Plastic Plod: "Boredom" leading to misconduct

#1
Police Community Support officers are responsible for the majority of Metropolitan Police misconduct.

"The officers make up only 20% of the 50,000 plus workforce yet were subjected to the most gross misconduct charges, a report has revealed.

Boredom and a lack of motivation were the reason behind the criminal offences, according to Martin Tiplady, Scotland Yard's Human Resources director.

Some felt like "glorified security guards" in a damaging culture of "us and them" he added.

PCSOs felt the scope of their roles was severely limited and they were not able to use all of their skills and experience as a result, Tiplandy said.

"This led to feelings of boredom, reduced motivation and increased discipline activity".

Drinking and motor crime resulted in over half the 35 sackings and reprimands in 2008.

Other misconduct included the misuse of police computers or inappropriate behaviour, while in one case, a false allegation was made by a PCSO.

In all, 20 PCSOs were sacked, while there were formal reprimands for the other 15. "


http://www.thelondondailynews.com/most-misconduct-community-support-officers-p-2339.html

I see an easy solution: spend the money on real Police instead
 
#3
Its just, what are they for??? Most of the PCSOs you see are fcuk-all use to the community, the ones I see round my neck of the woods would struggle to catch a cold, let alone suspects, why not just train the ones good enough to be proper cops up and fcuk the rest off, putting their budget into real old bill?
 
#4
"Martin Tiplady, director of human resources, said boredom and reduced motivation were partly responsible for indiscipline.

He said some PCSOs did not recognise the authority of their managers and did not understand the strict policing hierarchy within the force.

And he said the policy of encouraging those who failed their initial police constable training to become PCSOs was a recipe for dissatisfaction and low morale."

http://www.24dash.com/news/Communit...ort-officers-keep-getting-into-trouble-report

Why in the name of God would anyone find that a surprising outcome??
 

BuggerAll

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#5
I think it was an ill conceived idea in the first place - ZaNU Labour at its best - but actually I've seen PCSOs doing a good job. In fact apart from when they are speeding by blue lights flashing in their Beemers I very rarely see plod, but I do see PCSOs out on the beat.
 
#6
We don't have PCSO's in our town, we have Community Wardens who all appear to have been recruited for their aptitude for Mongness (one even has the NCP attendant 'wooden style leg').

The other form of security in the town centre aprt from Tayside Police's worst are the local 'mall' security, one in particular has tatoos all over his lower arms,hands and has Barlinnie or Saughton written all over him. Yet he still has the audacity to give me the once over when exiting the shops! Me! A SNCO in Her Majesty's finest!!
 
#7
Seriously, what did they expect?

If you plant cabbages, you get, well, cabbages.
 

BuggerAll

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#8
BarryBuddon said:
We don't have PCSO's in our town, we have Community Wardens who all appear to have been recruited for their aptitude for Mongness (one even has the NCP attendant 'wooden style leg').

The other form of security in the town centre aprt from Tayside Police's worst are the local 'mall' security, one in particular has tatoos all over his lower arms,hands and has Barlinnie or Saughton written all over him. Yet he still has the audacity to give me the once over when exiting the shops! Me! A SNCO in Her Majesty's finest!!
Lets hope he is not a veteran eking out a living doing a sh1t job after losing his leg serving the crown in some dangerous parts.

I think its OK to mock amputees as long as they are not vets, isn't it?
 
#9
Bradstyley said:
Its just, what are they for??? Most of the PCSOs you see are fcuk-all use to the community, the ones I see round my neck of the woods would struggle to catch a cold, let alone suspects, why not just train the ones good enough to be proper cops up and fcuk the rest off, putting their budget into real old bill?
Because in case you haven't noticed 'real' plod have lost the use of their legs and are too important to walk the streets, the whole point of PCSO's (or 'lost shoppers' as they're referred to around here) is that they have the simple job of showing a presence on the streets.

If you employed yet more 'real' plod they would disappear into the station with the rest - we have record numbers of them already in case you hadn't realised.
 
#10
#11
IT_Guy said:
Bradstyley said:
Its just, what are they for??? Most of the PCSOs you see are fcuk-all use to the community, the ones I see round my neck of the woods would struggle to catch a cold, let alone suspects, why not just train the ones good enough to be proper cops up and fcuk the rest off, putting their budget into real old bill?
Because in case you haven't noticed 'real' plod have lost the use of their legs and are too important to walk the streets, the whole point of PCSO's (or 'lost shoppers' as they're referred to around here) is that they have the simple job of showing a presence on the streets.

