NOT made in PR China ....

endure

GCM
Sadly it was not just him. During World War Two, many innovators were appointed to management positions in key way industries - which included all sorts of manufacturing facilities. After the war; they tried to go back to the old ways and the innovators were sidelined.

German and Japan needing rebuilding, including their economies. Both countries were free to use Marshall Aid on industry related project. The innovators such as W Edwards Deming from the US were sent to help them rebuild.

Workers sabotaging products certainly did not help.


The largest beneficiary of Marshall Aid was the UK. We used it to try and prop up the Empire whilst the Germans and the Japanese used it to revitalise their countries.
 

Going out of fashion: Iconic Savile Row tailor Gieves & Hawkes whose suits have been worn by the royals, Churchill and Lord Nelson faces CLOSURE after 250 years over debt crisis at its Chinese parent company​

 

Truxx

LE

Going out of fashion: Iconic Savile Row tailor Gieves & Hawkes whose suits have been worn by the royals, Churchill and Lord Nelson faces CLOSURE after 250 years over debt crisis at its Chinese parent company​

No1 Saville Row IIRC.

These days Hoxton Square for me.
 

ancienturion

LE
Book Reviewer
I have tried to buy British but it is very difficult.
Recently I decided to replace a single 13A socket with one incorporating a USB connection. Off I went thinking MK are a suitable British company and purchased one only to find in small print on the device "Made in China".
Hence I do wonder just how much British products there are now.
 

Yokel

LE
I have tried to buy British but it is very difficult.
Recently I decided to replace a single 13A socket with one incorporating a USB connection. Off I went thinking MK are a suitable British company and purchased one only to find in small print on the device "Made in China".
Hence I do wonder just how much British products there are now.

I admire your efforts to buy British, but the reality is that you would struggle to buy a lot of things that are produced in huge numbers and do not have that much value. Manufacturing is being restored to the UK and other Western nations, but it tends to be where having local manufacture makes a difference - in terms of things such as Quality, responsiveness,, design security, and increasingly things such as environmental standards.

Low to medium volume and high tech/high quality/high speed is the sweet spot for British manufacturers.

I have started a few threads about this topic, which is close to my heart.

Manufacturing in the UK

Commercial shipbuilding - why not in the UK?

Made in Britain - post products and companies here - I was thinking of things that might be purchased by an individual, a household, or a small business.

Keeping important technologies under British (and Western in general) control

Concern has been expressed over key suppliers and parts of our infrastructure fulling into the ownership of foreign companies, and being controlled by management with close connections to potentially hostile Governments.

Is Government able to produce a list of key capabilities that must be kept in the UK and under national control? I am thinking of defence, civil aerospace, civil marine, telecommunications, medical, and industrial machinery.

Could this protection extend to suppliers of things such as PCBs, electromagnetic components, semiconductors, waveguide components, GRP mouldings, fluid valves, hydraulic systems - to name but a few?
 

Yokel

LE
The largest beneficiary of Marshall Aid was the UK. We used it to try and prop up the Empire whilst the Germans and the Japanese used it to revitalise their countries.

Indeed - but apart from that, after the War much of industry tried to reset to the old ways that were familiar, even though they had frequently been unsuitable for the demands of a war economy. The innovators who managed to produce large numbers of fighter aircraft, and stopped Britain from running out of ammunition when raw materials were in short supply, were seen as troublemakers.
 
I have tried to buy British but it is very difficult.
Recently I decided to replace a single 13A socket with one incorporating a USB connection. Off I went thinking MK are a suitable British company and purchased one only to find in small print on the device "Made in China".
Hence I do wonder just how much British products there are now.
You’re unlikely to be able to buy things like that that are made in the U.K. they’re cheap, low tech items that any investor would run a mile if you said you wanted capital to invest in its manufacture.

It’s not that we don’t have the capability to manufacture it. It’s just that there’s more money to make things like that elsewhere.

It’s all to do with comparative advantage.


If you need to spend £400k on an injection moulding machine and then lay down the £60k for the die to make the mouldings. Do you use that £400k machine and spend £60k on a die to make something that sells for £5. Or take that investment that makes something that sells for £60 that’s of a higher spec.

We’re not in competition with China for making plugs. We want China to make Plugs. That way we can trade with China. We buy plugs from them and sell them very profitable luxury goods or financial services. You may also find out that the investment in china to make the plugs in the first place came from a British bank who’s making money off that original investment.

Don’t get me wrong, I love the fact that more manufacturing is coming back to the U.K., but you’re hard pushed to find people to work in it now. Ask you’re average man in the street and they seem to think manufacturing jobs haven’t changed since Dickensian times.

Where the U.K. seems to f*ck up spectacularly, and I blame nationalisation and a massive influx of cheap Labour is Labour productivity levels are shockingly low in the UK.

