Plan to extend anti-terror laws. Why???

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by mad_mac, May 27, 2007.

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  1. I have just read with interest this article:

    More draconian powers

    The outgoing PM has also decided to write an article in the Times explaining why he thinks it is all our fault as a society that 3 suspected terrorists have absconded in breech of their control orders. See link below:

    The Times article by the PM

    I am currently reading through this article and am coming to the conclusion that it is the disjointed, inaccurate rhetorical ramblings of a sociopath. In my pursuit of current affairs I have come across this little gem:

    Database to hold all UK populations DNA

    Linking all of these stories together and, no doubt, numerous others, it is difficult not to draw a parallel with a control obsessed government seeking to emancipate the electorate.

    This government seeks to distance itself from all forms of accountability and to remove the ideology of representative democracy from its political manifesto, yet it wishes the electorate to support it in its quest by exonerating itself of guilt and responsibility by the inclusion of fear.

    Democracy is a fragile ideology, which has been eroded to near extinction by this government. By its very nature, democracy must be a compromise. How can the imposition of internment in the UK, stop and search without reasonable cause, DNA registration for all UK nationals uphold democracy? This pending legislation is the very antithesis of the meaning of democracy.

    Is this my Sunday paranoia surfacing, or do fellow ARRSERS share my views?

    Edited for shite spelling
  2. In answer to the question posed in the thread title.

    Bliar read 1984, as any good Labour activist should, and immediately decided that it was aspirational as well as inspirational.

    He is trying his best to get us all talking Newspeak. Lets face it, Whitehall IS the Ministry of Truth!


  3. The answer is groupthink, stupidity and a lack of strong leadership.
  4. I totally share your view on these matters M_M. There is an article in Mail Online that reveals a secret unit was set up last year by the Labour Government, designed to section dissidents under the Mental Health Act as a means of protecting "public figures". This clearly emulates the actions of the Stalinist regime in the USSR at the height of its horrors.

    We shall shortly be celebrating three important anniversaries, Falklands Liberation Day (14th June 1982) ; Waterloo Day (18th June 1815) and Battle of Britain Day (15th September 1940) – historic British victories in defence of liberty and sovereignty. A lot has changed since Churchill and "the few" and Margaret Thatcher’s government, each stood firm in defence of freedom.

    Many of us feel that Britain is no longer a free country, and that we have ceased to be “an example” or “a beacon of hope” to the world. But, with determination, we can recover our lost British freedom, identity and independence – and restore our traditional role in the world.
  5. As the beeb article says:
    I was going to say I await the diplock courts but:
    What next?[​IMG]
  6. Are you trying to say that you are for the way that civil liberties and human rights have taken over our country, that daft policies that place the rights of the criminal before the victim.

    Prisons overcrowded: don't reduce the length of sentences double them, make prison a true detterent.

    Someone acting suspiciously then the cops should be able to act even if it is on just a hunch. Including stopping motorists who drive in a manner that could indicate no licence therefore no insurance.

    DNA database/National ID card: for both of these "got something to hide?" these things protect the civil liberties of the innocent, the right to live in a safe environment. As for an ID card well I, like so many, have carried one for years it's called a MOD F 90. Many other countries seem to manage well with ID cards so why should the UK be any different.

    In case you think I'm Bliar's biggest fan, I'm not. Personally speaking he's a t*sser of a smiling assassin.
  7. There's an obvious analogy here with a very strict father imposing all sorts of draconian rules on his offspring and then wondering why they're disobeyed. All Phoney Tony's after (and indeed lots of other politicians) is a populace in perpetual fear of putting a foot wrong in the mistaken belief that this will cause all wrong-doing to cease. The GDR tried it too, and we all know how well that worked out.

    In an age in which a very large section of the population is as well (if not better) educated as the politicians, the gobment needs to finally bin the self-serving and comfortable attitude that it knows best and begin to include the people it's meant to serve in a meaningful way. That would, however, mean that the likes of Phoney Tony and his ilk would lose some of their advantages and privileges. Thus, it'll never happen. What a shame.

  8. No, but I am sick of hearing the usual defence of 'if you've nothing to hide then you have nothing to fear' - the Nazis used to use that one as an excuse for bringing in draconian laws that, eventually, criminalised everyone. My privacy is very important to me and this does not include being hauled over and my DNA taken 'just to make sure you are who you say you are'.

    As has been pointed out many times on this site, dictatorship does not come crashing in the front door wearing a swastika, but stealthily through the back door.
  9. Indeed
    ... to quote the old saying "All that is needed for evil to triumph is that good men do nothing" least most of us on arrse are trying to do something!
  10. No doubt people have complained about censors and such since the time of the Romans: seeing them as infringement of their civil liberties too.
  11. Draconian: adj. (especially of laws) excessively harsh and severe.

    Do drastic times not merit drastic measures? How many more terrorist cells are out there waiting to kill members of the British public.
  12. Bliars article written in the Times in radically flawed:

    Bliar wrote:

    That has never been the governments aim. The imposition of its political will by any means possible, including the Parliament Act if a Bill fails to go through. This was used for the Hunting Bill, hardly a subject of National Security :x

    Bliar wrote:

    Let us not forget that after John Majors Conservative government was voted out, the introduction of the Human Rights Act 1998 was on Labours party manifesto. It became law in 2000 incorporating the ECHR Act. Bliar by meddling in European legislative matters sowed the seeds of this disaster.

    Bliar wrote:

    And was given 28 days instead, more than sufficient time without moving to UK internment.

    Bliar wrote:

    No Department is responsible for this disaster except for the British Electorate. What absolute unadulterated rubbish :x

    Bliar wrote:

    Britain is starting to become an inhospitalble place for all to live in. Criminalisation of the masses is just the starting point.

    It should also be noted that control orders include the powers to "stop and search" without reasonable cause. Therefor, why is this Government attempting to introduce legislation for use against the public at large were there is NO cause for suspicion.

    Bliar wrote:

    One was removed by downright lies :x .

    An oversimplistic and childlike justification. The historical legacy has been one where both countries were covertly supported and funded by democractic countries to control the spread of global communism. After the overthrow of both these countries dictators a weak, thinly veiled democratic puppet government was approved initially by the invading countries. This political vacuity caused the fracture of the countries back to tribal areas and acted as a catalyst for all and sundry to exert their military wil. (No doubt, the terrorists are sponsored by non democratic states: What comes around goes around perhaps).

    Bliar wrote:

    As all forms of terrorism should NOT be negotiated with. Why has he contradicted his principles and negotiated with terrorists in the Province. He has pandered to its sense of grievance and has legitimised terrorism as a means to obtain political power :x
  13. I wasn't in the UK during the time of all the IRA attacks, but if I remember correctly, there was no drastic increase in such limitations on freedom. And at that time, there was a real and present danger. It makes you wonder about the true motives behind all this recent activity.

  14. Probably the same amount as 2 to 3 decades ago.

    The introduction of more draconian laws will do little to protect the public.

    Increased vigilance and stricter border controls controlled by human operators, not biometric computers will aid protection.

    Placing the whole UK under surveillance will hardly further the governments cause, and will certainly have a minimal impact on terrorist activities.
  15. I'm with you there Bugsy - I seem to recall that civpop were reminded to be careful (persec if you like), the only other thing is we were told not to wear uniform off duty (persec again).