Photos that make you think.

The Israeli soldiers performance in 1973 was nothing short of astonishing... but then they knew what would happen if they failed.

I read somewhere about one of the tank bn commanders on the Golan telling his crews something along the lines of "If we lose, we lose everything. There is nowhere else to go".

Powerful stuff...
Pretty much like Fighter Command during the Battle of Britain.
 
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Strangely enough, I read about this a couple of weeks ago, which lead me to finding the following link for further reading
TL; DR
It's possible, but unlikely he was scalped, there was no 'prior art' and the Generals cap was damaged in a way suggesting a round ran along the side of his head.
Thanks for that. I think the wounds are consistent with a high velocity round and there is no record of Tommy's mutilating bodies like that. The article I posted was the first time I'd even heard of the accusation of scalping. I wonder what the authors agenda is and why he/she would want to accuse the soldiers of such an act.
 

OneTenner

LE
Book Reviewer
Possibly just ignorance? It could well be that they had more exposure to atrocities on the eastern battlegrounds, heard hooves and thought Zebras not Horses...
I will say that the position of the body is strange, the position of the two Dutch rifles jars in my mind also but hey, theres bigger conpiracies come out of that period in history.
 
I will say that the position of the body is strange, the position of the two Dutch rifles jars in my mind also but hey, theres bigger conpiracies come out of that period in history.
As to the position of the bodies. They were moved/dragged from the vehicle post mortem. I can imagine the order, "Pte. Smith, check those bodies for anything of intelligence value"
Pte Smith would not have necessarily been very careful when dragging the bodies out. A quick rummage through the pockets and on to the next contact.
As to the "placement" of the Dutch rifles, that could be just the photographer taking a bit of license (as happened quite a lot).
But as you say, stranger and more important conspiracies came out of that period.

Edited to add. Pte Smith would have undoutedly been Trooper Smith, before the airbourne fraternity on here give me a row!
 
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To be fair, having looked at his picture, Kussin looked s if he came "pre-scalped".
 
fijiSm21.jpg

Credit: Photo and most of the info from '212 Soldiers for the Queen' By David Tough


Nothing unusual here so apart from being a nice, even heart-warming, photo of a couple of pals who are clearly proud of gaining their wings, what qualifies this to be a photo to think about?

Jake Tulele and Eroni Kuroi were members of a select group, known as The 212, named so because the group were the 200 hundred men and 12 women of the first tranche of Fijians recruited by a team that went to Fiji in 1961. The British Army had already sent recruiting teams to the Seychelles and the West Indies but it Fijians that were remembered as a group.
The recruiting team was under instruction to limit the number of recruits to 100, in the end they brought double that number back,
The response to the drive was overwhelming, most wanted to go for the adventure and the experience, none seemed to have been lured by the thought of UK residence.

At this distance in time, it's difficult to imagine the impact of the 'First Fijians, there was of course the legendary Talaiasi Labalaba, the hero of Mirbat, but also others like WO2 Tom Morell GM who really was one of those on the balcony.

Lesser known perhaps is Lt Mikaele (Mike Yasa), 2nd Green Jackets(KRRC), commissioned from the ranks who led his platoon on a highly successful Claret cross -border raid during Confrontation who went on to serve in the Republic of Fiji Military Forces in the Sinai and Lebanon. Later he became Fiji's counsel in Auckland and an ordained minister in NZ.

About a third of the intake completed their 22 years, the rest completing their initial engagements with very few leaving prematurely. I found it really interesting to read of their post Army careers whether in Fijian politics, education or the church.

A fascinating episode in British military history where a group of young men and women came halfway around the world to add to the fabric of the British Army and win the wide-spread esteem of their service contemporaries-and rugby fans.
 
Pretty much like Fighter Command during the Battle of Britain.
And the BEF at Ypres in Oct / Nov 1914.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
 

Tyk

LE
Pretty much like Fighter Command during the Battle of Britain.
Not denigrating the efforts of Fighter Command, but I suspect that the Israeli's had a tad more to lose, due in no small part to the stated intent of various Arab leaders and clerics to exterminate the country and its population.
Those lads knew that their entire family as well as their way of life was at stake.
 
