Nurses now in the Daily Wail's headlights

#1
Why this picture shows everything that's wrong about nursing: The tabards that tell patients 'do not disturb' | Mail Online

Are our nurses over worked and underpaid? Would you be offended if, whilst having a stay in hospital, you see a nurse doing the drugs round wearing one of the tabards seen in the article?

Is the world of academia taking over and those of a less academic bent being disuaded from starting a career in nursing because it appears to be more based on learning than 'doing'?

Just as a small cul-de-sac - are our hospitals truly as grubby as the article points out?
 
#2
i don't know much about nursing, less that bus load from Rinteln that i'm still waiting for...but from what i have read over the last couple of years is this -

entry into nursing was once a vocational training programme, a hands on apprenticeship if you like. It then evolved into a 2 year diploma under 'Project 2000' which was generally seen as a bad thing as it 'academicised' the training and many trainees felt that scrubbing down and general cleaning duties was 'beneath them'...as of 2012 the only entry in to nursing will be a 3 yr BSc degree - draw your own conclusions...
 

Fang_Farrier

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#3
Those tabards have been around a while due to proven clinical governance that nurses being disturbed on drug rounds can lead to errors. As far as aware, it's not so much about patients disturbing them as other members of staff and visitors.

And whilst I never disturb a nurse wearing one as I'm aware of why they're wearing them it is strange the number that are wearing them that will break off what they're doing to come to see to me and my team when in to treat a patient when they should be getting on with their role.
 
#5
I'm all for them. Having watched the nurse administering a medication to me which required a calculation being interrupted 21 times between opening the packet and injecting me and that she didn't have anyone to check it with I would rather she had worn these "offensive" tabards and given me the right dose.

An absolute non-story.

If families actually talked to each other, phoned the patients mobile or otherwise communicated so the ward staff didn't have to field 4 phone calls per patient (make that 100 a day) whilst trying to do other tasks it might make life a little easier.
 
#6
Don't see a problem with it myself...

The days of the old stiff upper lip patient, who realises the nurse is handing out hte meds and thus waits for her to finish has gone. Now it is all 'me,me, Me, ME!!!' or the vistors, who can also be a bunch of 'Cnuts'.

I am not sure about EVERY one wearing one. I am sure the nurse with the key to the drugs cabinet could wear one, measure it out and then either hand the stuff out herself, or pass on to the other nurses.

That said, as it stands nurse training DOES seem to have taken a turn to the wrong direction. A nurses job is vocational and practical. So I fail to grasp how so much academic training has been brought in...

Perhaps it is time to look at the compensaton for doing hte job, and the conditions. And plan training that gives the nurses a good head start before the BSc. Perhaps a probationary period on the wards as the general duties bod, cleaning up sick and blood. Moving up the career path from there.

I do like the way the writer of the Daily Mail piece reckons she would have had a nice stay with Florence Nightingale... from what I surmise reading about her, whilst she was indeed pioneering and caring (ie the lady with the lamp bit), I feel pretty sure she would be slightly Battle Axe too, with a good helping of the stereo typical Matron in there!!!

Perhaps we should look at the German system too, visiting hours rigidly enforced, and guests asked to leave if the nurses want you gone, for what ever reason. National Service bods cleansing the wards and assisting with the nif naf and trivia. You eat what you are given to eat, you stay in your bed if told too, and smoking zones are so hard to get to you probably give up!!!

And a heavy religious influence.
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#7
I'm taking 5 minutes out to ponder over the question of just how outraged I might be if I thought about it for long enough.
 
#9
It's all because the NHS, under David and the Tory slave masters, expect us to deliver more with less and there just are not enough resources.

The patient's position has changed too, in that they might now infect us with something, or sue us for something else, and the NHS will wash their hands of it. This is why we need to be conversant in law, ethics, philosophy and a host of other subjects that might guide our decision making.

I'd like to know what percentage of staff in the NHS are recruited from overseas, doctors and nurses. I bet it's high.
 
