Northern Ireland/Bosnia/Kosovo & Iraq/Afghanistan

#1
Are there any parallels between the two groups? (without wishing to oversimplify)

Whilst Northern Ireland did not feature such 21st century (well in vogue for sadists) repugnancies as suicide bombing, bombing is bombing clearly. Did the British military face the same day to day challenges on the same frequency as Iraq & Afghanistan?

Were IEDs a prominent (if at all a) feature of the Northern Ireland landscape?

Was there a sense of surrealness patrolling streets and suburbs that largely looked the same as ones on the British mainland?

Can Northern Ireland be used as a successful template for peace and stability in Iraq or are we dealing with completely different variables?

Can any lessons from Northern Ireland be applied to Iraq and Afghanistan?

Any thoughts and comments (preferably elaborated POVs) are welcome.

FYI I'm not a journalist fishing for a story. Just an overly curious mind.
 
#3
2404Motorman said:
You just don't give up, do you mate?

You had a courteous and measured response from suits_u in the Military history forum.

Why on earth should anyone trust you?

Curious mind? Yeah - Ok
Well this is only my second posting regarding Northern Ireland, so I think the first sentence is a little of an exaggeration.

However even if you and others are unwilling to answer the more personal questions regarding direct experience. Surely it isn't too much of a burden to provide answers to the abstract questions I asked?

Such as :-

Are there any parallels between the two groups? (without wishing to oversimplify)

Whilst Northern Ireland did not feature such 21st century (well in vogue for sadists) repugnancies as suicide bombing, bombing is bombing clearly. Did the British military face the same day to day challenges on the same frequency as Iraq & Afghanistan?

Can Northern Ireland be used as a successful template for peace and stability in Iraq or are we dealing with completely different variables?

Can any lessons from Northern Ireland be applied to Iraq and Afghanistan?

I can't do anything nor truly care if you do not trust my motives. However I only ask you give some consideration to the questions I highlighted above.
 
#4
Well, you won't get anything out of me - personal, specific, or general.

If others want to communicate with you, that is a matter for their judgement.

There is something a little weird about your persistence, also your prose style is idiosyncratic to the extent that makes me think that English is not your first language.

Which, for me, is even more suspicious. (mind you I have been suspicious and paranoid for a long time, it has kept me alive.)

No, something not quite right about you mate.

Goodbye from me.
 
#5
2404Motorman said:
Well, you won't get anything out of me - personal, specific, or general.
I more or less gathered that from your second post, although thank you for clarifying.

If others want to communicate with you, that is a matter for their judgement.
Yes I was aware of that but thank you anyway.

There is something a little weird about your persistence, also your prose style is idiosyncratic to the extent that makes me think that English is not your first language.
Persistence/stubbornness is one of many character traits that I possess, it's a certain drive I have within me although don't be alarmed I wish you not ill-feeling :p. Besides I don't think I was conceived with being perfect in mind.

Since I've grown up practically learning to speak both Welsh & English at the same time. I guess that may loosely contribute to my 'peculiarity' in composition. Although I'd be amused to know your reasons for thinking so?

If you mean my habit of using multiple words for a single meaning (using '/') then that is stemmed from an urge not to repeat the same words too much and to always use as expansive a vocabulary and diction as possible.

I'd also like to point out that I am often surprised by language skills of people in the UK, especially from England whose sole language is English (largely). You'd think they'd command a better use of their mother tongue, nevermind.

I've also consumed a Kronenbourg Blanc beverage which doesn't usually impair my typing skills; in fact I often find a little can boost my articulation. Plus it is early in the morning!

Which, for me, is even more suspicious. (mind you I have been suspicious and paranoid for a long time, it has kept me alive.)

No, something not quite right about you mate.

Goodbye from me.
Well I wouldn't ask you to betray your instinct since it is necessary in your vocation. However I can only say that in this instance it is unfounded.

Good day
 
#6
I lost a couple of limbs in NI, others died too. I understand this also happens in Bosnia/Kosovo & Iraq/Afghanistan.

