Pathfinders - Betrayed behind enemy lines.

#3
Classic case of "who dares earns"
The author gets his reply in early....... I know I am going to get some snipes from people who think I should have kept quiet. It has been a lonely journey but morally it was the right thing to do. The key reason was to learn lessons from the mistakes," he said.
 
#5
Entirely believable and similar IMO, to B20....compromised, asked for help/extraction, only to be ignored as the head sheds, miles away decided that the they knew better than the men on the ground and that the call 'was a bit premature'.....plus they didn't want to look stupid in the eyes of the yanks as we didn't have the means to extract anyway, so would have meant asking them for help.

Even in our Modern army we still often have to contend with the egos and lack of ethics of some the so called 'Leaders of Men', who attitudes wouldn't look out of place from that of Victorian times.

Then they wonder why previously loyal soldiers end up slightly bitter about the whole experience and decided to write about it.
 
#6
Entirely believable and similar IMO, to B20....compromised, asked for help/extraction, only to be ignored as the head sheds, miles away decided that the they knew better than the men on the ground and that the call 'was a bit premature'.....plus they didn't want to look stupid in the eyes of the yanks as we didn't have the means to extract anyway, so would have meant asking them for help.

Even in our Modern army we still often have to contend with the egos and lack of ethics of some the so called 'Leaders of Men', who attitudes wouldn't look out of place from that of Victorian times.

Then they wonder why previously loyal soldiers end up slightly bitter about the whole experience and decided to write about it.
...must have been incredible to have served at the heart of MoD during this time
 
#7
Entirely believable and similar IMO, to B20....compromised, asked for help/extraction, only to be ignored as the head sheds, miles away decided that the they knew better than the men on the ground and that the call 'was a bit premature'.....plus they didn't want to look stupid in the eyes of the yanks as we didn't have the means to extract anyway, so would have meant asking them for help.

Even in our Modern army we still often have to contend with the egos and lack of ethics of some the so called 'Leaders of Men', who attitudes wouldn't look out of place from that of Victorian times.

Then they wonder why previously loyal soldiers end up slightly bitter about the whole experience and decided to write about it.
Written by some one who knows nothing about b20.
They didn't take vehicles against all senior advice. The radios they had failed to work, so we're unable to ask for help. They took a different emergency route then what they said so when help came they were no where near.
All this lays on patrol commanders shoulders no one else's.
 
#9
Written by some one who knows nothing about b20.
They didn't take vehicles against all senior advice. The radios they had failed to work, so we're unable to ask for help. They took a different emergency route then what they said so when help came they were no where near.
All this lays on patrol commanders shoulders no one else's.
Hmm? Ok, I won't go into what I do know about it......a pissing war is boring in soooo many ways but I keep my veiws and opinions based on what I do know, and you keep yours. Sound fair?
 
#10
head sheds, miles away decided that the they knew better than the men on the ground and that the call 'was a bit premature'.....
Well, in this they all got back OK, so clearly the call was a bit premature


Recce group sent out to locate and evaluate the enemy, and does so, nothing more, nothing less - if the intel they already had could have been relied on, there would have been no need for a f'king recce group, would there!
 
#11
Well, in this they all got back OK, so clearly the call was a bit premature


Recce group sent out to locate and evaluate the enemy, and does so, nothing more, nothing less - if the intel they already had could have been relied on, there would have been no need for a f'king recce group, would there!
......was talking about B20 and the premature call mucka.....Post No. 93 of this.

http://www.arrse.co.uk/book-club/175650-andy-mcnab-7.html


There was something in the press at the time about the OP.
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#12
Its nothing new, the jumped up **** of a captain in the ops room always knows better than the bloke on the ground. seen it so many times its laughable.
 
#13
Well, in this they all got back OK, so clearly the call was a bit premature


Recce group sent out to locate and evaluate the enemy, and does so, nothing more, nothing less - if the intel they already had could have been relied on, there would have been no need for a f'king recce group, would there!

Recce group sent to evaluate an airfield a couple of hundred k's behind the front line. If that doesn't call for on-call support or extraction plans, then why bother at all!?
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#14
Recce group sent to evaluate an airfield a couple of hundred k's behind the front line. If that doesn't call for on-call support or extraction plans, then why bother at all!?
Makes you wonder why if no extraction plan was in place did they do the op? Surely basic recce principles as COCK and COCOA still apply?
 
#15
Recce group sent to evaluate an airfield a couple of hundred k's behind the front line.

Sounds like a typical case of "we are bullet proof", until someone actually starts shooting. Good efforts on promoting your book though.
 
#16
Airfield a couple of hundred k's behind enemy lines? Isn't that the same airfield that was overrun by the USMC before UK could put together an air assault on it? IIRC the USMC were already in the area at the time of this recce.
 
#17
Airfield a couple of hundred k's behind enemy lines? Isn't that the same airfield that was overrun by the USMC before UK could put together an air assault on it? IIRC the USMC were already in the area at the time of this recce.
Surely those higher up the food chain, wouldn't have unnecessarily put our troops' lives in danger for a show of can-do!
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#18
I'd be interested to find out if they actually just drove straight towards the airfield hell for leather all airborne style and then realised they had dropped a bollock by racing blindly into an enemy position, Recce my arse!
 

AIRBORNEJOCK

War Hero
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#19
Airfield a couple of hundred k's behind enemy lines? Isn't that the same airfield that was overrun by the USMC before UK could put together an air assault on it? IIRC the USMC were already in the area at the time of this recce.
Air assault was shit canned due to there being ZSU 23/4 all over the airfield contrary to what the book generation kill says. Not an armchair critic I was meant to be on the assault instead we just hot choppers over the border to RV with the test of the BG in the holding area.
 

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