Visit the BMW plant at Hams Hall and you’re see computer controlled CNC machines automatically machining parts, loaded and unloaded automatically by robots with engines moved around on automated trolley s that get guided around the shop floor from A to B by copper wires embedded in the floor so the trolleys know where they are at all times.

We have a manufacturing base that is getting continually hammered by expensive running costs for electricity and red tape. Managers who have come up from the shop floor with little to no management training. An awful lot, and I mean an awful lot of family owned manufacturing firms who are very, very resistant to change and supply into the same customer base that they’ve been supplying into for decades and don’t want to chase new orders and managers who are only looking at their end of year bonuses. (I put forward a £60k investment that would save us £50k a year. Rejected because they wouldn’t see the benefit in 12 months so it wasn’t viable. That’s bad management because about 10 to 20 years ago everybody started trying to copy GE. GE has now fallen on its arse as it maximised profits short term and didn’t plan long term.
 

Going out of fashion: Iconic Savile Row tailor Gieves & Hawkes whose suits have been worn by the royals, Churchill and Lord Nelson faces CLOSURE after 250 years over debt crisis at its Chinese parent company​


I remember buying some small uniform items from their Edinburgh branch in the 1970s. I seem to recall that they were referred to as "Thieves and Hawkes" and were considered to be more expensive than Jardines (which wasn't cheap either). Unfortunately Jardines closed, so I went for secondhand where possible.
 

ancienturion

LE
Book Reviewer
G & H provided clothing albeit expensive which would last for many many years unlike the current trend for buying clothing and then throwing away after a very short while.
 
G & H provided clothing albeit expensive which would last for many many years unlike the current trend for buying clothing and then throwing away after a very short while.
Which may be why they’re struggling.

Well their Chinese financial backer is, but I suspect somebody else will buy them out who I suspect will be Chinese again.

As a wise man told me a few years back. The Chinese elite aren’t stupid and realise the state can turn on them. They’re not allowed to move cash out of the country, but they can invest their money outside China. It’s a savvy way to get your money out of PRC in case you need to pop smoke and leave in a hurry.

I don’t know why people get so upset about where the money comes from. It’s like people who complain about Chinese money being invested in U.K. utilities. It’s not like they can have a hissy fit and walk off with a power station. Their money is used for the capital outlay for big infrastructure projects.

People will probably forget why it’s Chinese owned. It failed to be a viable entity in the first place and got bought by somebody else .

I hear a lot of people complaining about venture capital firms selling on businesses for profit. As a general rule, they buy up poorly run company’s first peanuts. Invest in them, recruit the right leadership and then sell them on.
 
You’re unlikely to be able to buy things like that that are made in the U.K. they’re cheap, low tech items that any investor would run a mile if you said you wanted capital to invest in its manufacture.

It’s not that we don’t have the capability to manufacture it. It’s just that there’s more money to make things like that elsewhere.

It’s all to do with comparative advantage.


If you need to spend £400k on an injection moulding machine and then lay down the £60k for the die to make the mouldings. Do you use that £400k machine and spend £60k on a die to make something that sells for £5. Or take that investment that makes something that sells for £60 that’s of a higher spec.

We’re not in competition with China for making plugs. We want China to make Plugs. That way we can trade with China. We buy plugs from them and sell them very profitable luxury goods or financial services. You may also find out that the investment in china to make the plugs in the first place came from a British bank who’s making money off that original investment.

Don’t get me wrong, I love the fact that more manufacturing is coming back to the U.K., but you’re hard pushed to find people to work in it now. Ask you’re average man in the street and they seem to think manufacturing jobs haven’t changed since Dickensian times.

Where the U.K. seems to f*ck up spectacularly, and I blame nationalisation and a massive influx of cheap Labour is Labour productivity levels are shockingly low in the UK.

Visit the BMW plant at Hams Hall and you’re see computer controlled CNC machines automatically machining parts, loaded and unloaded automatically by robots with engines moved around on automated trolley s that get guided around the shop floor from A to B by copper wires embedded in the floor so the trolleys know where they are at all times.

We have a manufacturing base that is getting continually hammered by expensive running costs for electricity and red tape. Managers who have come up from the shop floor with little to no management training. An awful lot, and I mean an awful lot of family owned manufacturing firms who are very, very resistant to change and supply into the same customer base that they’ve been supplying into for decades and don’t want to chase new orders and managers who are only looking at their end of year bonuses. (I put forward a £60k investment that would save us £50k a year. Rejected because they wouldn’t see the benefit in 12 months so it wasn’t viable. That’s bad management because about 10 to 20 years ago everybody started trying to copy GE. GE has now fallen on its arse as it maximised profits short term and didn’t plan long term.
Before I joined the Army, way back in 1976, I left school and went to work at a firm called “Ward and Goldstone “ in Salford, Lancashire. A mahoosive employer of local ‘Talent’ and at the time, they paid a good wage. I earned more money in my first year of leaving school, than I did in the subsequent first two years of colour service (I was paid a government top up on my military pay to bring me up to minimum wage(£7 a month iirc)).
Any road, W&G used to make wire from copper rod right up to producing finished rolls of domestic cable to cable used for deep sea comms and anything else related to electrics, including the humble plug. Look at any old plugs you have for the Volex or W&G brand.
1977, The company were on almost perpetual strike for nothing in particular and the unions ignored the management warning s that they were prepared to shut up shop.
As a direct consequence of Union hostility, W& G sold everything they had to someone who then shipped every single piece of heavy industrial machinery to the Chinese.
Something like 1500 people were laid off without a second thought.
Don’t get me wrong, the jobs were low/medium skilled but people had worked there from leaving school and would have been happy to have retired from it. I was using it as a stopgap to earn some mulah.
I fvcking hate the trades unions of this country but can’t pin down why.
 

964ST

LE
Before I joined the Army, way back in 1976, I left school and went to work at a firm called “Ward and Goldstone “ in Salford, Lancashire. A mahoosive employer of local ‘Talent’ and at the time, they paid a good wage. I earned more money in my first year of leaving school, than I did in the subsequent first two years of colour service (I was paid a government top up on my military pay to bring me up to minimum wage(£7 a month iirc)).
Any road, W&G used to make wire from copper rod right up to producing finished rolls of domestic cable to cable used for deep sea comms and anything else related to electrics, including the humble plug. Look at any old plugs you have for the Volex or W&G brand.
1977, The company were on almost perpetual strike for nothing in particular and the unions ignored the management warning s that they were prepared to shut up shop.
As a direct consequence of Union hostility, W& G sold everything they had to someone who then shipped every single piece of heavy industrial machinery to the Chinese.
Something like 1500 people were laid off without a second thought.
Don’t get me wrong, the jobs were low/medium skilled but people had worked there from leaving school and would have been happy to have retired from it. I was using it as a stopgap to earn some mulah.
I fvcking hate the trades unions of this country but can’t pin down why.
Trade Unions are there to protect.

But like you My experience is more negative than positive, so not just UK (I was working in Germanland).

"Lots of Huff & Puff!" and shock when the house falls down.
 
Trade Unions are there to protect.

But like you My experience is more negative than positive, so not just UK (I was working in Germanland).

"Lots of Huff & Puff!" and shock when the house falls down.
They were there to protect the worker from being exploited by working in unsafe conditions and from being forced to shop in company owned shops where you could only spend your company's money but since all of their gripes are covered by law and the workers rights enshrined in statute, their worth is nothing but an organ for financing their communist political puppets.
 
Before I joined the Army, way back in 1976, I left school and went to work at a firm called “Ward and Goldstone “ in Salford, Lancashire. A mahoosive employer of local ‘Talent’ and at the time, they paid a good wage. I earned more money in my first year of leaving school, than I did in the subsequent first two years of colour service (I was paid a government top up on my military pay to bring me up to minimum wage(£7 a month iirc)).
Any road, W&G used to make wire from copper rod right up to producing finished rolls of domestic cable to cable used for deep sea comms and anything else related to electrics, including the humble plug. Look at any old plugs you have for the Volex or W&G brand.
1977, The company were on almost perpetual strike for nothing in particular and the unions ignored the management warning s that they were prepared to shut up shop.
As a direct consequence of Union hostility, W& G sold everything they had to someone who then shipped every single piece of heavy industrial machinery to the Chinese.
Something like 1500 people were laid off without a second thought.
Don’t get me wrong, the jobs were low/medium skilled but people had worked there from leaving school and would have been happy to have retired from it. I was using it as a stopgap to earn some mulah.
I fvcking hate the trades unions of this country but can’t pin down why.

Communist sympathisers take over unions and sabotage UK industry and China benefit? Odd that.

While unions are good at protecting workers rights, they become a liability once the hard left take over.

Unions should really be run by solicitors who practice employment law.
 
Communist sympathisers take over unions and sabotage UK industry and China benefit? Odd that.

While unions are good at protecting workers rights, they become a liability once the hard left take over.

Unions should really be run by solicitors who practice employment law.
No one could afford the fees then.
 
No one could afford the fees then.

With the collective resources of members (union fees etc) I would be surprised if a sympathetic solicitor could not be hired instead of paying for ineffective union reps and leaders. Just a thought.

I know to many people who have been let down by their unions.
 
fvcking hate the trades unions of this country but can’t pin down why.
Because you’ve tumbled the lie that is the TUC. They’ve long since stopped worrying about the condition of the working man/ woman because they’ve been superseded. It’s the cause now just keep saying vulnerable people in the same old mantra. The target now is the migrants who believe them, the simple minded led by Marxist slogan promoted by the ILO.
 

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