-high demand watch from an AD, you need a purchase history, i.e. you need to have bought stuff from the AD before, preferably stuff that is hard to sell. If you buy unpopular products you might get on a wait list for a desirable watch such as a Rolex sports watch in steel.

A recent example is a friend who wants to buy a new model Rolex Submariner but he can't get on a wait list because he has no purchase history. The AD agreed that if he bought a Brietling Superocean for over £5k he would put him on a Submariner wait list. The Brietling was worth £3,600 as soon as he walked out of the AD but if he is able to buy a Submariner at Retail (£7,150) it will be worth £12.5k - 13k with box and papers.

I refuse to fuel this market so if I can't get it at retail, I'll pass.

Just wait until the recession hits properly and people can't afford to flip watches and that Rolex SS at RRP is all yours ;)
 
I've been through a couple of recessions and there's always winners and losers, the winners will still be buying high end watches, they are probably safer than cash

True, but the current demand for Rolex SS is driven by the middle class. When the middle class run low on money the demand for Rolex SS will reduce significantly.

The high rollers are buying high end Rolex and other brands not entry level Rolex divers.

Just my 2p s worth.
 

walrusboy

War Hero
Rolex prices significantly outpaced inflation in the past and are quite likely to go on doing so
As a guide, steel sports Rolex bought 10 years ago with box and papers have doubled in value at least. All down to supply and demand and grey market dealers exploiting the situation.

Rolex used to supply watches to British PWs in WW2 on the basis they were paid for when the war ended. They also used to supply the issued dive watch (Milsub) to the UK Armed Forces prior to 1980 when CWC secured the contract. The heritage of the brand as an attainable piece for a working man has long gone and Tudor appears to be moving into that space.
 
Rolex used to supply watches to British PWs in WW2 on the basis they were paid for when the war ended. They also used to supply the issued dive watch (Milsub) to the UK Armed Forces prior to 1980 when CWC secured the contract. The heritage of the brand as an attainable piece for a working man has long gone and Tudor appears to be moving into that space.

Indeed there is no doubting Rolex’s genuine military connections, unlike say Bremont whose is entirely marketing fiction.

I think Tudor will never escape from Rolex’s shadow, they will always be the “I really wanted a Rolex but settled for this” brand.
 

walrusboy

War Hero
Indeed there is no doubting Rolex’s genuine military connections, unlike say Bremont whose is entirely marketing fiction.

I think Tudor will never escape from Rolex’s shadow, they will always be the “I really wanted a Rolex but settled for this” brand.
I think there is some of that with Tudor but with Rolex unattainable for many, consumers are looking at other brands as an alternative. I'm lucky to have a couple of modern Rolex steel sports, bought at retail but after seeing the Pelagos FXD I liked it so much I decided to get on a wait list; it's the only titanium sports watch in the Rolex / Tudor family. Like Rolex, Tudor has a genuine military connection with both the MN and US Navy and the FXD is an MN collaboration. A friend has the standard Pelagos and it is excellent albeit a little thick.

Agreed re Bremont and other similar brands. Smoke and mirrors.
 
Let me explain. 'Flippers' buy watches that they never intend to wear and sell them to grey market sellers for a profit. Grey market sellers hike up prices and sell them to 'end users', who are people like us who buy watches to wear but who can't always buy them at retail from ADs. The reason for this is in order to buy a high-demand or ultra-high demand watch from an AD, you need a purchase history, i.e. you need to have bought stuff from the AD before, preferably stuff that is hard to sell. If you buy unpopular products you might get on a wait list for a desirable watch such as a Rolex sports watch in steel.

A recent example is a friend who wants to buy a new model Rolex Submariner but he can't get on a wait list because he has no purchase history. The AD agreed that if he bought a Brietling Superocean for over £5k he would put him on a Submariner wait list. The Brietling was worth £3,600 as soon as he walked out of the AD but if he is able to buy a Submariner at Retail (£7,150) it will be worth £12.5k - 13k with box and papers.

