Paddy Ashdown says...

#1
Paddy Ashdown says I fear that we are now - and it is a scandal - wasting the lives of our young men and women who we are putting in the front line in the most difficult circumstances when our political leaders have failed to produce any kind of plan that can take advantage of the victories they win over the Taliban at great cost.

He says it. But is anyone listening?
 
#2
By anyone you mean politicians I guess. They might listen to this, but not take any further action.

These points of concern: "An international plan, which we haven't got; proper international co-ordination, so the international community talks with a single voice, which we haven't got; and a regional construct - something like the Dayton Agreement (for Bosnia) - in which neighbours including Iran have a role, underpinned by major powers such as the US and probably China." article

have been shown to politicians many times since 2001. Especially the 'single voice' issue and the political-geographical context of Afghanistan. It's not a sexy topic and it would show that the 'liberation of Afghanistan' is a far more complex and enduring process than initially presented.

The same pretty much applies to Iraq. I'm relieved the idea of liberating countries like Syria and North Korea dropped off the list of priorities in the US.
 
#3
ORC

Nicely twisting the point of his words by selectively quoting.

Here's what he said, the bold bits being mine.

Lord Ashdown welcomed US President Barack Obama's decision to appoint veteran diplomat Richard Holbrooke - who he worked with in the Balkans - as his "point man" on Afghanistan and Pakistan.

And he backed Mr Obama's plan to deliver a "surge" in US troops to the central Asian country.

But, he said: "Absent three things, a surge isn't going to be enough.

"An international plan, which we haven't got; proper international co-ordination, so the international community talks with a single voice, which we haven't got; and a regional construct - something like the Dayton Agreement (for Bosnia) - in which neighbours including Iran have a role, underpinned by major powers such as the US and probably China.

"I fear that we are now - and it is a scandal - wasting the lives of our young men and women who we are putting in the front line in the most difficult circumstances when our political leaders have failed to produce any kind of plan that can take advantage of the victories they win over the Taliban at great cost.

"It is a very grave concern, but if you speak to senior commanders in Afghanistan, you will find they are saying the same thing.

"They are winning the battle, often at great cost in death and mutilation of our soldiers, but I am afraid to say the international community has completely failed to take advantage of the victories they have gained.

"Until we put that together, we will not begin to turn the situation around."
So, in effect Paddy is saying that things cannot go on as they are. He sees that some things are changing but it needs someone to pull the international community together.
 
#4
Hmm - well we are STILL living with the Dayton Accords and Holbrooke's sh1t. This place is a mess precisely because of Dayton.
 
#5
Sven said:
But, he said: "Absent three things, a surge isn't going to be enough.

"An international plan, which we haven't got; proper international co-ordination, so the international community talks with a single voice, which we haven't got; and a regional construct - something like the Dayton Agreement (for Bosnia) - in which neighbours including Iran have a role, underpinned by major powers such as the US and probably China.

"I fear that we are now - and it is a scandal - wasting the lives of our young men and women who we are putting in the front line in the most difficult circumstances when our political leaders have failed to produce any kind of plan that can take advantage of the victories they win over the Taliban at great cost.

"It is a very grave concern, but if you speak to senior commanders in Afghanistan, you will find they are saying the same thing.

"They are winning the battle, often at great cost in death and mutilation of our soldiers, but I am afraid to say the international community has completely failed to take advantage of the victories they have gained.

"Until we put that together, we will not begin to turn the situation around."

So, in effect Paddy is saying that things cannot go on as they are. He sees that some things are changing but it needs somone to pull the international community together.
Seems to me to be a rather be a rather large criticism of what's been going on for the past 7 years at the political level. And because of that, lives are being lost unnecessarily. Don't you think?
 
#7
Sven said:
ORC

Nicely twisting the point of his words by selectively quoting.

Here's what he said, the bold bits being mine.

Lord Ashdown welcomed US President Barack Obama's decision to appoint veteran diplomat Richard Holbrooke - who he worked with in the Balkans - as his "point man" on Afghanistan and Pakistan.

And he backed Mr Obama's plan to deliver a "surge" in US troops to the central Asian country.

But, he said: "Absent three things, a surge isn't going to be enough.

"An international plan, which we haven't got; proper international co-ordination, so the international community talks with a single voice, which we haven't got; and a regional construct - something like the Dayton Agreement (for Bosnia) - in which neighbours including Iran have a role, underpinned by major powers such as the US and probably China.

"I fear that we are now - and it is a scandal - wasting the lives of our young men and women who we are putting in the front line in the most difficult circumstances when our political leaders have failed to produce any kind of plan that can take advantage of the victories they win over the Taliban at great cost.

"It is a very grave concern, but if you speak to senior commanders in Afghanistan, you will find they are saying the same thing.

"They are winning the battle, often at great cost in death and mutilation of our soldiers, but I am afraid to say the international community has completely failed to take advantage of the victories they have gained.