If you employed yet more 'real' plod they would disappear into the station with the rest - we have record numbers of them already in case you hadn't realised.
You're probably not far from the truth. The political bosses are doing all they can to keep plods indoors whether it be through more paperwork or more lefty dedicated teams.

What needs to happen is more money needs to be put into recruiting and maintaining for Uniformed Neighbourhood and response officers. The money should not be diverted to any other task other than High Visibility Policing and reducing Response time.

Whilst on that subject I will partly bite. The Public complain if they get broken into and don't see a bobby for hours. Should your areas 3-6 bobbies be on foot covering an area that houses 50,000 people I suspect you would have no chance. Especially if its a high volume crime area. Cars Speed up response times whether its to 999 calls or to whip round and get a statement from you.

If money was pumped into HVP and secured from tampering More Bobbies could be put out and possibly more cars. Quicker response times and more crime prevention. This has been proven on the likes of Mischief night and Bonfire Night when we managed to make a real difference where we are. Sadly the Bobbies that were used for this were put back in their offices the next day and so the crime started flushing back.
 
#12
Closet_Jibber said:
IT_Guy said:
Bradstyley said:
Its just, what are they for??? Most of the PCSOs you see are fcuk-all use to the community, the ones I see round my neck of the woods would struggle to catch a cold, let alone suspects, why not just train the ones good enough to be proper cops up and fcuk the rest off, putting their budget into real old bill?
Because in case you haven't noticed 'real' plod have lost the use of their legs and are too important to walk the streets, the whole point of PCSO's (or 'lost shoppers' as they're referred to around here) is that they have the simple job of showing a presence on the streets.

If you employed yet more 'real' plod they would disappear into the station with the rest - we have record numbers of them already in case you hadn't realised.
You're probably not far from the truth. The political bosses are doing all they can to keep plods indoors whether it be through more paperwork or more lefty dedicated teams.

What needs to happen is more money needs to be put into recruiting and maintaining for Uniformed Neighbourhood and response officers. The money should not be diverted to any other task other than High Visibility Policing and reducing Response time.

Whilst on that subject I will partly bite. The Public complain if they get broken into and don't see a bobby for hours. Should your areas 3-6 bobbies be on foot covering an area that houses 50,000 people I suspect you would have no chance. Especially if its a high volume crime area. Cars Speed up response times whether its to 999 calls or to whip round and get a statement from you.

If money was pumped into HVP and secured from tampering More Bobbies could be put out and possibly more cars. Quicker response times and more crime prevention. This has been proven on the likes of Mischief night and Bonfire Night when we managed to make a real difference where we are. Sadly the Bobbies that were used for this were put back in their offices the next day and so the crime started flushing back.
Mate, you are in danger of employing common sense on a thread where it normally very quickly degenerates in to a Plod bashing free for all. What certain people on this thread expect is their own personal Dixon of Dock Green patrolling their streets on foot on a daily basis. At the same time, they want the area car there within 2 seconds flat when they hear a rustle in their back garden. It's whatever suits their argument at the time you see.

What people need to realise, is that despite the obfuscation of this government, and despite their best efforts in attempting to deceive the public, PCSO's are not, never have been and never will be police officers. Theirs is a high visibility, non confrontational role - allegedly. What happens in reality is that some (not all) get in way over their heads, and leave the real police to pick up the pieces. You reap what you sow.
And no, I am not a fan of Das Ersatz Polizei :roll:
 
#13
Unfortunately, yes, there are quite a few mongs who should never have been selected to train as PCSO, let alone in private security guarding. However the original concept of PCSOs, or something similar was, so I have been advised, was a Conservative idea that could have been 'rolled-out' if the Torys had won the '97 election. I can't substantiate this nor find anything relating on the Internet.

Yes, also there are lazy and ineffectual PCSOs, but there are also lazy and ineffectual Police Officers. There are 'bad apples' in every walk of life. Certainly there were loads of mongs in the Army in the 1960s and 1970s when I was in the mob. People who should never have been allowed through basic training. How the f*ck they were passed is a mystery. I suppose as long as they had two arms and two legs, and head that didn't wobble too much, and could speak some semblemce of English - they were in. As it was the last of the National Service people were bailng out around the early 1960s, so the Army took anybody at that time (Ooops...including me!!)

