Police guns too big for women officers

#1
Police guns 'too big for women officers'
Daily Telegraph
Link

Women police firearms officers risk accidental shootings because the weapons they use are too big for their hands, according to a leading representative of female officers.

Inspector Liz Owsley, the national co-ordinator of the British Association of Women in Policing, issued the warning this week at a Home Office conference on equal rights.

The inspector said that guns were a problem for some of the 200 women firearms officers in forces across England and Wales.

"There is a problem with guns because women have smaller hands. When you look at the guns being used, the grips are not comfortable for women to hold.

"They could end up shooting themselves or one of their colleagues because they are not handling it properly."

She welcomed work by the Cleveland and Durham forces to bring in a weapon with a smaller handle. It is understood an officer in the Metropolitan Police, on behalf of the Association of Chief Police Officers (Acpo), has researched the best weapon for women, identifying the Glock handgun, which officers in the Met and other forces use, along with the Heckler and Koch MP5 carbine.
My mother told me always to be wary of women with big hands.
 
#3
Guns are not the only problem, however. Insp Owsley said that women officers had to "wear men's boots which are uncomfortable and lead to them getting blisters.

"They have to wear men's shirts and trousers, which are very restrictive, they even have to do up their buttons backwards. And often the whole kit for specialist officers is only designed for men."
Some of the cars they are forced to drive are really big too, forcing them to sit on cushions and have blocks fitted to the pedals. Research is being done in Toy town to see if more appropriate vehicles can be found. :wink:
 
#4
I remember this coming uo about 5 years ago - it was a question as to why female police officers were not as good a shot as their male counterparts, once the size of the pistol grip was reduced the pass rate for females increased.

The problem has already arisen and been addressed - why someone in the police would want to reactivate this "non-issue" is beyond me.
 
#5
If they can't hold the weapon should they be allowed to use it?

My answer would be no. If needed there should be a check to ensure ALL firearms personnel are physically able to hold their weapons.

Although personnally I think Liz may be overstating hte dangers of her girls shooting themselves and others.

That is what the safetyis for.
 
#6
I know it's slightly off topic but I don't feel they should be using Glocks at all. It's a bloody combat handgun for Christ's sake. They need something with a manual safety. Make the Muppet's think twice before pulling that trigger.
 
#8
I've known two SF blokes with unusually small hands/short fingers, who got on extremely well with 9mm Hi-Powers with cut-down/slimmed grips.

If these officers are competent and likely to be in an armed role for a while, why not modify their PWs?
 
#9
Bull... A female officer must meet the same standards as her male counter-part which includes expertise with her issued weapon

A police issued weapon needs to be of sufficient caliber to reliably stop a drugged up suspect. Sure.. even a .22 can snuff out a man's life under the right conditions and shot placement matters considerably but the simple fact is that dealing with a junkie or meth-head on a rampage requires a round that will do massive trauma to tissue and bone. So... going with a smaller bullet is not practical.

Reducing the frame size and weight increases the felt recoil which impacts both accuracy and amount of time it takes to get back on target for a second shot...

Equality is moot when it puts the public at risk... this subject transends weapons qualifications. There are some valid arguments for having officers with enough ass on them to physically control suspects.
 
#11
Khyros said:
There are some valid arguments for having officers with enough ass on them to physically control suspects.
You've obviously never seen the arse on the average WPC. They tend to have more than their fair share.
 
#13
Part of the reason the M11 (SIG P228) was picked for MP units in the US Army over the M9 (Beretta 92) which is in service with most everyone else in the Army was due to the fact that the female MPs couldn't get a good grip around the larger Italian pistol.

NTM
 
#14
caubeen said:
I've known two SF blokes with unusually small hands/short fingers, who got on extremely well with 9mm Hi-Powers with cut-down/slimmed grips.

If these officers are competent and likely to be in an armed role for a while, why not modify their PWs?
I take Bad-Omen's point on females using the Glock, although inevitably there'll be gals who can handle this beast comfortably.

In 1973, I watched an Americano reprise his 'World Record' of putting 6 rounds into a playing card in millyseconds, from a revolver. The real point is, that he had unusually small hands and which he attributed to his ability to fire with accuracy and speed. Yes, he'd customised his pistol and auto pistol grips (Pachmyhrs ?).

Allow the girls an alternative 9mm or at least customised grips. What's the matter with the Walther anyway. It worked for the girls in NI.
 
#15
She was whininging about having to wear man's trousers and man's shirts which button up the opposite way and when she came back after maternity grant..her tits were too big for her shirt. FFS.
 
#16
Khyros said:
A police issued weapon needs to be of sufficient caliber to reliably stop a drugged up suspect.
...on this side of the Atlantic, one rather hopes that armed police don't just shoot at "suspects", drugged up or not...

:)
 
#17
Gravelbelly said:
Khyros said:
A police issued weapon needs to be of sufficient caliber to reliably stop a drugged up suspect.
...on this side of the Atlantic, one rather hopes that armed police don't just shoot at "suspects", drugged up or not...

:)
On this side a "suspect" is called such until he is actually convicted in court... even if he is covered head to toe with the blood of his neighbor and carrying a chain saw. So... if a caveman looking meth-head charges at an officer with aggressive intent and get's dropped, he's still a "suspect."

Obviously if a weapon is drawn there might be a reason to use it eh, otherwise why issue your police firearms?
 
#18
Correct me if I am wrong but I was under the impression that US Federal agencies issue 2 different varients of the Glock, one larger and one smaller, for just this reason.

As for the buttons on backwards, that's actually a historical thing. Technically women's buttons are the wrong way around as they were dressed by others, and men's are the coorrect way around for right handed people dressing themselves.

So learn to dress yourselves and you'll be fine with the button thing! :twisted:
 

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