PAYD Slammed by soldiers

#1
Result of a poll on Armynet shows that 60% of soldiers think that Pay as you dine is not a good initiative.

from https://www.armynet.mod.uk/club/pages/menu/index.php



Do you believe 'pay as you dine' is a good initiative?

Yes

30%


No

60%


Undecided

10%


Total number of votes: 4257
Appeared on ArmyNET from 21/05/2007 to 28/05/2007


Incedentally, Bears also deficate in woods
 
#5
Yes - they did ask for the PAYD concept.

No - they did NOT ask for NAAFI monopoly and incopetence.
 
#6
remember the old sqn bars? naafi certainly did when payd came in out went the old sqn bars as naafi wanted no competiton in the way of their monoply.
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#7
And they've forced anything else that can be viewed as competition out of the way, which is a shame, a real shame.
 
#8
Was the 60% against PAYD all from Germany where NAAFI have the SLA or was the view the same for the UK contractors?

EC
 
#9
Not to mention the honesty bars that have be done away with too... no more carrying the motion on when you come back from town after a few scoops...
 
#11
fishfingers said:
drain_sniffer said:
Ahh, but its what the soldiers asked for.....wasnt it?
urm yes, back in 1994 when the guys were surveyed and when they could arguably manage their money; most of those are probably out now though.
I am sorry but that is just tosh.

Soldiers were having pay management problems in the 80s and 90s, just as I suspect they will now.

You get it, you spend it!
 
#12
What most lads wanted was a "fairer" system of eating and paying for food. I use the inverted commas because many did not realise some of hte perks from the old system.

Whislt it is true that people were paying for food they didn't eat, many did kick the arrse right out of it on a sat or sun morning/brunch. Likewise how many troop/sqn/regt barbcues or other functions were subsidised by said food not eaten?

Likewise, many of those who didn't eat just ate sh1te in their rooms. I know one lad who survived on a diet of pot noodle through the week, thank god he went home to his mummies cooking at the weekend otherwise he would have gone down with scurvy or something.

Now you 2pay as you dine" for everything you get out of the cookhouse, including the brew kits for the guardrooms, etc.

And as stated above, what no one expected was a NAAFI takeover of camps. If the mafia had taken over you could expect the "muscling" out of the sally bash and ywca. That was about the only thing you didn't see, NAAFI employees beating up the sally bash employees and putting their windows out, with threats of burning them out.

Have seen PAYD in a few places, and I ain't impressed.
 
#13
Currently working at a camp that has a rear party only , food in Sgts mess abysmal , have to decide at lunch which option u would like for evening meal , lots of options 'unavailable' no chance to peruse whats on offer before deciding. Cannot even help yourself to tea & coffee. Decidedly unimpressed.
 
#14
Sir_Prancealot said:
Currently working at a camp that has a rear party only , food in Sgts mess abysmal , have to decide at lunch which option u would like for evening meal , lots of options 'unavailable' no chance to peruse whats on offer before deciding. Cannot even help yourself to tea & coffee. Decidedly unimpressed.
Sir Prancealot, some questions!

Is this camp in UK or Gemany?

Define abysmal - food cold, tastes bad, uncooked, etc!

What has been the response from the master chef to your complaints?

If their response wasn't satisfactory have you contacted the contract monitoring officer?

Did they provide an explaination?

As to ordering in advance this is not new in a lot of messes - how do you think they avoid wasting food - it's not free!

Limited Core and retail offers should be available to choose from even when just catering for rear parties.

As for tea & coffee, it depends on what was asked to be provided by the CO and the contract staff. You could always take this issue up with the mess committee to make it available but someone has to pay for it in the long run.

EC
 
#15
Define poor food as , brown lettuce , slimy cucumber , chicken nuggets & chips, from retail menu £3 for chicken breast & that didn't include any veg or spuds. Tea & coffee is available upon request but again u have it brought out to you. Camp is mainland U.K. Catering is provided by contractors , apparently there is/was a messing meeting today so should find out next week the outcome of that. Mess manager is aware of the issues raised & is investigating issues regarding choice , meals sitting plated for hrs & freshness of produce.
 
