PIAT

Indeed.

No offence intended, but you seem to have what I have heard squaddies describe as "an officer's body" :-D

So, that's all right then.

Perhaps you should sew a set of Captain's pips on the epaulettes for total authenticity :thumleft:
And CCF shoulder titles, naturally :p
 
Well, as much as BD fitted anyone, ever!
It looked splendid on the sturdy, workmanlike frame of the broad at the shoulder, lean at the hip 16 year-old Cadet Stonker :-D

On the pear-shaped 65 year old that I have become, I'm confident it would look somewhat less dashing.

It is, however, a triumph of hope over reason to drape it on the bodies of tall, skinny folk and expect it to make them look like warriors to the manner born :-D
 
Now that the old buggers on here have stopped reminiscing about hessian sacks tied in the middle by string, shall we return to the subjects of spigots?

As I worry for your sanity, and your brains sinking into a stupor from lack of mental exercise, I'm not going to give you the answers to this one. Just post a picture for your to ponder, as it is indeed a tricky one. But I promise you it is Spigot related.

 
Now that the old buggers on here have stopped reminiscing about hessian sacks tied in the middle by string, shall we return to the subjects of spigots?

As I worry for your sanity, and your brains sinking into a stupor from lack of mental exercise, I'm not going to give you the answers to this one. Just post a picture for your to ponder, as it is indeed a tricky one. But I promise you it is Spigot related.

You are mistaken. I have been indeed been exercising my mental throughout the last couple of thread drifts conversations :thumleft: Don't be so narrow-minded :-D

And I'm going to speculate that the US Paratrooper posing in your picture has a spigot mortar/baseplate of some type dangling below his reserve parachute.

I'm guessng that the's got ammo and ancillaries stowed in the saddlebags on his hips.

I'm a bit perplexed that he's only got retro-rockets strapped to his right shin, though.
 

daz

LE
You are mistaken. I have been indeed been exercising my mental throughout the last couple of thread drifts conversations :thumleft: Don't be so narrow-minded :-D

And I'm going to speculate that the US Paratrooper posing in your picture has a spigot mortar/baseplate of some type dangling below his reserve parachute.

I'm guessng that the's got ammo and ancillaries stowed in the saddlebags on his hips.

I'm a bit perplexed that he's only got retro-rockets strapped to his right shin, though.

That's so he can "turn cartwheels across the floor", mind you, if he does that, it might change his complexion to a "whiter shade of pale" :)
 

HE117

LE
Now that the old buggers on here have stopped reminiscing about hessian sacks tied in the middle by string, shall we return to the subjects of spigots?

As I worry for your sanity, and your brains sinking into a stupor from lack of mental exercise, I'm not going to give you the answers to this one. Just post a picture for your to ponder, as it is indeed a tricky one. But I promise you it is Spigot related.

OSS Spigot gun.. an early form of off route mine.. warhead looks like a doughnut (..or should I say donut!)

Screws to a tree!
 
@stoatman do you know the people from the C&Arsenal channel ?

They are promoting a "gunsmith" called Mark Novak as some kind of master craftsman who's a bluffing twat and has no idea what he's doing, it makes me cringe the bolloux he comes out with.
 
OSS Spigot gun.. an early form of off route mine.. warhead looks like a doughnut (..or should I say donut!)

Screws to a tree!

Close, so very close.

It is the Tree Spigot Gun.
But its been mounted to a base plate, that allows 180 degree arc of firing, and the soldier is a US paratrooper, dated from just after the war.
 
I'm writing a narrative for a battlefield tour to Normandy that's supposed to happen in May, but doing it is good for the soul anyway. I'm using Chester Wilmot's 'Struggle for Europe' and the Official History and 'Stout Hearts' plus the relevant Battleground Europe booklets for detail. The perceived wisdom has always been that the PIAT and 6pdr gun were useless against Kraut tanks but I am amazed by the number of times that either or both were used to see them off. The PIAT may have been seen a last resort and the weapon of a brave soul but it was the last bang that a lot panzer crews heard. Similarly, the 6pdr firing APDS would go through the front armour of anything but a Jagdpanther at 500yds.

The entire anti-tank comparison thing appears to be skewed in favour of the Krauts. It's true that a 75mm KwK42 or 88mm KwK43 would go through all Allied tank front armour at 1000yds, but they would also go through all German front armour at the same range, and the British 17pdr, especially with APDS was just as good. The 6pdr is regarded as a poor second but using APDS was the equal of the Pak40 using APCR at normal engagement ranges and infinitely better than the Pak38, which was still in frontline use at VE Day.
 

HE117

LE
@stoatman do you know the people from the C&Arsenal channel ?

They are promoting a "gunsmith" called Mark Novak as some kind of master craftsman who's a bluffing twat and has no idea what he's doing, it makes me cringe the bolloux he comes out with.
I dunno..

I do a fair bit of gunsmithing here and there, and Mark is pretty good at the sort of things he does. I don't think I would let him near a pair of Hollands but for the restoration and maintenance of the guns he is dealing with, I don't think he is that bad. I think he is the best of the YouTube gunsmiths.. and is the only one that seems to be realistic about what he does.. If you think Mark is a bodger, you should look at Larry and Jack..


I am in 100% agreement with his philosophy that old guns need to be maintained, and that "Patina" in many cases = "Corrosion". Old guns need to be stripped down to the metal every so often to make sure there is no corrosion happening. Now that we have stopped regularly cleaning old guns with boiling water, the mechanism that kept blue, blue has in many cases ceased, and old guns are turning brown. If you look at the state of many of the guns that end up with Mark, he is not often starting in a good place. A combination of age, mishandling and neglect added to a total lack of spares makes it hard to do renovation on some of these cases. As you may have noticed, I do quite a lot of similar work, and you never know what you will find! You just have to apply basic principles and do what you need to do. Like sausages, the consumer is probably better not looking at the manufacturing process! I do cringe sometimes at his use of a hand drill, but to be honest, if you need a hole "there!" often using a hand drill is the only practical way to do it.. electric if you have the nerve!

