Oren: America needs Israel now more than ever

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by KGB_resident, Apr 26, 2011.

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  1. Yes, of course

    5 vote(s)
  2. Rather yes but not so badly

    1 vote(s)
  3. Sometimes Israel is an useful ally

    7 vote(s)
  4. There are no serious benefits from Israel

    7 vote(s)
  5. The USA doesn't need Israel at all. It is rather a burden.

    13 vote(s)
  1. The Ultimate Ally - By Michael Oren | Foreign Policy


  2. Sergei;
    This is a puff piece by the Israeli ambassador to the USA.
    If he wrote a 6 page essay entitled "America needs Israel less than ever" it would certainly be more newsworthy (and probably more accurate), but writing stuff like this is the bloke's job. There is some interesting data in it, but I would guess it's been cherry-picked for best effect.

    For counterbalance, could you find something from the USA ambassador saying nice things about Israel? Then we could have both sides of the love-in.

    What are you driving at by posting this? If it's about the value or otherwise of the Israelis to the USA, then surely that's been discussed at length many times before?
  3. Hector,

    we see rapid and unpredictable changes in the ME. Something that was previously regarded as undisputable now is a matter for discussions. Why has mr.Oren written the article namely now?

    I suppose that because national interests of Israel and the USA are not so interdependable and interconnected as mr.Oren suggests.

    Moreover, he see influental opponents. It is a matter for a big concern for the Israelis.

    Oren pens essay challenging stance Israel is US liability

  4. in spite of the palpable dislike for israel amongst so many here and elsewhere, for reasons long since understood, there is a strategic plus concerning israel and just about everybody.
    the clue may be in the fact that the israeli prime minister was in the kremlin about a month ago. ostensibly it was for a talk about russian orthodox holy places in jerusalem. however it just so happened that the saudi arabian foreign minister was there, perhaps he was talking about holy places too.
    it is a fact that saudi arabia has frozen, if not cancelled the 60$ billion (yes billion) arms deal he had with the usa. king abdullah has also been encouraging yemen to go against the american grain. quite simply because of the way mubarak was abandoned in egypt. the repercussions from that mistake (in my humble opinion) in american policy, are yet to be fully felt, though they are beginning, by the stopping of that arms deal. why the arms deal? because of iran.

    and where is iran's policy orientated? not only with the islamist parties of egypt (who variously tried to assasinate mubarak), but with hamas and hezbollah, and of course the syrian regime. some readers will understand their influence in both iraq and afghanistan, and the iranian incitement of the shi-ites of bahrain, as if they were ever interested in human rights. as if. swallow that at your peril.

    churchill said he'd make a deal with the devil, if he'd join up against nazi germany (not just some of the avatar pictures on this site) when challenged about his alliance with the soviet union.

    it seems that saudi arabia might well have a similar churchillian rationale in now dealing, thought it's very hidden, with both russia and israel (every now and then little things happen which further tip me off, such as who are the major shareholders of certain world companies, and how they might meet at agm's etc.), anyway,
    as it is in most everybody's interest that saudi oil keeps flowing, and most certainly that iran does not gain control of these oil fields, (as well as its generally obnoxious world view anyway), and seeing that the usa has in abandoning mubarak, driven saudi arabia to thinking of two of its churchillian devils, russia and israel (for talks), i can only think that israel though in a very tight situation strategically itself, is also critically important as a fact on the ground. if it wasn't for israel then iran would totally surround saudi arabia. the saudis, americans and iranians all know that. (you might have forgotten that when syria invaded jordan in 1970 it was israel who forced the syrians back, after an american 'phone call).

    indeed i would not be at all surprised if it didn't kick off again big time soon between israel and one or more iranian proxy. as egypt is beginning to renege on certain agreements, treaties and understandings maybe the usa will withdraw its support. i am sure the mullahs in teheran would look to fill the funding gap, and expect the egyptian army to once again attack israel. there might be a saudi flex as well at the same time. maybe an island or two in the gulf? you know the one's i mean, off the uae coast, well that's where it will kick off.
    exactly how high do you want the price of oil to go? and now examine israel's strategic importance to the viability of the saudi state. lol. i just hope the israelis don't take advantage of the situation as they have been so traduced by the bcc, academia, and all the vanessa redgraves on this site, etc., etc., they really could, and i think there are some there who would now. well done.
  5. Barack Obama changes his best friend every week it seems, last time it was the French and next time it will be someone else, although heaven forbid it would be Britain, i am becoming increasingly skeptical of everything this man says.
  6. Funnily enough - just yesterday:

    Statement by the Press Secretary on the Wedding of Prince William and Catherine Middleton

    We congratulate Prince William and Catherine Middleton, the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge, on their wedding today and wish them a lifetime of happiness together. The United States has no closer friend in the world than the United Kingdom. On this occasion, the American people extend heartfelt congratulations to the peoples of the United Kingdom and the Commonwealth and share in their hopes for a bright future for the Royal couple.

    Statement by the Press Secretary on the Wedding of Prince William and Catherine Middleton | The White House
  7. You would be surprised that the wedding replaced almost everything else in the USA on Friday and many TV stations are replaying the whole ceremony today. Last time it was like this was Diana's Funeral.
  8. Damnations i stand corrected! However i think if they seem to use a near identical statement each time and simply swap countries names then it rather loses its edge. Not that its worth wading into but i do genuinely feel the majority of American people still believe that we are their closet allies, surely more than those Frenchies anyway!
  9. If China ever rules the world one of the principal reasons will the repeated disasters the Israeli entanglement has inflicted on the United States. Still, it couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of self serving bastards.
  10. You need to add a "Who gives a ****" to the poll
  11. It is a fair remark. Well, I will supply the next polls with an option - Don't care. Your variant of the option is excellent but a bit too emotional.
  12. The Arab Spring has been compared to the collapse of the Soviet empire in 89. This may be overstated but that imperial collapse has some similarities. America's lost dreams of dominance in China in the mid 20th century might be a better model.

    DC does seem to be facing a very damaging loss of influence over what once were practically vassals. Egypt looks to be adopting a Pindi model, Saudi is tilting towards China and there is unrest and uncertainty across this very geo-strategic region. Qom probes for weakness everywhere. The much praised Arab Spring is the start of a dark time for our interests and worse for Israel's.

    In these unpredictable circumstances DC's troublesome relationship with the regions strongest military power may actually have some utility. In the worst case surrounded by democratic states full of understandably pissed off Arabs Israel may increasingly become a bargaining chip like Taiwan did in the 70s and the Israelis won't like that at all.
  13. Trans-sane

    Trans-sane LE Book Reviewer

    Not in the slightest bit suprised at all actually ;)
  14. As always, the yanks envious of the millenniums worth of history and pagentry that could still have been theirs. The local pub I have a pint in is older than the United States.