As for the rest of your post, if I cant say anything nice or constructive I'll say nothing at all.................

WW
 
#7
Technocratic_Turbine,
Are you sure you're not a sweet little girl pretending to be a grown man, grooming us in some nefarious plan to lure us into girlie chats about Lillie Allen's Brazilian. 8O
 
#8
Northern Ireland was particulary bad in 1970s/1980s.

In 1972, Britain lost well over 100 soldiers alone, that is more than Basra in 4 years.

All ops are dangerous. But N Irealnd is the UK so of course its a little different from Afghan/ Iraq. Look at what we have had in N Ireland, ceasefires, the Good Friday agreemant, the British Government has worked hard to get the peace with Sinn Fein.
This will not happen when we fight insurgents in the middle east, you cant reason with these fanatics.

They are a different kind of terroist.

But the IRA are still the bad guys- just things have quietened down since the 1990s.
 
#9
Northern Ireland/Bosnia/Iraq/Afghanistan have something in common
Kosovo has a couple of things in common with Bosnia.
If you won't accept answer you received from suits_u in the Military history forum - spreading your question around other forums isn't going to help.

Go to your local library - you should be able to get the answers you require there.
 
#10
ita-al said:
Technocratic_Turbine,
Are you sure you're not a sweet little girl pretending to be a grown man, grooming us in some nefarious plan to lure us into girlie chats about Lillie Allen's Brazilian. 8O
LOL oh dear, I applaud you on your effort but I've seen more creativity on the back of a pistachios packet.

You seem to show a penchant for little girls and Lillie Allen's nether region (make of that what you will people). I suggest that you seek out a 'Nicky Clarke' style alternative site to personal grooming, I'm sure you'll be able to satisfy your banal urges.

Look I don't see the point of people posting if they have nothing worthwhile to contribute to a thread.

armies said:
Northern Ireland was particulary bad in 1970s/1980s.

In 1972, Britain lost well over 100 soldiers alone, that is more than Basra in 4 years.

All ops are dangerous. But N Irealnd is the UK so of course its a little different from Afghan/ Iraq. Look at what we have had in N Ireland, ceasefires, the Good Friday agreemant, the British Government has worked hard to get the peace with Sinn Fein.
This will not happen when we fight insurgents in the middle east, you cant reason with these fanatics.

They are a different kind of terroist.

But the IRA are still the bad guys- just things have quietened down since the 1990s.
Thanks for making a genuine effort to reply rather than pointless attempts at witticism.

Since guys like Martin McGuiness & Gerry Adams (knowing the things they sanctioned) are now in the political mainframe, is that a compromise that has to be made?

I feel the solution for Iraq clearly is reconciliation between the warring Sunni/Shite factions. I can't see how military power alone is enough and I'm sure that the powers that be are fully aware of this. If you can get the perpetrators of these acts engaged in politics rather than fighting then that will be something. I do believe that Northern Ireland and Bosnia provide good templates for stability.

As for the insurgents, if they were willing to come to the negotiating table, should talking to them be considered an option?

As for Northern Ireland, whilst it seems to be a success story the RIRA are still around and have pledged to continue fighting.

rockape34 said:
Northern Ireland/Bosnia/Iraq/Afghanistan have something in common
Kosovo has a couple of things in common with Bosnia.
If you won't accept answer you received from suits_u in the Military history forum - spreading your question around other forums isn't going to help.

Go to your local library - you should be able to get the answers you require there.
Well I was trying to ask more open ended questions here, although it's amusing that you made an effort to put those letters in bold, italics and underline rather than try and answer any question. Dim ots.

I've also purchased two books on the Troubles as I stated on the other thread. I'm merely interested in hearing personal accounts as I find it more personal.
 
#12
the conflicts mentioned are/were all dangerous in their own way - some units lost more men on one tour of Bosnia than they did during one tour in Iraq. Bosnia was a peace keeping Op with restrictive ROEs where you couldn't open fire while Iraq is a high intensity Op where the ROEs let you return fire at the slightest hint of danger.

a bit of basic research reading a few books about the aformentioned conflicts will give you a very good idea.
 
