Officer Terms and Conditions of Service

#1
Does anyone know how I can lay my hands on a copy of this.

I am looking at converting from IRC to RegC but want to check the detail before doing so - something I forgot to do when converting to IRC from SSC!

Nothing on the MS web site and have drawn blanks when searching the Defence, Army and LAND websites.

Is this doc classified????

Cheers
 
#2
In all my time in, I don't ever recall hearing about such a document, let alone seeing one. Inerested to see what the response to this is.
whf
 
#4
Isn't TACOS a booklet they hand out at Sandbags?

Presumably you want to check things like does it penalise you for changing to RegC at your 12 year point then resigning at the 16 point and not getting immediate pension (for example).

I know a few who transfered to IRC then left inside what would have been SSC terms and were penalised slightly in their tiny accrued pension.

I honestly don't know where it tells you what the changes specifically mean (obligations, how long you serve etc), but pension calculator can show the pension figures for different exit points and commission types.
 
#5
That is exactly my point. Officers don't seem to know or care before changing over commissioning type.

Aint going to do it until I can read what the changes to "contract" are.

Am I asking too much.

Will look for the commissioning regs - however I am led to believe that this concentates on the qualifications etc.

Pension calculator is a good call but I should still be able to get my mits on them.
 
#6
Tankie said:
That is exactly my point. Officers don't seem to know or care before changing over commissioning type.

Aint going to do it until I can read what the changes to "contract" are.

Am I asking too much.

Will look for the commissioning regs - however I am led to believe that this concentrates on the qualifications etc.

Pension calculator is a good call but I should still be able to get my mits on them.
Tankie, speak to your desk officer at Glasgow (you are actually entitled to a visit once per year I believe in any event). By far the biggest issue is pension. In basic terms, if you convert to a Reg C, and you leave before your immediate pension point, you will get less pension than if you left at your IPP if you stayed on IRC. However, you need to check your own TACOS, as they can vary from CORPS/DIV etc. You need to do a bit f crystal ball gazing and decide whether you want the security of a job for life or if you will perhaps pull the yellow and black handle before 16 years. Use the pension calculator, and see what the differences are on each commissioning structure.
 
#7
That is exactly what I was after. I knew there would be a catch along the line somewhere!

Glasgow didn't seem to know where to find them which was a little suprising to say the least.

Pension calculator with variables is therefore becoming the weapon of choice.

Many thanks.
 
#8
You only dip out on the pension front if you are on AFPS 75; starts at around 11% at the 16 year point reducing to a loss of 0% at TOS date (or something like that). There is no penalty on the 05 scheme.

Check out the last couple of MS Newsletters - on MS Web. If in doubt, you could always ring DM(A) who are the lead for all of this.

dpm
 
#9
Interesting, to convert or not convert to Reg C - that is the question!!!
 
#10
From the latest MS Newsletter (Feb 08!) - up to date then! Not Restricted.

16 Yr Point, PVR & Pensions. The pension implications of PVR are not well understood and may be preventing some officers applying for a conversion to Reg C. The pension implications of PVR at the 16-year point are as follows:
• Under AFPS 75, should an officer retire at the 16-year point at the end of their engagement (i.e. IRC) their immediate pension is based on the compulsory (enhanced) accrual rate. If they are not at the end of their engagement (i.e. Reg C) the pension is based on the voluntary (standard) accrual rate. The abatement for a Major not at the end of his/her engagement is approximately 10.95% at the 16-year point, but progressively reduces to 0% at the 29-year point.
• Under AFPS 05, the annual accrual rate is an even 1/70th of pay irrespective of the cause of discharge. There is no pension 'penalty' for leaving at a particular point.
These rules may make some AFPS 75 officers, who are considering leaving on or around the 16 year point, reluctant to convert to Reg C for fear of being penalised by the standard accrual rate associated with voluntary retirement. However, these rules do not prevent officers applying for an extension of IRC service under AGAI 31.

The Pension Calculator is an excellent tool but cannot find on ArmyNet - brilliant!
 
#11
Goatbag - that statement has made my head hurt - can anyone translate into non-finacial advisor speak?

I can't remember how I got onto the pension calculator, but I don't remember having to log into the difficult to use (because I keep forgetting my password etc) Armynet.

Pay office should have the link (it might even be on JPA).
 
#12
Basically, if you leave at 16yrs on a Reg C you get less money. As a Maj it works out at approx £1500pa less than if you didn't convert.

If you convert and then pull the pin, you need to stay to your 18yr point to get the same money as if you left at compulsory discharge at your IRC 16 yr point.
 
#13
Hmm, interesting. I was thinking of putting off the conversion decision for a few years yet and this has helped me.

I reckon the problem then is weighing up not converting too early that you might change your mind and lose out versus leaving it too long and not getting the conversion when you apply in the last 2 years of your IRC!!
 
#14
Becomes even more interesting for those who were lucky enough (or so they thought...) to commission with a Reg C.

While I would hope that the info in GBTD's post is reasonably well understood in the Officer Corps for those who transfer from SSC to IRC and then on to Reg C, those who never had the option and went straight to Reg C risk being financially disadvantaged if they decide to bail out at the 16 yr point.

I doubt anyone going through the factory would have had all the pros and cons of accepting the Reg C pointed out to them....
 
#15
goatbagthedruid said:
The Pension Calculator is an excellent tool but cannot find on ArmyNet - brilliant!
For ease of reference, and from the Pay Questions bit of the forum:

THE PENSION CALCULATOR IS NOW AVAILABLE ON THE MOD WEBSITE - www.mod.uk/issues/pensions
THE DIRECT ROUTE IS - http://83.138.137.164/pensioncalculator/WizardScreens/WizDisclaimer.aspx

There is a link on the ArmyNET Home Page to it for quick reference.
Sticky at the top of the first page of said forum under admin, Pay Q's.

Hope this helps.
 
#18
Unfortunately it was probably swept up during the period when you could transfer from the 75 to 05 scheme. Not that I paid any attention; I did the same as 99% of those on the 75 scheme and stuck with it on the basis the MoD doesn't change to a system that would cost it more!
 
#19
Horridlittleman said:
Unfortunately it was probably swept up during the period when you could transfer from the 75 to 05 scheme. Not that I paid any attention; I did the same as 99% of those on the 75 scheme and stuck with it on the basis the MoD doesn't change to a system that would cost it more!
There has never been a pension system changed for the benefit of the pension holders! The pension gap had to be addressed, and AFP 05 was the answer.

I was advised that one huge difference between the schemes was never highlighted - the old scheme is statutory (ie they have to amend an act of Parliament to change it) the new on is not, and therefore a few nerr do wells around a board room table can make decision that will change your life.
 
#20
SE30A said:
Basically, if you leave at 16yrs on a Reg C you get less money. As a Maj it works out at approx £1500pa less than if you didn't convert.

If you convert and then pull the pin, you need to stay to your 18yr point to get the same money as if you left at compulsory discharge at your IRC 16 yr point.
Only if you are on the 75 pension scheme (with an ever decreasing population of people eligible to convert), rather than the 05 scheme. Also, the amount that you lose decreases over time (from around 11% to 0% at your TOS (when it eventually comes about)).

I realise that the majority of you reading this will be on the 75 scheme, but the younger guys/gals on the 05 scheme under command are being influenced by the discussion, so it's worth pointing out again that, for them, there are no dramas and that they can convert now (leaving less spaces for those that aren't sure, but hey).

dpm
 
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