#16
fishfingers said:
drain_sniffer said:
Ahh, but its what the soldiers asked for.....wasnt it?
urm yes, back in 1994 when the guys were surveyed and when they could arguably manage their money; most of those are probably out now though.
Sir, you are talking through your rectal trumpet. Soldiers were just as cr4p in the area of personal finance in those days; and to make matters worse officers (FFS) included sorting them out as part of their JD! All those young NIGs going out on their first weekend to NAAFI and coming back with stereos, cars and feck knows what else on the never-never!

As for PAYD, how come shitty carbs are included but healthy items of fruit is subject to extra charges??
 

DangerMouse

Old-Salt
Moderator
#17
I have avoided PAYD so far, I am pleased to say, although many of my friends are living with it at the moment. I envisage leaving the Army after my next tour, and I shan't be sad to avoid PAYD.

In Colchester, when 16 Air Asslt Bde moved from Aldershot, junior soldiers were accommodated in houses in town, as there wasn't enough SLA (Single Living Accommodation). Apparently it worked very well, and people were treated as 'grown-ups' and allowed to cook for themselves. Equally, most people in my peer group (captains-majors) jump at the opportunity to move out of the mess into SSSA accommodation. Officers' messes are like delpidated university Halls of Residence, with fading delusions of granduer ...and aspects of a creche, especially when alcohol's involved...

The problem with PAYD is that we're been delivered into the hands of a monopoly - we have no choice but to eat what we're offered and live with it (or live off takeaways). What if we changed our living model to either provide cooking facilities in all SLA so people can sort themselves out, or allow people to live out in 'civilisation' off barracks (with some sort of assistance - it's too expensive otherwise, and the Army sent you there, so they should assist)?
 

oldbaldy

LE
Moderator
#18
DangerMouse said:
What if we changed our living model to either provide cooking facilities in all SLA so people can sort themselves out, or allow people to live out in 'civilisation' off barracks (with some sort of assistance - it's too expensive otherwise, and the Army sent you there, so they should assist)?
That's the problem with the services, they have people who can think for themselves :roll:
 
#19
Cuddles said:
fishfingers said:
drain_sniffer said:
Ahh, but its what the soldiers asked for.....wasnt it?
urm yes, back in 1994 when the guys were surveyed and when they could arguably manage their money; most of those are probably out now though.
Sir, you are talking through your rectal trumpet. Soldiers were just as cr4p in the area of personal finance in those days; and to make matters worse officers (FFS) included sorting them out as part of their JD! All those young NIGs going out on their first weekend to NAAFI and coming back with stereos, cars and feck knows what else on the never-never!

As for PAYD, how come shitty carbs are included but healthy items of fruit is subject to extra charges??
Ok, Hands Up, I did say arguably - "Rectal Trumpet" :D
 
#20
DangerMouse said:
I have avoided PAYD so far, I am pleased to say, although many of my friends are living with it at the moment. I envisage leaving the Army after my next tour, and I shan't be sad to avoid PAYD.

The problem with PAYD is that we're been delivered into the hands of a monopoly - we have no choice but to eat what we're offered and live with it (or live off takeaways).
I'm disappointed DangerMouse that you are joining the many that condem PAYD without personnal experience.

PAYD in it's purest form is simply switching-off the food charge to the individual and giving them the freedom to choose how they spend their money for food.

Based on the pre-PAYD cunsumer suveys, less than 50% of 'livers-in' ate in their messes and so were paying twice for food.

The introduction of PAYD gives them the food charge back to spend how they see fit.

The Army has chosen to introduce PAYD as part of their roll-out of Super Multi-activity Contracts (SMAC) which would have been done anyway as NAAFI were leaving the UK and so Retail and Leisure facilities were needed for Junior Ranks. Adding PAYD once it was approved was not an after thought but a logical progression.

Whilst many seem to complain about what is provided by the contractors who deliver these services, they seem to forget that the majority of the chefs serving up the meals are the same military staff who were in the cookhouse previously.

Systems are in place if there are genuine problems and should be used but the biggest hinderance to change is the generalist comment that the system is crap, etc.

It's just unfortunate that I think you're in a PFI that tends to do things it's own way!

EC
 
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