"Until we put that together, we will not begin to turn the situation around."

So, in effect Paddy is saying that things cannot go on as they are. He sees that some things are changing but it needs someone to pull the international community together.
Read the link Master Mind. The points you added are there. But so are the words of Pantsdown and I do not see them being conditioned by the other points in his mutterings.
 
#8
ORC

What do speech marks that come after 'he said', mean? I think that your antipathy to the war in AFG has addled your powers of comprehension.
 
#9
Sven said:
ORC

What do speech marks that come after 'he said', mean? I think that your antipathy to the war in AFG has addled your powers of comprehension.
It's very hard to tell because in the quote you have made you have opened quote marks but not closed them so, I suppose, in your case it means "No marks for grammar".
 
#10
Sven said:
"Until we put that together, we will not begin to turn the situation around."

So, in effect Paddy is saying that things cannot go on as they are. He sees that some things are changing but it needs someone to pull the international community together.
No Master Mind.

It seems to me that he is saying it has been a political foreign policy cluster fcuk up to this point in time, and good lives are being lost because of it.

Sven,

To what lengths will you go to distort the reality of New and Old Labour's foreign policy nightmares into some jolly adventure that is regrettably going wrong because of somebody else not getting 'on message'?
 
#11
I've always liked Paddy and have heard almost universally good things about what he did in Bosnia. I am of the genuine belief that we should have had Paddy involved in Iraq/Afghanistan and bent over to accomodate his needs.

What he says strikes a chord. I don't think he is be-littling what the armed forces have done in any way and feels if they should be in afghanistan then they should at least be properly lead, with a clear outcome etc.
 
#12
The soldier fight, dies or gets mangled and tangled for life,physically or mentally.
The Politician Talks and Talks and Talks the leaves office with one hell of a pension.
john
 
#13
jonwilly said:
The soldier fight, dies or gets mangled and tangled for life,physically or mentally.
The Politician Talks and Talks and Talks the leaves office with one hell of a pension.
john
Paddy Ashdown isn't one of the average run of the mill Politicians with his Military background, but I've had my doubts ever since he walked past me in the State Hospital in Sarajevo, stared at me for a couple of seconds then said "Dobar Dan"... "Dobar Dan" I said in return (I was sat waiting to see the Specialist Doctor after I broke my leg, Mr. Ashdown I believe was seeing the same one with a calf complaint he had due to skiing) it was amusing because I was sat there with a Scotland Rugby shirt on!!! locals you will see in an assortment of footie shirts but never Rugby!
 
#14
Gundulph said:
jonwilly said:
The soldier fight, dies or gets mangled and tangled for life,physically or mentally.
The Politician Talks and Talks and Talks the leaves office with one hell of a pension.
john
Paddy Ashdown isn't one of the average run of the mill Politicians with his Military background, but I've had my doubts ever since he walked past me in the State Hospital in Sarajevo, stared at me for a couple of seconds then said "Dobar Dan"... "Dobar Dan" I said in return (I was sat waiting to see the Specialist Doctor after I broke my leg, Mr. Ashdown I believe was seeing the same one with a calf complaint he had due to skiing) it was amusing because I was sat there with a Scotland Rugby shirt on!!! locals you will see in an assortment of footie shirts but never Rugby!
I'm surprised he could be bothered to talk to you at all if you were wearing an offensive shirt. :lol:
 
#15
Markintime said:
Sven said:
ORC

What do speech marks that come after 'he said', mean? I think that your antipathy to the war in AFG has addled your powers of comprehension.
It's very hard to tell because in the quote you have made you have opened quote marks but not closed them so, I suppose, in your case it means "No marks for grammar".
So, for your delight and edification . . . . . .
 
#16
Sven said:
Markintime said:
Sven said:
ORC

What do speech marks that come after 'he said', mean? I think that your antipathy to the war in AFG has addled your powers of comprehension.
It's very hard to tell because in the quote you have made you have opened quote marks but not closed them so, I suppose, in your case it means "No marks for grammar".
So, for your delight and edification . . . . . .
So, do I wait with bated breath , or have you run out of ideas?
 
#18
Legend of the liberal Party.

Good service history (Royal Marines and SBS)

Did some mostly harmless work in Balkans

Spoilt his record a bit by sh*gging his secretary

Very good at being wise after event

Better than most politicians but a bit smug.
 
#20
Sven.....

What are you trying to achieve by posting?

All you seem to have done is reiterated what ORC said, making it look like you're having a pop at him and making yourself look foolish....

If i had read ORCs post, then your "enlightment post" and thought, "blo0dy hell, ORC left loads out", I could understand it. All you did was quote (by the looks of it) the whole fcuking article. Without actually adding to anything except your post count.
 

Similar threads


New Posts

Latest Threads

Top