#10
I don't think I'm alone in thinking this is just common sense, would anyone like to be given Medicines by a Nurse whose being meithered by some bell end relative who wants toknow where they can find a wireless hotspot? I have seen this.
 
#11
Over the past ten years I have visited many friends and relatives in hospital and I can state without exception that British nurses are second to none. The level of care has been brilliant, nothing has been too much trouble, and as far as being friendly, cheerful and caring, nobody comes anywhere near them.
 
#12
We'll I could get off my arse on to the outrage bus, but it'd have to be pointing in the Daily Wail's direction. They make out that nurses are now trying to avoid contact with visitors and patients, when it's for patients own safety. Families might grumble, but I bet they'd grumble more if their dads meds were wrong and he died.

They should have a vote on it in hospitals.

What during medication times would you prefer?
1) Nurses to have tabbards saying they are doing medication and you cannot talk to them.
2) Nurse with no tabbard telling you to "**** off, I'm doing the meds".

I'd vote number two.
 
#13
The Daily Wail. The paper that just keeps on giving and giving, or maybe that should read dishing out shit.
No doubt in tomorrows edition they will have found another part of the public sector to pillory in some none story.
This is a red top tabloid without the red top and titty pics, end of.
 
#14
It's all about standards - If nurses were shown the respect they deserve from both patients and visitors the tabard situation wouldn't arise. Sadly its all part of the I want respect mentality ---Can you imagine anyone gobbing of to the Nurses in the days when the CMH was open ? If you did the Ward Sister would have popped in and kicked your head in.
 
#15
Over the past ten years I have visited many friends and relatives in hospital and I can state without exception that British nurses are second to none. The level of care has been brilliant, nothing has been too much trouble, and as far as being friendly, cheerful and caring, nobody comes anywhere near them.
Yeah, Saudi hospitals are great, but what about the ones in this country? Have you ever had a friend/reli in that sh!thole one in north Staffordshire or the other failing cesspits spread out around the UK??
 
#16
Could be that all the 'gainsayers' are looking at it from the wrong direction!

How about 'we need more nurses on the wards actually nursing',so that the nurse on the 'drugs patrol' doesn't need to be disturbed?

Over the last 10 years I've had occasion to go into hospital about 3 times for major surgery ( Hip Revision,Rotator Cuff,and Bladder),whilst in most cases post-op care has been good,once you are 'back in the world',the nurses disappear,when I inquired after my Hip Revision,I was told "they had other things to do",after my 48 hours in bed,the 'Physical Terrorist' came round,gave me a set of crutches,and sent me on my merry way.

Whilst negotiating the ward,I saw what the "other things" were,lots of nurses congregating around the 'nurses station' gabbing off,texting,and making phone calls,whilst I appreciate,this might not be common practice in your hospital,it certainly was on this ward.

Having complained to the 'Patient Liasion Rep',surprise,surprise,at noon the following day,the 'duty plonker' came and told me to make arrangements to get picked up,as they were discharging me,"they needed the bed",I then asked if I could use a phone to get in touch with my wife to arrange pick-up,I was told "no these are for official calls only",so I then had to walk about 500 yds to reception to make a call.

Back on the ward I then pointed out that their (The Orthopeadic Department) guidelines say the earliest possible discharge after my Op,was 6 days,so why was I going out after two and a half,with a smirk I was again informed they needed the bed,even though the ward was half empty,yeah right.

My opinion for what it's worth,the majority of them (nurses),are to full of their own importance,their job is to provide amongst other things 'Care',not happening people,don't take my word for it,ask the families,who have lost people on the Geriatric wards of this country,it happens,is happening right now in a hospital near you.

As for the Mail article,it's spot on!
 
