Police and TA

Discussion in 'Join the Army - Reserve Recruitment' started by lochland, Dec 11, 2012.

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  1. Hey all,

    I work for the police and am interested in joining the TA. This is for a couple of reasons:

    1) I've always wanted to do something useful with my spare time other than training.
    2) I want to serve in the armed forces but know that if I leave the police the way things are at the moment with recruitment I would never be able to get back in again
    3) It's one way to get firearms trained and assist in my application to firearms.
    4) As sad as it sounds one of my ambitions in life is to eventually do a secondment with the United Nations. In order to do it with the police you need to fill certain criteria such as having experience in work overseas, in hostile environments, be firearms trained and have experience working with other, international agencies. A good few years in the TA couldn't hurt in relation to gaining experience with the above.

    I've been to my local recruitment office and had a talk with the recruitment officer who was a very friendly chap. One thing I picked up from subtle hints is that he doesn't really like commissioned officers (is this common with NCO's?). He suggested Military Police, That's all well and good but that would be like coming home from my day job and then doing my day job again on some evenings and weekends. I'm quite interested in military intelligence. There's a voluntary regiment in Teeside which isn't too far from me. Suffice to say information about what they do is vague at best. Anyway, a few questions for you grizzled vets:

    - From what I gather drill nights are once a week. What do these usually consist off? Do you drop in with people who at varying levels in their training and all do the same thing or do they keep people with similar levels of experience together?

    - Is it best to join as an officer or soldier? I'm eligible to apply for officer training but see the benefits of joining as a soldier, learning your trade and then applying for a commission later down the line if, at the time it's what I want to do. On the other hand, would it be a wasted opportunity if I didn't at least try and then if fail, join as a soldier?

    - I work shifts. This isn't something I can't get around. I know there are evening training sessions that I won't be able to make. However I would still easily be able to make the 19 or 27 days quota. Does your two week training session contribute towards this minimum commitment? Because if so that knocks the number down to 5 or 13 which over the course of a year is very easy.

    - Intelligence work looks interesting, however I know that in reality jobs aren't always what they seem on the outside. What do personal in the TA actually do in the intelligence corp? Reading on it seems that people are split into looking at images, listening to radio transmissions and interviewing people. Are these really kept separate or do you do all three to build up a picture? There's a fourth category that simply states intelligence operative. Are these jack of all trades or do they do something else?

    - It would be very foolish of me to not at least consider Military Police. Do you think, realistically there are any skills that I could pick up in the Military Police that would benefit my civilian career? Or at the end of the day is it the same job, just in a different place?

    I think that's everything for the time being. I will be disappointed if I don't get at least a few heavily sarcastic responses. Look forward to reading them. Cheers for your opinions though guys, it's much appreciated.
  2. Firstly a question to you, do you intend to go on tour?
  3. Firstly, I would maybe avoid the RMP as you will (most likely) be monumentally hated by everyone in the Army! I have a friend who transferred out of the RMP as they are one of the most anally retentive bunches. secondly, from what Ive heard through another friend who was looking at Int Corp, they don't tend to do much green stuff, mainly (as the name suggests) gathering int however there are more opportunities once you complete bravo to get stuck in. If you want the action the infantry all the way! What inf units are up your way?
  4. First things first. Stop and think do I really have the time and energy to commit to both the TA and the police? Are you really prepared to come off 3 days of nights and straight into a training weekend?

    The reason I ask is that I've yet to meet anyone who could make the police and TA work together with any degree of usefulness and I know quite a few who've tried. The sensible ones have realised they're over stretched and sacked the TA.

    Some however hang on for grim death doing the bare minimum to bounty qualify year after year while contributing nothing. Forcing some other poor ****** to pick up the slack, I'm thinking of a particular Cpl and Lt (oh how we laughed about having to write his SJARS for him).

    If you think you can make it work I suggest trying it as a private soldier first. See how you get on without any extra responsibility then decide if you can handle the extra admin that comes with rank.

