Politics or Religion?

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by Firehorse, Dec 6, 2004.

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  1. I would argue that the basic principles of Judaism, Islam and Christianity have far more in common than they give cause for division.

    All three are based on the 10 Commandments, which form a sound basis for a civilised society.

    Judaism and Islam (to the best of my shaky knowledge) retain “an eye for an eye” which, in itself, can be interpreted not so much as a call for vengeance as a prohibition on escalating a situation. “An eye for an eye” not “an eye and some holiday vouchers for an eye”.

    Jesus brought a more Buddhist approach to Judaism with his suggestion that it may be best to forgive the transgressions of others and leave judgement to God. But he was still a good Jew. It’s one of those things that depend on translation, but I remember in Bibles I saw as a child that Jesus never said he was the son of God. When asked, he responded, “so you say”, which is not the same as claiming to be a Deity.

    Jesus’ seemingly conflicting statements of “in my Father’s house there are many mansions” and “no-one comes to the Father but through me” are not irreconcilable. I had it explained to me thus:

    “In my Father’s house there are many mansions” – there are many different ways of worshiping and reaching God

    “No-one comes to the Father but through me” – Jesus believed no one could reach God without adhering to his philosophy of tolerance, compassion and love combined with following the 10 Commandments. For “through me” read “through my teachings” and it makes sense.

    Followers of Islam regard Jesus as a great prophet, though not so great as Mohammed. This, to me at least, suggests that Jesus never claimed to be the begotten son of God – in the eyes of Jews and Muslims alike that would be the ultimate heresy.

    Whenever religion is discussed I find myself thinking of Kipling’s lines

    "If you can bear to hear the truth you’ve spoken
    Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools."

    By prohibiting translation Mohammed knew what he was about. Unfortunately, it still does not make it impossible for his teachings (which if you speak to moderate Muslims seem fair and reasonable) to be perverted by malevolent megalomaniacs (whatever happend to humility?) who need a means of terrorising their own peoples into submission, let alone anyone else.

    Christians have not been blameless in this from the Crusades, through the Inquisition, and beyond into the divisions within the Christian church itself today.

    What politically motivated malefactors do to sound teachings cannot be blamed on all followers of the original prophets or on the prophets themselves.

    I pity both Jesus and Mohammed. They were honest men.

    Now take me off and burn me.
  2. ...and to think yer average squaddie is supposed to have the literacy and numeracy skills of an eleven year old!
  3. Don't give him credit, he's just copied and pasted from www.zealot.com
  4. Euugghh! religion, it burns!, it burns!, get it away!
  5. Not a theologian then? :D
  6. Sorry, was that a joke? Firehorse's post seemed to me very far from zealotry.
  7. BJ, you funnin' us, boy? :lol: :lol: :lol:

    Go on, own up 'cos I'm b*ggered if I can find any comparative theology on the above site; plenty of opportunities to buy goods, though.

    Firehorse; good post, though.... For a wee squaddie... :wink: :wink:
  8. Bit late for a fukking debate like this one but here goes :D
    Jesus was indeed crucified for the blasphemy of claiming to be the son of God.
    Crap. He actually meant what he said. Not some Jehovah witness doublespeak rewriting of what he said :evil: He meant exactly what he said. You don't get to the the father unless you accept Jesus as your personal saviour and Lord.
    He made it crystal clear we MUST be born again if you want to be with God. He died on the cross in fukcing agony to make that possible. To make that an event that can and does happen, not to ask you to follow a fukcing 'philosophy'!
    Jesus speaks clearly and makes perfect sense without your help thankyou!
    It may make sense of it and tidy it up for you but you are re-writing Jesus here mate.
    It was and that's why they crucified him.
    Pity Mohammed if you like as he is dead and rotted.
    Don't pity Jesus..he's alive :wink:
    Right who's round is it :roll:
  9. Nice post Firehorse............................

    Missed out faith though mate!!

    Christians believe........ they have faith that Jesus was the Son of God.

    Muslims state that Mohammed was a Prophet of God as was Jesus.

    The position from which you argued is seemingly an aethiestic point of view, after all you set good points and points against each other. What however you fail to understand is that religeon does not come down to catchphrases, soundbites and semantics; it comes down to faith.

    For one my faith does not advocate in anyway shape or form blowing other people up as well as myself.

    You may be right...........there are divides in all religeons, especially the Anglican Church at the moment.....................but one thing remains strong, faith............found whenever you need it!!!
  10. Pithy and precise
  11. If Jesus was executed by crucifixion by the Romans it would not have been for blasphemy against Judaism but for political subversion/revolt against the Roman occupying power.The Jewish Sanhedrin had ample power to punish blasphemy by ordering that he be stoned to death.

  12. Your post reminds me of the scene from 'The Life of Brian", Galgers. "Crucifixtions to the right, stonings to the left." But what you're saying's perfectly accurate. JC was slotted for being a threat to the administration, not for religious deviancy.
  13. you think so?http://www.positiveatheism.org/crt/whichcom.htm[/b]
  14. "At least it gets you in the open air"
  15. [quote="galgenberg"At least it gets you in the open air"[/quote]

    That's the spirit. Always look on the bright side of life. :lol: