Petrol firm suspends chip-and-pin

#1
Petrol giant Shell has suspended chip-and-pin payments in 600 UK petrol stations after more than £1m was siphoned out of customers' accounts.
Eight people, including one from Guildford, Surrey and another from Portsmouth, Hants, have been arrested in connection with the fraud inquiry.

The Association of Payment Clearing Services (Apacs) said the fraud related to just one petrol chain.

Shell said it hoped to reintroduce chip-and-pin as soon as possible.

Plastic crime

The racket is being investigated by the Metropolitan Police cheque and plastic crime unit.

"These Pin pads are supposed to be tamper resistant, they are supposed to shut down, so that has obviously failed," said Apacs spokeswoman Sandra Quinn.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/4980190.stm
 
#4
Plastic crime unit - presumable that will be staffed with plastic policemen ;)

msr
 
#6
How many millions of our money did the banks spend on this system, which seems to have lasted about 3 months before a major fraud is discovered?
 
#7
This takes me back to late night discussions in the banking and finance world that I used to inhabit. There I was told the main reason for chip and pin had noting to do with security or fraud. When Chip and Pin first went into France I was told that C&P would mean that clearing houses would be closed as there were no vouchers to be checked manually and so staff could be lost. Insurance covered the losses that ocurred from the technology and so the companies were happy. The other services were then to be moved to India and Eastern Europe and so less money was to be spent on staffing and therefore more went into profits.

I thought it was a joke at first!

P

The next thing will be biometric chip and pin and the death of internet shopping I suppose if this is not an isolated occurence. There are a number of companies that no longer support internet shopping because of fraud.
 
C

cloudbuster

Guest
#8
This is the same petrol supplier who decided last year that they would no longer accept payment by cheque, due to 'security issues'.
 
#10
Padre said:
This takes me back to late night discussions in the banking and finance world that I used to inhabit. There I was told the main reason for chip and pin had noting to do with security or fraud. When Chip and Pin first went into France I was told that C&P would mean that clearing houses would be closed as there were no vouchers to be checked manually and so staff could be lost. Insurance covered the losses that ocurred from the technology and so the companies were happy. The other services were then to be moved to India and Eastern Europe and so less money was to be spent on staffing and therefore more went into profits.

I thought it was a joke at first!

P

The next thing will be biometric chip and pin and the death of internet shopping I suppose if this is not an isolated occurence. There are a number of companies that no longer support internet shopping because of fraud.
The other main reason for the introduction of chip and pin is that under the old system banks and retailers picked up the bill for any fraud because it was considered their fault for not checking signatures properly but under chip and pin the responsibility now rests on the consumer. If someone manages to use your chip and pin card its (normally) because you were slack with your pin.
 
#11
Cheques still require clearing house staff and so I notice that BP are next in banning their use as of 1st of June. Another nail in the coffin of banking staff and also a knock at the poorer families who may be given a cheque account but not a card. Also stops people writing a cheque which will have funds when the cheque clears but not when it was written. Insufficient funds at the time of purchase equals 'no sale' - though on the margins are marginalised further still!

P
 
#12
ViroBono said:
How many millions of our money did the banks spend on this system, which seems to have lasted about 3 months before a major fraud is discovered?
OldRedCap's Crime Prevention Theory #1. "What one man invents, another man circumvents" Saved my employer fortunes when the snake oil salesmen from securiy systems came calling
 
#13
I don’t know if anyone has noticed but b4 you handed over your card and you used your signature to confirm your transaction, now u type in your 4 digit number, which is obvious to those behind you and the cahier, not exactly rocket science for fraud is it?
 
#14
The fraud is relating to a tapping of the machine, not people watching from behind. Those from behind have to then steal your card in the case you mentioned, not especially easy.

My signature is unfortunately too easy to forge, I feel much safer with chip and pin. I have also noticed that people look away why I type my pin in, anyone watching tends to be quite obvious.

They reckon the introduction of chip and pin has increased violence related crimes slightly, but has reduced card crime massively. Remember in the old days all you had to do was copy that magnetic signature and write in a signature (or steal/find a card and copy the signature). With chip and pin the personal data is more secure.

Sorry, but I like it and I think it will overall reduce fraud, it will have its problems, like any new system, but don't shoot it down before giving it a proper chance.
 
#15
PartTimePongo said:
Petrol giant Shell has suspended chip-and-pin payments in 600 UK petrol stations after more than £1m was siphoned out of customers' accounts.
Eight people, including one from Guildford, Surrey and another from Portsmouth, Hants, have been arrested in connection with the fraud inquiry.

The Association of Payment Clearing Services (Apacs) said the fraud related to just one petrol chain.

Shell said it hoped to reintroduce chip-and-pin as soon as possible.

Plastic crime

The racket is being investigated by the Metropolitan Police cheque and plastic crime unit.

"These Pin pads are supposed to be tamper resistant, they are supposed to shut down, so that has obviously failed," said Apacs spokeswoman Sandra Quinn.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/4980190.stm

In my opinion, I personally think that biometrics using a thumbprint would be a lot easier instead of chip and pin because in my own experience it is a nightmare.

No end of times I have been shopping in the local supermarket and the cashier have said my pin number have not worked although it was the supermarkets fault because the machine kept playing up so I have had to put my signature on the transaction instead

The machine are so small and for some one who as other problems its a nightmare to use
 
#16
France has had chip and PIN for a while now. OK until someone invented the "yes card" which authorises the transaction regardless of the PIN you type in.

C
 
#17
Criminals. Where there's a will, there's a way. The more money that's involved, the more elaborate the method of parting you from it. My advice is to keep a close eye on ALL Banks or Multinationals.
 
G

Goku

Guest
#18
Signatures can be forged.
Magnetic strips and chips can be copied.
Passwords can be hacked.
As for biometrics, all you need is a cut on your thumb or a bloodshot eye and all of a sudden it’s “computer says no”.

What ever system is in place, someone will find a way to fook you.
Can we go back to using livestock as currency?
 
#19
Goku said:
Signatures can be forged.
Magnetic strips and chips can be copied.
Passwords can be hacked.
As for biometrics, all you need is a cut on your thumb or a bloodshot eye and all of a sudden it’s “computer says no”.

What ever system is in place, someone will find a way to fook you.
Can we go back to using livestock as currency?
Quite right Goku. The problems occur when the **** retentives in the finance industry think that the latest whizzo scheme is perfect. Then they blame customers / retailers, anyone but themselves when things go wrong. I was at a meeting with some senior banking types discussing an IS security scheme which they thought was the mutt's nuts. I said nope, this is how you break it. And the answer was... "I don't think we want to hear that Mr. C". It's not as if I invented the hack. I'd seen it posted on the internet.

As for biometrics - what rubbish. What do you do if the database is broken into? Change your iris? (Also have a look at how things are re verified if an error occurs. If it is less secure than the original verification be afraid).

C
 

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