Pay in the OTC

#1
I'm joining Manchester OTC in Septemberish and was just wondering (I'm sure many a reg will agree with me) why do the OTC get paid? From what I understand, we can't get mobilised. I know that OTC are used as staff with ACF, but it usually involves a lot of guard and then the mess. It just seems a bit silly, not that I'm complaining!! :D
 
#2
The Army doesn't pay OTC people anything, it's a cunning ruse. All the money they receive goes straight back into the bar. Pure psychological manipulation...

It doesn't have to pay for the raw booze either - companies love to sponsor OTCs and provide free stuff. For example, the last exercise in Denmark I was on many years ago was sponsored by Carlsberg, and our civilian task in Scotland was called the Johnny Walker Challenge.
 
#4
The Army doesn't pay OTC people anything, it's a cunning ruse. All the money they receive goes straight back into the bar. Pure psychological manipulation...
So I get drunk for free, and the army gets all it's money back? Clever buggers......
 
#5
ssjmawson said:
The Army doesn't pay OTC people anything, it's a cunning ruse. All the money they receive goes straight back into the bar. Pure psychological manipulation...
So I get drunk for free, and the army gets all it's money back? Clever buggers......
You wish, it's like any other night on the piss, loses you money, the only diference is the women are uglier
 
#6
Good luck ssjmawson with MSUOTC.

I am an ex-member of MSUOTC. But that was nearly thirty years ago!

I had a great time and the social life was excellent.

I may see you on the next old boys reunion.
 
#7
Why should regulars agree that the otc should not be paid? They can be used in article 52 emergencies, the training is recycled when they join as regs or TA and unlike the ACF they are equipped(albeit down the queue) and train to the same rules eg field firing etc as the infantry. For your information in my last TA unit the salary pension lodging etc of the 19 or so regulars was considerably more than the MTD bill for the 260 TA soldiers and officers.
 
#11
Extrader: I can see where you are coming from. However your ACF training comment was a little wide of the mark. Many OTC's will allow ex-cadets to skip 1st year basic stuff as it has usually been covered by around 3* standard. I doubt it would take very long to fill in the holes in subjects such as fire and manoeuvre. So by your arguement, 3* cadets who can prove themselves to be of reasonable competence should receive some money, as they have been given experience that would help them if they joined up.
 
#12
Never heard of any ACF guy being allowed to skip. Filling holes in F&M? That's the basis of army doctrine and tactics! You can't just "fill holes" with that.
Allowed ACF nazis to skip ahead breeds a lot of discontent and snobbishness. Hell, in my days even GYCs weren't allowed to skip. You make all your friends in your first year, after all.
 
#13
In previous years we've allowed people (ex CCF/ACF/Army School) to skip the MTQ1 package as it wouldn't actually teach anything new. However whether or not this is a good thing is a different arguement. Also MTQ2 pay doesn't come into effect until you have done at least one year, so it's still £32/day (ish) for the first bit.
 
#14
Fair point that if 3* cadets have done up to MTQ1 standard they should be paid. However whethere they should skip the first year is a seperate issue. My original point still holds good and if ACF at a certain level offer capability then yes they should be paid.
 
#15
ssjmawson said:
Many OTC's will allow ex-cadets to skip 1st year basic stuff as it has usually been covered by around 3* standard. I doubt it would take very long to fill in the holes in subjects such as fire and manoeuvre.
Edinburgh doesnt allow ex-cadets to skip 1st year. I had never done cadets before I joined the OTC and it was a huge benefit to people like me to have someone who actually knew what they were doing, especially on the first exercise. Ok, they mite have been bored but it meant that everyone was reading of the same song sheet by the time we got to teh end of 1st year.
Plus it would seriously pi ss off 2nd year OCdts to have gobby first years swan directly into 2nd year with the attitude of 'at cadets we did it this way... and at cadets we did it that way...' (Not that Im disregardnig ACF/CCF - i wish someone had told me about them when I was younger!) The dreaded 'Cadet Syndrome' is usally beaten out of ex-ACF/CCF by the time they've done MTQ1!!!

As for pay in the OTC - how else are they going to get recruits? The OTC helps me have money to live whilst im at uni - plus have a few extra beer tokens! OTC has to compete against the TA and students who work in bars/restaurants/shops in order to get recruits and I know that some people in Edinburgh use OTC has a source of money to live off of! And why not? Ive had the best 3 years at uni and made some excellent friends, been skiing, done a royal salute from Edinburgh Castle, gone on a battle field tour and got very drunk in belgium, driven tanks (and I get paid to do this!) - all courtesy of the OTC and i'd recommend it to anyone!!! beats working in a dingy student bar anyday!
 
#16
My point is that I'm currently at 4* level with ACF, and wouldn't dream of getting paid for it. I do it because I enjoy it, even teaching the little recruits who join and are completely clueless. I just think it's unfair that, whilst learning MTQ1 people should be paid for learning. Subsidised some costs, yes, but paid thirty-odd-pound, no.
 
#17
ssjmawson said:
My point is that I'm currently at 4* level with ACF, and wouldn't dream of getting paid for it. I do it because I enjoy it, even teaching the little recruits who join and are completely clueless. I just think it's unfair that, whilst learning MTQ1 people should be paid for learning. Subsidised some costs, yes, but paid thirty-odd-pound, no.

First off - forget cadets. While it may seem 'big' now, to a 17 year old? 18 year old? 'instructing' 'clueless new recruits' who are 3 feet tall and call you 'daddy' in their unguarded moments, ACF is not going to impress anyone. Not even in an OTC. Keep it quiet. The truth of it is that you don't even know how clueless you are at the moment, and you're in for a shock. If you 'large it up' you will be a laughing stock and you'll have to leave and then spend your three years at uni in disguise.
Secondly, it may be an anomally that you get paid, given that we won't be seeing you in deserts in the near future, but why complain? If you do MTQ 1, 2, have attachments in your summer holidays to inf units in BAOR, do adventure training in the Alps - etc - and you enjoy it so much that you then commission and join 'normal' TA and stay in for years then the army's made a good investment, hasn't it? That's me, by the way. Even if you don't decide to make a long term thing of it, you need money as a student, don't you? It kept me out of debt for three years. Don't knock it.
Lastly - this must a wind-up, right?
 
#18
I must interject.....What crap!

Its a branch of the TA at the end of the day, would you extend your philosophy to lads undertaking basic with any other TA unit? We do the same basic training learning to wipe our asses in the convertly stylee and not blow ourselves up so why should we not get the full benefits that some other part timer gets?
 
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