Not denigrating the efforts of Fighter Command, but I suspect that the Israeli's had a tad more to lose, due in no small part to the stated intent of various Arab leaders and clerics to exterminate the country and its population.
Those lads knew that their entire family as well as their way of life was at stake.
If Fighter Command, failed Israeli in all probability would not existed. So fine are the margins when its all or nothing.
 

Tyk

LE
If Fighter Command, failed Israeli in all probability would not existed. So fine are the margins when its all or nothing.
Quite likely that if Britain had fallen Israel would never have come into existence, but that's arguably not the point of this thread. The impact of those photographs of Israeli soldiers is real, not as real as their achievements.
 



This lone KV -1 stopped an entire German Kampfgruppe for one day in June 1941


A single KV-1 or KV-2 tank (accounts vary) advanced far behind the German lines after attacking a column of German trucks. The tank stopped on a road across soft ground and was engaged by four 50 mm anti-tank guns of the 6th Panzer Division's anti-tank battalion. The tank was hit several times but fired back and disabled all four enemy AT guns. A heavy 88 mm gun of the divisional anti-aircraft battalion was moved about 730 m (800 yd) behind the lone Soviet tank but was knocked out by the tank before it could manage to score a hit. During the night, German combat engineers tried to destroy the tank with satchel charges but failed despite possibly damaging the vehicle's tracks. Early on the morning of June 25, German tanks fired on the KV from the nearby woodland while another 88 mm gun fired at the tank from its rear. Of several shots fired, only two managed to penetrate the tank. German infantry then advanced towards the KV tank and it responded with machine-gun fire against them. Eventually, the tank was knocked out by grenades thrown into the hatches. According to some accounts, the dead crew was recovered and buried by the approaching German soldiers with full military honors, while in other accounts, the crew escaped from their crippled tank during the night.[17]

The 6th Panzer Division Kampfgruppe commander, General Erhard Raus, described it as a KV-1, which was damaged by several shots from an 88 mm anti-tank gun fired from behind the vehicle, while it was distracted by light Panzer 35(t) tanks from Panzer Battalion 65.[h] The KV-1 crew were killed by a pioneer engineer unit who pushed grenades through two holes made by the AT gun while the turret began moving again, with the other five or six shots having not fully penetrated. Apparently, the KV-1 crew had only been stunned by the shots which had entered the turret and were buried nearby with military honors by the German unit.[18]

In 1965, the remains of the crew were exhumed and reburied at the Soviet military cemetery in Raseiniai. According to research by Russian military historian Maksim Kolomiets, the tank may have been from the 3rd Company of the 1st Battalion of the 4th Tank Regiment, itself a part of the 2nd Tank Division. It is impossible to identify the crew because their personal documents were lost after being buried in the woods north of Raseiniai during the retreat, possibly by German troops.[19]
 
View attachment 479216
Credit: Photo and most of the info from '212 Soldiers for the Queen' By David Tough

At this distance in time, it's difficult to imagine the impact of the 'First Fijians, there was of course the legendary Talaiasi Labalaba, the hero of Mirbat, but also others like WO2 Tom Morell GM who really was one of those on the balcony.
To respectively add for the record - Jim Vak and Tak were on the same squadron as those mentioned above. Tak, was seriously wounded at Mirbat, not that ever slowed him up.
 

syrup

LE



This lone KV -1 stopped an entire German Kampfgruppe for one day in June 1941
Interestingly I was reading a piece about the Matilda in 1940 in France and how the British attacked the Germans.
One SS Regiment is reported as having "fled" when their anti tank shells bounced off the Matilda's and they also gave a good account against the Mark 1 & 2 Panzers.
It was only Rommel being more aggressive dropping artillery on his own positions and destroying farm houses and property that drove the British back.
After that the Germans went down the line of big guns and thick armour
I would imagine this helped them down that route also
 

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