#17
i don't know much about nursing, less that bus load from Rinteln that i'm still waiting for...but from what i have read over the last couple of years is this -

entry into nursing was once a vocational training programme, a hands on apprenticeship if you like. It then evolved into a 2 year diploma under 'Project 2000' which was generally seen as a bad thing as it 'academicised' the training and many trainees felt that scrubbing down and general cleaning duties was 'beneath them'...as of 2012 the only entry in to nursing will be a 3 yr BSc degree - draw your own conclusions...
Hi Danny

I too do not know much about nursing, but I have watched and supported my daughter as she trained to be a nurse under the Diploma scheme with a top London University and leading London hospital and is now a qualified nurse as of two weeks ago. Her course and the diploma courses at other institutions attended by her friends was a 3 year full time course (I assume somewhat different from the 2 year course you refer to above) and is run jointly alongside the nursing degree course which I understand from my daughter is slightly longer at 3.5.

She has done well and has been successful in being offered a staff nurse post on a medical ward where she has spent six months as a student where she will joining at the same grade and salary as a new degree nurse and where both will undertake the same duties and responsibilities . The main difference between the two qualifications starts to emerge when seeking promotion or certain specializations she has been told.

Whilst no doubt the degree course is more academic (starting from an A level base instead of a GCSE base), the diploma classroom work, homework, assignments and exam work was very demanding for her and me (I proof read much of her work), but the practical training and placement workload is I understand, almost identical. My daughter now plans to top up her diploma to a degree over the next few years.

As a health care assistant prior to and during nursing to make ends meet, she brought with her lots of experience of cleaning and bums wiping when she became a student. No so for some of her friends who were shocked when they found out what was expected of them as students and then as nurses

The ‘do not disturb’ tabard are a great idea. I know from my daughter that the staff in her London ward work she worked on placement for the last six months is under considerable pressure. Long shifts, heavy patient turnaround, distressed relatives, constant stream of drug addicts, down and outs, crime victims, the mentally ill etc, etc . The scope to be distracted from the task at hand is very great as is the scope to make a mistake on the drug round. Hopefully the tabards reduce that risk.

Not a very positive article by the daily mail, but then that’s the mail for you. They will be picking on Arrse next!
Gerryb
 
#18
i don't know much about nursing, less that bus load from Rinteln that i'm still waiting for...but from what i have read over the last couple of years is this -

entry into nursing was once a vocational training programme, a hands on apprenticeship if you like. It then evolved into a 2 year diploma under 'Project 2000' which was generally seen as a bad thing as it 'academicised' the training and many trainees felt that scrubbing down and general cleaning duties was 'beneath them'...as of 2012 the only entry in to nursing will be a 3 yr BSc degree - draw your own conclusions...
I've a cousin who is a senior nurse. She's appalled at the Uni thing. The hygiene thing has a lot to do with greater patient loads and outsourcing cleaning services.

There's an odd idea in the UK that a degree is a prerequisite for any job of substance. I think its drifted in from across the pond like a lot policy silliness. The relationship between getting your hands dirty and status is home grown.

I've visited various hospitals in N.I recently, they are clearly not as well funded but superficially they compare well with what I've seen on the continent in much more expensive health systems. The nurses are notably more cheerful, rather a lot are from the Philippines.
 

Command_doh

LE
Book Reviewer
#19
I think its a great idea, and I suspect the OP is 'outraged blue rinse biddy' from Tunbridge Wells.

Hospitals are generally minging, crumbly places though.
 
#20
I can't be arrsed to read the Daily Mail article. My wife is a mature student who is starting her 3rd year in September and will be qualified in May next year. She is doing the diploma because at her age, she doesn't think the degree qualification will give her much of an advantage for the 12 or 15 years of her remaining working life that she will give to nursing, not that there is much difference between the 2 quals anyway. I recall nurses when I was a youngster and it seems to me that it has changed a lot over the years. The carry on nursing type of work has been long long gone and the training I see my wife doing now involves stuff that clearly demonstrates the skills that many years ago would have been carried out by doctors is now the domain of nurses. I think they are worth every penny that they get.
 

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