Officers' Swords - Makers/Suppliers 2022

[Vladimir_Ilyich_Crab]

Good Morning Chaps, I am hoping people with recent (very recent) experience, can give me a bit of steer about who is providing Officers' Swords currently.

Currently, RAF Officer Cadets going through Cranwell get pitched by 3 companies: Pooley, Bormejo and Crown Swords. They are in a range of prices. I'm keen to know what the Army do.

what I know so far:

Pooley - top end, says they took on some of the tooling and personnel from WIlkinsons on their demise. I'd heard of these.

Bormejo - new to me, Spanish, playing up the Toledo sword making tradition.

Crown Swords - new to me. Apparently produced an approved pattern RAF 100 'special edition' and are currently punting a QPJ edition. I've had a look and I can't help thinking it is a bit 'merch' having stuff like that engraved on the blade.

So I guess my questions are:

1. Who do you Pongoes get your swords from these days?

2. Does anyone have any experience of these suppliers above they'd care to share - any endorsements?

3. What do you do regs wise, about use of swords with the Royal Cipher of a previous Monarch (you get where I'm going there...)?

Thank you for any senisble answers, yes I've used the search function.

 

[Ravers]

I can’t give you any advice on new swords, but I’ve seen plenty of naval officers using very old ones with older style crowns on from previous monarchs.

Most people seem to prefer ones with a bit of history and they are generally cheaper.

As long as they are in presentable condition and are the correct pattern then no one seems to be bothered.

I did once see an RNR officer rock up with some family heirloom that must’ve been mid Victorianish.

He was politely told to put it away and given a new one to borrow because it wasn’t the current pattern. It had a brown handle (instead of white) and a slightly curved blade (current ones are straight).

 

[FORMER_FYRDMAN]

Good Morning Chaps, I am hoping people with recent (very recent) experience, can give me a bit of steer about who is providing Officers' Swords currently.

Currently, RAF Officer Cadets going through Cranwell get pitched by 3 companies: Pooley, Bormejo and Crown Swords. They are in a range of prices. I'm keen to know what the Army do.

what I know so far:

Pooley - top end, says they took on some of the tooling and personnel from WIlkinsons on their demise. I'd heard of these.

Bormejo - new to me, Spanish, playing up the Toledo sword making tradition.

Crown Swords - new to me. Apparently produced an approved pattern RAF 100 'special edition' and are currently punting a QPJ edition. I've had a look and I can't help thinking it is a bit 'merch' having stuff like that engraved on the blade.

So I guess my questions are:

1. Who do you Pongoes get your swords from these days?

2. Does anyone have any experience of these suppliers above they'd care to share - any endorsements?

3. What do you do regs wise, about use of swords with the Royal Cipher of a previous Monarch (you get where I'm going there...)?

Thank you for any senisble answers, yes I've used the search function.

Buy a cheap tulwar and tell them to embrace diversity.

 

[Brotherton Lad]

Mr Pooley is a nice chap and provides the swords awarded to the best British and International OCdts at Sandbags three times a year. Mine is an old Wilkinson’s version. From memory it’s a George VI one. No drama, standard Infantry pattern.

 

[alfred_the_great]

My sword has a previous Monarch’s cypher on it, and after 23 years I doubt anyone has noticed, let alone pick me up on it.

 

[northern-matelot]

You‘ve missed out Sword Cutlers, Ceremonial Swords | Crisp & Sons, UK in your list of options.

 

[GNE]

Bought one for my son commissioning from RMAS last year. Had no idea about Army swords, and search meant I stumbled across this site at the time. It was mid Covid lockdown so completely reliant on internet searching. Pooley seemed a bit expensive and I did not like their stern statements regarding having to place order by a date early in the final term to guarantee delivery for his commissioning date. I found WKC Solingen a German company, and yet another one that reckons it bought ex Wilkinson tooling ( I found they all seem to say that).

Web site was/is a bit all over the place but once I contacted them by e mail and then phone their customer service and communication was absolutely excellent, especially given they too were in lockdown.. I had their MD/owner sending me detailed answers to last minute questions on sword knots late on a Sunday evening. Sword arrived exactly when they said it would, beautifully engraved with name and regimental crest. I think I was their first order post Brexit which could have been an added complication but again, excellent communication and it all arrived safely. They did a package including sword/scabbard/knot/engraving for about Euro600.

I'm not an agent for them (!) in fact I told them they needed to get one as I do reckon they would sell a lot if some of their marketing was aimed directly at Sandhurst/Dartmouth/Cranwell.

 

[Caecilius]

You‘ve missed out Sword Cutlers, Ceremonial Swords | Crisp & Sons, UK in your list of options.

Is that still going? I thought there was a thread about them on here a while back where it transpired that the owner had died.

 

[Brotherton Lad]

Typically, my son commissioned into a Regiment with a different pattern. At least I get to keep mine to surprise burglars.

 

[Union Jack]

I can’t give you any advice on new swords, but I’ve seen plenty of naval officers using very old ones with older style crowns on from previous monarchs.

