Police and use of reasonable force!

Discussion in 'The Intelligence Cell' started by sammym, Nov 10, 2012.

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  1. Firstly I want to make my position clear. I am not a fan of the Police in general, and regard many of them as nothing more that bullies.

    I have just seen this: Former PC sentenced over misconduct - ITV News

    Surely that throws into question a lot of the stuff you see on programmes like Roadwars... At the end of the day, I judge it all on what I'd have done in that situation. I certainly wouldn't knee someone because they didn't want to get into my car, or threaten to set a German Shepherd on someone if they didn't do as I requested.
  2. So what do you expect a policeman to do when faced with a recalcitrant yob who resists arrest? Give the yob an ice cream and tell him to take his time? If you are looking for juicy quotes, here's one: Get in the back of the van conscious or unconscious. Your choice.
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  3. The general rule here is that compliance with a copper's orders is all that is required to avoid physical force being used. Too often the perp will not comply due to booze, drugs, misplaced machismo or stupidity and ends up the worse for it.
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  4. I could make almost anyone do something armed with handcuffs and many mates without harming them. I have some training in martial arts, but I am assuming the police are trained in restraints. What I see regularly isn't restraint it's assault. And I don't get how the same shows show the police swearing, but then arresting people for doing the same...
  5. And to add, I'm not anti police. I'm anti abuse and bullying. I am truly socked at what I see on programmes that are advertised on television. I have known one bloke who simple made a joke of "don't say nothing without a solicitor" when someone was being spoken to (who he didn't know), on the way home from a night out. Result, broken wrist and dislocated shoulder, and a result for assault of a police officer (after he said he didn't want to give his name and wanted to go home). I don't really care if I get slammed on here for saying it. But I truly believe the police have free reign to basically attack people if they so wish. 99.9% of this stuff results in nothing but problems for the guys who get the abuse.

    And OK, 99% of the people who get a kicking might be chavs. But if I give someone a hiding because I don't like them and they are pikies, then it's a crime. But if it's the police it seems it's reasonable force.
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  6. maguire

    maguire LE Book Reviewer

    all I see on programmes like Roadwars is mouthy gobshites giving plod a load of gyp and then being surprised when they get a good shoeing.

    you dont want a good hiding, do as you're asked.
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  7. What he said.
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  8. This isn't the most intellectual answer but ******* obey the law. It's that simple.

    If you are being questioned but haven't broken the law then comply with instructions then be on your way.

    "Yes." "No." "101 Duke Street." "Yes." "Thank you."

    Then walk on.

    The problem for you here, sammy, is that you might be trying to widen the margin based on one or two stories. There was a non-story thread started months back about how a huge number of police had committed crimes before but a quick scan of figures showed that it was something like 2% of the national numbers. Which is nothing - and nearly unavoidable if you look at the circumstances. Same with this. One policeman gets a bit heavy handed with a bloke who was making his life difficult and is punished. Suddenly people think cops are heavy handed and need reigning in, because there are a few throbbers who have been known to go too far in certain circumstances where the externals (cops stress, working hours, life at home etc) aren't looked at. Not excusing violent behaviour in unnecessary circumstances from cops, I do believe they should be noble bastions of chivalry in the line of duty, but just pointing out that even the ones done for violence probably don't go out thinking "I'm going to break some ***** arm tonight."

    I know cops and I've read some books about cops. From what I understand, cops (the majority at least) don't want to be heavy handed. They don't want to nick people for speeding offences, drunk and disorderly behaviour outside a nightclub or fly-tipping. They want to nick serious burglars and violent offenders and put them away. When you're being uncooperative and wasting their time, you're getting in the way of that. It doesn't give them an excuse to break bones but the only way to avoid being put in that position and possibly being shoved around is to keep your mouth closed, not challenge them (THIS IS WHAT COURT IS FOR) and go about your business lawfully.
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  9. You're not legally obliged to give any info at all if stopped in the street. You must give your address if stopped when driving, and that's it.

  10. It's all true. I like to randomly leap out of my car, punch an old lady then jump back in and drive off nonchalantly. Sometimes I don't even get out, I mount the kerb and just slap people from the open window.
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  11. That depends on the situation. If you are stopped because an officer has reasonable grounds for suspecting you of an offence and you fail to provide name and address you can be arrested.

    In respect of driving; you are required to produce your license (bearing name and address), MOT and insurance documents on request, failiure to do so is an offence on a public road.
  12. Yes. Of course. I think your mate is being a little economical with the truth there. Or just a liar.
  13. On the rare occasions I've watched that kind of balls, what I've seen is scrotes getting nicked for a great string of offences, then at the end a macho voiceover says 'The youth who was caught driving recklessly in the stolen Bentley, with ten kilos of cannabis and a Samurai sword, was fined £2.75, given three points on his licence and ten hours of community service.'

    If the coppers gave them a good hiding I might watch the shows more often. Compare it to 'Cops' where the slightest failure to obey some shaven ape in a 12XL uniform, results in Tasers followed by eight thirty-stone coppers jumping on the bloke.
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  14. My comments can only come from what I have seen personally. I have watched some of these TV programmes and I'm always amazed that the Police manage to keep their temper under control especially when they are controlling mass disorders
    I've also seen the Police in other countries operating; in India, France and Greece.
    The Indians piled in with long bamboo canes and were not too fussy about who they hit.
    The French CRS in 1968 were probably out of control but they were still pretty impressive.
    The Greeks were even more fun because they decided to tear gas a mob of protesting farmers. It turned out that the rozzers only had 6 gas canisters with them and all that did was to fire up the Farmers even more. The Farmers enjoyed the experience so much that they burnt down the Prefecture to show their appreciation.
    Occasionally some one is always going to over-step the mark and then they should be disciplined accordingly.
    There was a TV series recently where Police from other countries exchanged to work with British Police. All of them were shocked at what the Police had to endure and some of them made it quite clear that in their own countries that the people would have received a good kicking.
    By and large, I would have to say that the British Police are a model of restraint compared to other countries.
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  15. On a lot of these Steet/Crime/Road Wars type programmes when the scrotes know they're on the telly they will give it large to the cops for status with their other scrote mates, however it all goes to ratshit when plod doesn't " playfair " and wades in with the big stick / snarling sharptoothed ball of four legged hair - funniest one was when matey boy was one side of a hedge , didn't want to co-operate , threatened cops with violence , so dog is launched through hedge drags scrote through it backwards in which in the process he loses his strides and boxers in the thorns therefore exposing his "wee willy wangler " to all and sundry .
    To summarise, like others have said, behave yerself, say yes/no/thank-you/please and all will be fine.
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