I will agree that his workshop appears somewhat primitive, however from my own experience, this is something of the nature of the beast. He is not manufacturing or working on a limited class of arms and therefore has to deal with whatever comes in the door. Gunsmithing is an odd trade that sits somewhere between woodwork and metalwork; chemistry and physics; art, science and engineering; black magic and religion! I think that to be a good gunsmith, you need:

1. A BFO Vice with lead jaws and a horse.
2. Polished hammers and punches
3. Lots of files
4. Really, Really sharp chisels.
5. Proper turnscrews.

.... and not a lot else (except knowing how to use the above)! @Ravers - you may wish to comment?

Traditionally the UK gunsmithing trade was made up from a bunch of individuals who would pass work from one to another to get specific things done. This is becoming much more difficult as the pool of expertise shrinks.

Mark gets the reputation for being a bit of an Agraglas queen.. well I don't have a problem with this, as it is by far the best medium for repairing stock damage and if you listen to what he is actually saying, he does understand the forces he is dealing with and how to make repairs that address the underlying problems. His treatment of the Ferguson with the blown stock in the last posting is absolutely on the money, and having built one of these I think I am qualified to comment.. (though I don't agree with his loading sequence...)

He is however a: A good ole southern boy, and b: an ex nuclear bubbler, so we need to factor this into the equation!
 
Last edited:

HE117

LE
"...and this part, sir, is what I use to poke holes in Panzers!"
...are we looking at the coat here? Looks like it will stop most things!
 

QRK2

LE
I'm writing a narrative for a battlefield tour to Normandy that's supposed to happen in May, but doing it is good for the soul anyway. I'm using Chester Wilmot's 'Struggle for Europe' and the Official History and 'Stout Hearts' plus the relevant Battleground Europe booklets for detail. The perceived wisdom has always been that the PIAT and 6pdr gun were useless against Kraut tanks but I am amazed by the number of times that either or both were used to see them off. The PIAT may have been seen a last resort and the weapon of a brave soul but it was the last bang that a lot panzer crews heard. Similarly, the 6pdr firing APDS would go through the front armour of anything but a Jagdpanther at 500yds.

The entire anti-tank comparison thing appears to be skewed in favour of the Krauts. It's true that a 75mm KwK42 or 88mm KwK43 would go through all Allied tank front armour at 1000yds, but they would also go through all German front armour at the same range, and the British 17pdr, especially with APDS was just as good. The 6pdr is regarded as a poor second but using APDS was the equal of the Pak40 using APCR at normal engagement ranges and infinitely better than the Pak38, which was still in frontline use at VE Day.
One thing that I was not aware of was considerable issues with the 17pdr's accuracy - at least according to @California_Tanker 's videos.
 
The perceived wisdom has always been that the PIAT and 6pdr gun were useless against Kraut tanks but I am amazed by the number of times that either or both were used to see them off.
Then you already have your answer... If they saw them off, then the wisdom was wrong.

Keep in mind a PIAT will punch a hole through the front armour of a Tiger.

The problem is a modern one, not a contemporary one. I do have a theory on it, but its only a rough theory. In 1940 the British Army was beaten in a relatively short period of time. This was attributed to the German use of the Panzer. During, and just after the war it was impossible to criticise and say that the reason for the defeat was down to having no tanks in France as a core part of the force, and then having to rush them over at speed, and that sort of operation never ends well.
After the war you get various retired senior officers, normally with chips on their shoulders trying to self promote, and they would not be to blame for the failures, so it always gets passed onto how superior Blitzkrieg was, and that there's a nameless cabal of officers who wanted to go back to horses etc etc (Hobart, I'm looking at you!). These officers would then be interviewed, or publish books.
Equally, feeding into this you had various phenomenon such as the Tiger, and its legend. Then sprinkle on a bit of British self-depreciation and not wanting to boast. All in all there was a hand aura of German superiority that explains why the British got beaten.

Now, keep magnifying that by each successive generation, as writers strive to give more oomph to their works, and Britian's war efforts are reduced to comical desperation, that just seems to work.

The PIAT is a prime example of this. Google the PIAT and you get works like these:

Note the wording carefully chosen to give a negative comical view of the weapon. Meanwhile the German's and US are unfairly held up as optimum answers to everything. Yet, as I proved earlier when I posted the comparison table, the PIAT is superior to both the Bazooka, and the much praised Panzerfaust.

The entire anti-tank comparison thing appears to be skewed in favour of the Krauts. It's true that a 75mm KwK42 or 88mm KwK43 would go through all Allied tank front armour at 1000yds, but they would also go through all German front armour at the same range, and the British 17pdr, especially with APDS was just as good. The 6pdr is regarded as a poor second but using APDS was the equal of the Pak40 using APCR at normal engagement ranges and infinitely better than the Pak38, which was still in frontline use at VE Day.
You're getting it!

First, remember the average range for engagements was 600 yards in 21st AG. Equally the most common opponent was a German with a Rifle, then a German with a Machine gun, then a German with a Panzerfaust. Suddenly, that 75mm QF HE round looks very tasty.
German technology was behind British. Their armour was of lower quality, and as they lacked certain critical materials they tended to build bigger to compensate. Somewhere on here I had an disagreement with someone about weapon penetration and calibres of tank guns. He was rather surprised to find that a 6-pounder has nearly the same performance as a German 75mm.
 

Latest Threads

Top