Most people seem to prefer ones with a bit of history and they are generally cheaper.

As long as they are in presentable condition and are the correct pattern then no one seems to be bothered.

I did once see an RNR officer rock up with some family heirloom that must’ve been mid Victorianish.

He was politely told to put it away and given a new one to borrow because it wasn’t the current pattern. It had a brown handle (instead of white) and a slightly curved blade (current ones are straight).

Interesting - I have across several friends with swords with the slightly curved blade which have been inherited from older family members, and these have been deemed both acceptable and rather special.

I can't account for the brown grip - too much nutty whilst waiting to go on Divisions, or something worse....?

If ever kind enough to lend a sword to some less fortunate soul, say for a wedding, always check for cake crumbs and icing before stowing the weapon away, lightly Vaselined. For the avoidance of doubt - Ravers! - I mean the sword of course....

Jack

 

[CHICK3N]

You could also demand one through the system…the current Infantry pattern sword is:

I’d have to look up the NSN for the other services….

 

[FlotsamJetsam]

I can’t give you any advice on new swords, but I’ve seen plenty of naval officers using very old ones with older style crowns on from previous monarchs.

Most people seem to prefer ones with a bit of history and they are generally cheaper.

As long as they are in presentable condition and are the correct pattern then no one seems to be bothered.

I did once see an RNR officer rock up with some family heirloom that must’ve been mid Victorianish.

He was politely told to put it away and given a new one to borrow because it wasn’t the current pattern. It had a brown handle (instead of white) and a slightly curved blade (current ones are straight).

The WO Gunner at BRNC when I went through did a side business in flogging swords to young officer cadets. I suspect the business gets handed down with the role. I bought a ”king‘s crown“ sword in fighting weight. Strong enough to kill a Frenchman, or at least survive drunken sabrage.

Now it lives tucked in the back of a closet somewhere so children don‘t impale themselves on it.

 

[CrabfatBILL]

Do Lego not do one?

CFB

 

[philc]

No offence, but this seems all a bit dated, I can’t even recall a time when I was in the Navy someone had a sword in some sort of ceremony, I get Guards, aside from that why and when?

 

[northern-matelot]

Is that still going? I thought there was a thread about them on here a while back where it transpired that the owner had died.

I’ve no idea if I’m honest.

I’ve tried all the sword makers / cutlers that the officers go to, to get my ratings cutlass refurbed, but everyone seems to ignore my emails or not want to touch it.

 

[4(T)]

You could also demand one through the system…the current Infantry pattern sword is:

View attachment 653384
I’d have to look up the NSN for the other services….

I never knew that was possible. That would have saved a lot of impecunious young officers some cash.

Pretty much everyone I knew went out and bought a vintage sword, as they couldn't afford a new one (let alone the No1 ceremonial dress with all the gold bits from Hobsons); there are zillions of them out there in the antiques trade, and many of them in very good condition.

Antique or heirloom swords of the correct pattern are perfectly acceptable.

 

[Vladimir_Ilyich_Crab]

You‘ve missed out Sword Cutlers, Ceremonial Swords | Crisp & Sons, UK in your list of options.

I did indeed shippers - I was quoting companies I knew and asking for others!

That said, I did know of Crisp and Sons, but thought they shut up shop a while back. Thanks for the gen, I'll add that to the research.

 

[Vladimir_Ilyich_Crab]

You could also demand one through the system…the current Infantry pattern sword is:

View attachment 653384
I’d have to look up the NSN for the other services….

A fair shout, I don't know if ours is an item we can demand and self pay for, I'll check that out.

 

[Vladimir_Ilyich_Crab]

The WO Gunner at BRNC when I went through did a side business in flogging swords to young officer cadets. I suspect the business gets handed down with the role. I bought a ”king‘s crown“ sword in fighting weight. Strong enough to kill a Frenchman, or at least survive drunken sabrage.

Now it lives tucked in the back of a closet somewhere so children don‘t impale themselves on it.

Interesting. Any chance of pics? I'm interested to know what crown Charles will use. In the interests of pedantry, the crown the Boss wears on GSM 1962, is not the 'Queen's' crown, so I think it is not 100% clear cut and a cost-conscious monarch may keep using the current one to avoid too much crest updating.

 

[Vladimir_Ilyich_Crab]

No offence, but this seems all a bit dated, I can’t even recall a time when I was in the Navy someone had a sword in some sort of ceremony, I get Guards, aside from that why and when?

The current pitch to the people at Cranditz is 'buy now, use it at your grad parade'. Now I'm superstitious like the Red Baron, no tour t-shirts until the end, but having something you would grad with would be special and create a family heirloom. You may say that cost for a one-off is too much - but ladies have done this with wedding dresses for years. After that, any weddings or parades going forward. I've used my own sword, which I've had about 18 years, for 3 weddings and 2 parades (this query isn't for me). In between times I have it on the wall on a wooden display holder made in station workshops and given to me as a leaving gizzit many moons ago.