    I realise this post may sound discouraging, but thats just my experience of cops in the TA you may well prove me wrong. Best of luck to you

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  5. You won't get much infomation on the Int Corps on here, for obvious reasons. I'd suggest you ring up the unit and arrange to go in for a chat. In the mean time go through the stickies in the Int Corps and RMP forums.
  6. So you want to join to get firearms experience so you can join an ARV later?
    Don't think that's going to work as it a totally different process for the Army & Civvy Plod!
    And carrying a firearm on duty these days is changing, even more so to weed out those who are walter mitty's!
    Have you thought of transferring to a bigger force to try for CID/Special Branch?
  7. Will your Commissioner/Chief Constable alow you to join?

    Some forces have a waiting list to join the TA.

    Firstly what is more important to you: A police career or a military one. I think it's Police since you talk of firearms.

    Why not join the ACF as an AI or Officer. Some county commandant's will commission you because you are a cop and they want to kiss Plod's arse and get on side with the Child Protection Team (so says the cynic in me)

    But see how that looks to the police. You are giving up your spare time for the kiddies in the community and isn't that all pink and fluffy. The ACF will send you on a Skill at Arms Instructor course at Frimley which will teach you how
    to teach civvy kids safe use of a semi-auto rifle.

    That could be seen as two positives to your police career.

    Once you've got that in the bag, you can quit the ACF, or turn up once in a blue moon, do **** all and treat all the other instructors like shit on your shoe, like so many other coppers in the ACF. That's why no-one likes you outside of your police social circle.

    Wannabe green slime and a gun cop. [shudder]
  8. There was a TA RMP lad on a course I did in the 90s, and he was also a full time copper in Norfolk. He was a pretty sound bloke. So it can be done. Years later, I saw him on one of the many cops on camera fly-on-the-wall programmes (don't ask "which one?").

    I've got a book written by guy who was in SO19, called "Good Guys Wear Black", and he mentions a firearms copper in his London-based unit who was also a TA SAS member.
  9. Wow didn't expect so many responses so quickly.

    Faustic yes, if the job allows it I would intend to go on tour. It's not 100% that they would let me but learning a skill without going on tour would be like learning to drive and then not being let anywhere near a car.

    Biscuitjimbo I live in Durham so pretty much every TA unit is within traveling distance. What do you mean by completing bravo? My local regiment is the fusileers. Infintry is certainly something to consider but ideally I'd like something where skills can be transferred across to both jobs.

    sundance I totally appreciate where you're coming from. I know time is going to be an issue, that's why I asked about commitment levels needed. I know the job gives you 2 weeks special leave to complete the camp. I work on a 5 week rotationary shift pattern where I would be able to make 4/5 training evenings but only 2/5 weekends. Are weekend training sessions generally every weekend or just once every few months?

    eathaboi Cheers, I'll have a butchers

    fltpilot True, the training is different, but surely some previous experience with firearms is better than none at all? CID generally deals with section 18 assaults, robbery and burglary. Sometimes we on 24/7 even retain them. In the current economic climate they're incredibly stretched and it's practically impossible to join. Special Branch don't take people on without prior CID experience so in that respect until the government start funding the police again I'm snookered.

    Mothman I've spoken to my Sgt re this and it shouldn't be an issue. In Northumbria there are not very many people at all in the TA.

    In relation to youth work I already assist in teaching at martial arts classes. It's a valid point and something to consider. Is it paid?

    A few bad eggs give a lot of other coppers a bad name. We're not all like that. We're just like everybody else who works for a living. Some people let their egos get in the way though.
  10. I thought I'd replied to this thread but doesn't look like my post has gone on. I'll try again.

    Thanks for all the responses. Didn't expect to get so many replies.

    Faustic: Certainly. If the job will allow it. Training without going on tour would be like learning to drive then not buying a car. If you learn skills, you want to put them to the test. At least that's how I feel.

