PAP10 or not PAP10!!

Discussion in 'Strategic Defence & Spending Review (SDSR)' started by scarlet pimpernel, Dec 5, 2011.

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  1. So today i was called into the office and warned i may get PAP10! Here's the scenario....

    In 2008 i was injured while getting off of the back of a chinook. Since then i've been P3. From the time of the injury until present day i've been on a rotation of physio followed by deployment as i'm still able to go on ops, exercises etc and do my job however without proper rehab (still waiting an operation) i'm unable to carry out PFT, ACFT etc. I had one stint in RRU (where i was referred for the op) however have fallen back into the same old cycle with the exception of a rough date for my operation.

    I've now been told that i may be looking at being downgraded to P7 and non deployable (there's been no change to my condition) and given PAP10.

    As far as i understand things (no one at work seems to know anything about it or has very sloping shoulders!!) under PAP10 if i was non deployable in my role and the army was unable to find me employment elsewhere then i would be facing a brown envelope. However as i'm still able to carry out my job role and deploy can they do this to me? Wouldn't it have to be a case of MED discharge? There has been mention of getting around all this with "services no longer required" which sounds pretty bad!

  2. If I remember rightly there is a difference between MND (Perm) and MND (Temp). Lads that are MDN (Perm) were reviewed by the Unit CO on an Appendix 18 (I think). If the CO was content to employ them based on the limitations stated on the App 18, they carried on normal jogging (excuse pun).

    If you're MND (Perm) AND the CO decides there is not a role for you in the Unit, and a Med Board finds there is no job for you in any other Unit, then things do indeed look grim for you.

    Do you not have a Troopie/2ic you can take this up with?
  3. The CO can be over ruled though (and have been, I know of at least two lads that the CO wanted to keep who were sacked from somewhere above).
  4. When you say sacked, do you mean sacked from the Unit and moved on, or sacked and out of the Army?
  5. yes there is however finding him is a whole different matter! may have to put my doss bag in his office.
  6. All i would if this is the case a service complaint would be the route to go. Firstly i would ask for an interview which makes it official and goes through your CoC. PAP 10 is still a very grey area you would of thought there would of been some briefing process. Sounds like your CoC are trying to wash there hands and play ignornace. Take your interview was with your OC and he's the only one that can conduct the initial interview and he should have given you some paper work for you and the phyiso and Doctor to fill out.
  7. think i will for starters. When called into the office it started it was kinda formal however when asked what what the situation was i got lots of blank looks. as i side not the co has to get rid of 60 soldiers as apparently we're overmanned.
  8. Be careful with this one, when I was the RCMO SNCO we dealt with a fair few of these. If you are MND Perm you can be discharged through PAP10, there is two parts to this mind, if you volunteer to take any job and they can't (or wont) you may be entitled to a med pension, if however you want to stay with your cap badge you could be admin discharged due to medical grounds. So you need to be careful how you play this. The current army policy is forcing the hands of COs to get rid of all MND but they are now looking at MLD Perm as well..
  9. Just out of interest how does it work when someone who is P7 and get PAP10 instead of Med Discharge, who decides what they get?
  10. It's all in the fine print on the paperwork, making sure you tick all the boxes before signing is usually the way. But one lad I know who was kicked out was bluffing his case, and was stupid enough to allow everyone see he was taking the piss out of it. MND Perm for a bad back but was able to bench press a lot of weight in front of the entire Regt whilst they are getting beasted, but can't heavy lift or drive (his main trade), as you can imagine the report accompanying his paperwork would of been fine reading at MCM Div.

    If you are a grafter and don't play on your Appendix 9 then you will find your CO will back you up to the hilt and make sure you get a Med Pension.
  11. This does give me a slight warm fuzzy feeling.
  12. As in out of the Army. Couldn't tell you the details of what payouts/pensions etc they're getting though.

    One came off his promotion board while waiting for his discharge date...
  13. There is a big hole in the whole PAP 10 process at the moment, Where the whole thing was sold as "not kicking medicaly downgraded soldiers out, but finding them new employment with in the army". this has not realy worked out as not even the AGC SPS will accept a wounded infantier as a transfer. (even if Phisicaly he is still fitter than some of the "pie eating pen pushers" that sit in his admin office. But his medical grading is a reflection of that his injurys proclude him from the robust nature of the infantry) i have seen a number of soldiers who are quite articulate and inteligent discharged when there transfers under the PAP10 were refused. especialy as these corps have there own problems with the PUD