I refuse to fuel this market so if I can't get it at retail, I'll pass.
I bought my Sub 22 years ago because I wanted a good strong automatic (Omega too brash, Breitling too delicate.) Walked into a jewellers in Blackpool and said can I look at watches? Can I have this one? Thank you. I was amazed chatting to a jeweller the other month when he said not only was there a waiting list ( I knew that) but you had to have a history of buying new Rolex before you even went on the list. I love my Sub but no way would I pander to that sort of marketing! I wouldn't go grey market I'd just buy something else.
 
I’ve used these guys a few times. Highly recommended.

Well, I sent the watch off to Watch Doctors and they sent it back untouched as too old/obsolete/worn to do anything with it. On the upside, the rattling dished out by the Royal Mail appears to have set the movement running again, albeit intermittently and at the cost of two cracks in the crystal.

I know very little about this stuff, but as it runs there can’t be too much wrong with it that can’t be fixed, or at least improved by cleaning and lubing the movement.

I think I’ll try the suggestion from @trademarklondon to approach the manufacturer.
 

Ravers

LE
Kit Reviewer
Well, I sent the watch off to Watch Doctors and they sent it back untouched as too old/obsolete/worn to do anything with it. On the upside, the rattling dished out by the Royal Mail appears to have set the movement running again, albeit intermittently and at the cost of two cracks in the crystal.

I know very little about this stuff, but as it runs there can’t be too much wrong with it that can’t be fixed, or at least improved by cleaning and lubing the movement.

I think I’ll try the suggestion from @trademarklondon to approach the manufacturer.
I’m surprised. They managed to get a very beaten up WW2 Cyma GSTP running for me and serviced my great great grandfather’s gold pocket watch.
 
I’m surprised. They managed to get a very beaten up WW2 Cyma GSTP running for me and serviced my great great grandfather’s gold pocket watch.
I suspect as at best it’s probably worth £200 it was more ‘not worth it’ rather than it being a mission impossible. The value in this watch is sentimental rather than anything else.
 
I suspect as at best it’s probably worth £200 it was more ‘not worth it’ rather than it being a mission impossible. The value in this watch is sentimental rather than anything else.
I have my Grandfather's pocket watch from WWI which hasn't worked for years.

Took it into a respected watchmaker in Glasgow who told me basically that it was beyond economical repair as someone else had had a go previously and bggrd the mechanism completely. If I wanted it to work it would have to be replaced which I didn't want.

I remember him wearing it so like you it will remain with us for sentimental reasons.
 
I suspect as at best it’s probably worth £200 it was more ‘not worth it’ rather than it being a mission impossible. The value in this watch is sentimental rather than anything else.
Probably the movement is gummed up with dust and hardened oil ect,
Lighter fluid is your friend here, if your confident enough to remove the movement from the case, then a bath in fluid will ungum most things, it evaporates away leaving a light lubricant film behind.
It's not as thorough as a proper service but works.
 
I have my Grandfather's pocket watch from WWI which hasn't worked for years.

Took it into a respected watchmaker in Glasgow who told me basically that it was beyond economical repair as someone else had had a go previously and bggrd the mechanism completely. If I wanted it to work it would have to be replaced which I didn't want.

I remember him wearing it so like you it will remain with us for sentimental reasons.
Quite genuinely, sounds like a possible candidate for the BBC "The Repair Shop".
One man's write -off , another's challenge.
All you could do is ask....
Never seen Steve stuck.
 
Quite genuinely, sounds like a possible candidate for the BBC "The Repair Shop".
One man's write -off , another's challenge.
All you could do is ask....
Never seen Steve stuck.
But you'd need a severe and heartbreaking sob story to feature on the programme, the way it seems to be going. Steve had (the last time I looked) an 18 month waiting list to accept repairs at his own shop.
 
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