    Biscuitjimbo: I live in Durham. There's pretty much every kind of TA regiment within traveling distance. Infantry is definitely an option but ideally I'd like to do something where there could be transfer of skills between day job and part time job. Intelligence plays a very important part in policing, especially in relation to gaining information through interviewing people. That said I have no idea how similar the use and gathering of information is between the two services. As for getting stuck in I'd love to. The last thing I want is to be stuck in an office all day every day. I take it Bravo training is phase 2? How long does it generally take to reach that standard?

    Sundance: I very much appreciate the heads up. I guess the only way to be sure is to try and see what happens. As it stands my shift pattern means I would be able to attend 4/5 training evenings and 2/5 training weekends. That is of course if training is the same evening every week and on every weekend. I presume training isn't every weekend? How often are training weekends ran? It's best to know as much as possible so I appreciate you telling me what difficulties I'm going to encounter.

    Eathaboi: That was going to be my next step. I'll give the Teeside regiment a ring and arrange to go down and have a chat. I've had a good read up now thanks.

    Fltpilot: I don't know about other forces in the country but Northumbria has had massive cuts to its budget and getting into CID/ Special Branch is practically impossible for the foreseeable future. I'm basically going to have to wait until somebody retires/ dies to get in. Which is a shame really. That and they're so stretched at the moment that we, in 24/7 are taking on more and more jobs that CID would normally do. As for transferring forces last time I check there was a freeze on all transfers whilst the home secretory is butchering every bodies budgets. I know there's a lot of difference between use of firearms in the armed forces and police but I was working with the philosophy that some firearms training is better than none whatsoever.

    Mothman: I've spoke to my Sgt about this. I should be okay because there are very few Northumbria cops in the TA meaning that they should be below the quota of max amount that they will let in. You're right though, I will need to seek permission. I already do a bit of youth work, teaching kids martial arts and refereeing football games every now and then. If I did anymore I think I would go insane. Do Cadet workers get paid or is it all voluntary?
    Not all cops are bad. A few bad eggs give the rest of us a bad name. We're just people like everybody else.

    Wolvoexpunk: Glad to hear that someones had success. I couldn't possibly be further from London though without living in a different country ha ha. I would hate to have one of those camera crews following you around. You would have to be so careful with what you did and said.
  11. BuggerAll

    BuggerAll LE Reviewer Book Reviewer

  12. The Int Corps is probably a good shout, I know a number of coppers in it. When it comes to police firearms I'm not sure how much it would help given the police approach firearms very differently and anecdotally are sometimes a bit wary of those with military firearms training believing them to have picked up "bad habits" (in reality I'd suggest on average coppers are worse with weapons due to simple lack of experience but that's probably for a different thread). Don't let that put you off though.

    I'd suggest the soldier route, particularly in the Int Corps, often it's more interesting a as an NCO and actually rank is lot less of an issue than anywhere else I'm aware of less maybe SF. Also there is nothing to stop you commissioning from the ranks later on.
  13. Ha ha no I'm not a CSO. Not that there is anything wrong with CSO's. They serve a purpose and don't deserve the stick that they often get from people.
    I already have been to the TA office, that was covered in my first post, these are questions I have thought of since and I thought that this would be a good source of information and a place where I could gain honest answers. Recruitment officers are there to recruit people, not necessarily tell you all the dirty truths. So far I've been proven right.

    As for your recycling bin? Ring your local county council and ask.

    Thanks aberspr, glad to hear somebody thinks its a good idea. I'm curious what differences there are between police firearms training and military firearms training that you are aware off?
  14. Read his original post he's been to the careers office and he's asked a number of reasonable questions in a sensible forum for them. I detect a problem with the police?
  15. I haven't undergone police training firearms or otherwise so I'm only working from discussions with those who have but the key difference is that military weapons training is based on going out and killing the enemy as pretty much the first option. You might capture them if they surrender or survive your attack but that's largely secondary most of the time.

    In the police using a firearm is the last step in an escalation of force which is geared towards arresting a suspect and will only be used as a last resort and each round will be justified and specifically aimed at a target and only if they pose an immediate risk to life. This is very different to military training which involves putting down suppressing fire.etc and just being armed enemy is sufficient justification to shoot them whether they actually are an immediate threat or not.