Pensions for the TA

Discussion in 'Army Reserve' started by Purple_Emperor, Dec 9, 2004.

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    I especially like the last bit, gives me a warm, fuzzy feeling that the work we all do is so valued by the MoD :roll:
  2. Shock horror does this mean the MOD doesn't believe in the one Army concept?
  3. The Army has no Pension Fund, For Regulars its a Non-Contributory Pension, and is paid by the MOD from a 'Central funds' on retirement.

    Like Motor Insurance, Building Insurance & Personal Liability Insurance. The MOD do not pay any and keeps no reserves, and pays out as & when, and probably saves the govenment 1,000's in the process!

    So how the TA think they have a Pension Fund I do not know!

    As an ex Regular PSI and retired TA Warrant Officer I know the differance!
    That is not to say you should not get one, I think you should based on a yearly percentage of days paid. Bearing in mind your Bounty payment may be affected!
  5. To you and me maybe!
  6. I understand that but I wouldn't mind it going if it was replaced with a pension. I'm not so sure if the bountiess intended purpose actually works, it mainly effects when people will leave the TA (i.e. If I decided to leave I'd now wait until April/May)

    A number of us put a lot of time into the TA (about 8 hours Mon-Fri browsing this website :twisted: :twisted: )
  7. BuggerAll

    BuggerAll LE Book Reviewer Kit Reviewer

    Brig Stephen Andrews, DPS(A), Upavon, has this to say about pensions in 'Soldier' of Dec 04 (Page 49)

    "I should have make it clear that, while there is no recognisable deduction from our pay towards our pension, the Armed Forces Pay Review Body does apply a percentage abatement to the comparator pay in recognition of the value of our pension. Therefore, although we don't actually pay anything ourselves, the abatement does have the same overall effect of having written a cheque."

    I'd like to know what is happening to the money from my 'virtual cheque'. Up untill I read that I was not entirly convinced that we should get pension, but now as I've discovered that I've been making virtual contributions I want one.

    How do I get hold of the lawyer in Leeds and make sure he has seen the article in Soldier
  8. Any ideas about what return you'd get for popping the bounty into a stakeholder pension? (This I'd like to point out is in no way suggested as an alternative to the posts just gone; just askin')
  9. TA rates of pay are linked to Regular Army rates of pay.

    TA rates are normally the "on appointment" scale and do not have annual increments based on length of service.

    Brig. Stephen Andrews is right that the Armed Forces Pay Review Body does apply a percentage abatement to the comparator pay in recognition of the value of a pension.

    The TA have always had this abatement deducted from their pay.

    THE MOD has known about this for a long time but is holding off making any decision until a test case has been heard. Taking the MOD to court is usually career limiting.

    If the MOD loses, they can either: -
    1. Refund all the abatements (which will require a lot of individual calculations) or
    2. Offer a pension.

    Don't think however that the pension will be substantial or comparable to a Regular Army pension. It will be based on the number of days served.
  10. Maybe the invisible cheque gets paid as your bounty (but if thats the case how come bounty hunters get the same amount?)
  11. Sorry Mike but you are, simply, wrong. Non contributory means that you do not actually have to pay into it, not that it does not exist. Even if there where no contributions going into it - an Unfunded scheme - benefits can still accrue. This is actually the way that private sector penions in Germany work.

    Under the Treaty of Rome, pensions are deferred pay. ( Article 117? ) Case law and EU legislation shows that part time workers should have the same pensions rights as full time employees - this actually came about as part of a sex discrimination case, (Colorol, but Barber vs. GRE comes into it ) in which part time staff did not get a pension, full time staff did. The part timers wher all female: the case was that this was indirect sex part time workers have to be offered penion rights.

    Us STABs are part timers ( continued P.95 )
  12. I did not mean that the Army has no Pension Scheme! It clearly has, only that no money is 'ringfenced' or invested as in a civil scheme. I also pointed out that I feel that it should be extended to the TA on a percentage basis as now happens for some part-time workers.
  13. So if the courts decide that reserve service is pensionable are they likely to back date it, institute from a certain future point, pretend its the TD in reverse and say you have to have more than half your service to go in order to qualify? There must be an ex-ALS out there (who clearly won't have anything better to do now even the Army won't employ them :lol: )
  14. OldSnowy

    OldSnowy LE Moderator Book Reviewer

    In the past, I have paid as much of my TA pay as allowable into a personal pension, even though I have a work one, as my TA pay was not pensionable. I got tax relief on this. This allowance has ALWAYS been available, and I have frequently told my Troops about it (very few could be bothered, though). So, if a TA soldier was that concerned, he/she could have, already, started a tax-efficient pension scheme.

    This will allow a good let-out for the Government, if they are smart enough to notice (and some of them are, beleive me).

    Mind you, it's not a patch on a 'real' military pension - especially the Officer pension. I won't depress everyone not in that line of work (Regular Officer) by saying how much the non-contributory element is estimated at, but basically you could NOT buy your way into a pension scheme like that anywhere :D
  15. OldSnowy you've missed the point.

    I agree you could take your TA pay and invest it into a personal pension,

    BUT (here's the bit you won't like) your TA pay has already been reduced to make provision for a pension.

    That reduction is the abatement that goes towards the Armed Forces Pension Scheme (AFPS).

    Your pay has been reduced from the first day you joined the TA. But MOD has never granted you entitlement to an AFPS pension.

    So either they give you all the deductions (abatements) back or they give you a pension.