There are hundreds of hard working and dedicated PCSOs in England and Wales, and they do contribute to the 'Safer Neighbourhood Community' project that various Police Forces have in place now.

The ideal thing would be to have more fully trained PCs on the beat. However a 'uniformed precence' in a neighbourhood is better than nothing at all. Some local authorities such as Nottingham City even have their own CSO (Community Safety Officers) who are 'wannabee plod'. They don't even have the same 'powers' as a PCSO, but are just glorified Litter Wardens. The problems is that they look like real police and some of these mongs act as if they were. (allegedly)

A number of other local authorities are also employing 'Community Wardens' who wear a 'lookee-likee' uniforms and wear Hi-viz 'Stab-vests'. Again they are nothing more than Litter Wardens to give a 'reasuring precence' in the community. Of course the local Chavs usually have a 'go' at them when they are around.

The Torys have stated that if they get into office after the next election, they may reassess the whole PCSO/CSO project. What they are going to replace them with if anything, remains to be seen still.

Certain newspapers such as the 'Daily Hate' (Daily Mail) and others have a pop at PCSOSs from time to time like they were some sort of 'disease', or if there is nothing newsworthy going on. So the same old crap hoary old story is dragged out to be printed up to fill column inches.

Such is life dear folks...... :) 8)
 
#15
BarryBuddon said:
The other form of security in the town centre aprt from Tayside Police's worst are the local 'mall' security, one in particular has tatoos all over his lower arms,hands and has Barlinnie or Saughton written all over him. Yet he still has the audacity to give me the once over when exiting the shops! Me! A SNCO in Her Majesty's finest!!
So did you manage to nick me those Mach 3 razors then?
Usual place for pick up?
:wink:
 
#16
To be fair, our local PCSO does seem to be on the ball, the pity is that after he has done his 8 hours a day 5 days a week, there is no-one taking over from him. He is visible, and has the advantage that the little scrotes are known to him, as he is local. The pity is that there would need to be three of them (with the same level of commitment) to provide adequate cover.

On the occasionns where is is not on duty and I have had to call PC's to deal with ongoing problems, they have not handed over any details to him, now I ring his personal mobile as well - this is not an breakdown in comms that can be blamed on him, but on the "grownup" police that are percieved as so great!
 
#17
Sorry to put a dent in Captain Heroics character for you but they don't answer to him and aren't expected to go and find him to tell him they have dealth with an incident on the beat he covers. Well unless you want to see them off the streets for longer so they can go and speak to several PCSO's per day.

Its his job to go onto the Command and Control Log of incidents on his beat (Which the bobbies have to type up/have typed up by the radio room for every incident) since he has been off and bring himself up to speed what other Police Assets have been doing in his area then plan his patrol accordingly.

Sounds like a nice fella however if he is telling you otherwise I'd be asking why he doesn't carry out these simple daily checks?
 
#18
I didn't say they were answerable to him, and he hasn't complained to me about not being told, but he has said he "hadn't seen any mention of that", which would imply he looked at something.

However, I have no idea how it is organised, so I won't get in to an arguement on it.

Just wanted to say that not all the PCSO's are rubbish (and I'm sure not all PC's are steely eyed "Dixons of Dock Green" who would all be out pounding the beat if it was not for that nasty Home Office and it's unreasonable paperwork). There are good and bad in every role and job, it's managements job to encourage one and control the other, if there is a large number of bad, it can be seen as a management failing as much as anything.
 
#19
speaking as someone with loads of experience of managing PCSO's i personlly think the money would be better spent on employing civillians to do our paperwork for us so we can get straight back out onto the street.

Trotsky
 
#20
IT_Guy said:
Bradstyley said:
Its just, what are they for??? Most of the PCSOs you see are fcuk-all use to the community, the ones I see round my neck of the woods would struggle to catch a cold, let alone suspects, why not just train the ones good enough to be proper cops up and fcuk the rest off, putting their budget into real old bill?
Because in case you haven't noticed 'real' plod have lost the use of their legs and are too important to walk the streets, the whole point of PCSO's (or 'lost shoppers' as they're referred to around here) is that they have the simple job of showing a presence on the streets.

If you employed yet more 'real' plod they would disappear into the station with the rest - we have record numbers of them already in case you hadn't realised.
no. it's because we spend all of our time chasing call after call of chav generated crap.

As everyone has inalienable 'rights' to police investigating their crap even if they've never paid a penny into the system, there arent enough coppers to walk the streets, even if, like me, you enjoy doing it!
 

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