#13
BB51 said:
Yeh Yeh TT - why dont you just fock of you journo parasite.
Lol the irony being I despise the media bar a few individuals in it. I won't **** off thank you. You at least could've employed more tact and not just joined the others like sheep.

BFT-Bandit said:
the conflicts mentioned are/were all dangerous in their own way - some units lost more men on one tour of Bosnia than they did during one tour in Iraq. Bosnia was a peace keeping Op with restrictive ROEs where you couldn't open fire while Iraq is a high intensity Op where the ROEs let you return fire at the slightest hint of danger.

a bit of basic research reading a few books about the aformentioned conflicts will give you a very good idea.
First of all thanks for your reply. I appreciate any snippet about prior assignments, no matter how big or small.

I was looking at the roll of honour thread down in the military history section. I was astonished at the numbers of men lost largely through accidents. Were there many reported 'firefights' (wish I could find a better word) during initial deployment in Bosnia?

The only thing I've found so far is a video involving a Danish Army detatchment apparently during Operation Oluja

Were there potential hazards after the fighting had stopped, such as criminal gangs? What about reception by the civilians?

I'll definitely purchase some books on the Bosnian conflict as I don't have any at the moment.
 

TheIronDuke

ADC
Book Reviewer
#14
Always glad to help a journo who is stuck to his swivel chair.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Are there any parallels between the two groups? (without wishing to oversimplify)
Five groups, Shirley?

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Whilst Northern Ireland did not feature such 21st century (well in vogue for sadists) repugnancies as suicide bombing, bombing is bombing clearly. Did the British military face the same day to day challenges on the same frequency as Iraq & Afghanistan?
The camel spiders are smaller in South Armagh and whilst there were no suicide bombings there were a few own goals.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Were IEDs a prominent (if at all a) feature of the Northern Ireland landscape?
A full answer to this one would contravene the Official Secrets Act. Suffice it to say that the Institution of Engineering Designers 'Water Pulse' comms system was a masterstroke. You could recieve your morning briefing whilst dumping the groceries.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Was there a sense of surrealness patrolling streets and suburbs that largely looked the same as ones on the British mainland?
Only if you were getting the good acid. I saw Adolf Hitler playing with Howard the Duck in a park in Tandragee one time. It was most touching.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Can Northern Ireland be used as a successful template for peace and stability in Iraq or are we dealing with completely different variables?
What do you think you tube? For starters, most of the people in NI could read. Which meant their opinions didnt come from some bible thumping bearded loon.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Can any lessons from Northern Ireland be applied to Iraq and Afghanistan?
Yes. 'Dont put black polish on brown boots' works anywhere.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Any thoughts and comments (preferably elaborated POVs) are welcome.
I've had it with fucking daft questions is my POV.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
FYI I'm not a journalist fishing for a story. Just an overly curious mind.
Yeah, and I'm the Sugar Plum Fairy. No honest. I'll lift me kilt. See?

Hope that helped?
 
#15
TheIronDuke said:
Always glad to help a journo who is stuck to his swivel chair.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Are there any parallels between the two groups? (without wishing to oversimplify)
Five groups, Shirley?

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Whilst Northern Ireland did not feature such 21st century (well in vogue for sadists) repugnancies as suicide bombing, bombing is bombing clearly. Did the British military face the same day to day challenges on the same frequency as Iraq & Afghanistan?
The camel spiders are smaller in South Armagh and whilst there were no suicide bombings there were a few own goals.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Were IEDs a prominent (if at all a) feature of the Northern Ireland landscape?
A full answer to this one would contravene the Official Secrets Act. Suffice it to say that the Institution of Engineering Designers 'Water Pulse' comms system was a masterstroke. You could recieve your morning briefing whilst dumping the groceries.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Was there a sense of surrealness patrolling streets and suburbs that largely looked the same as ones on the British mainland?
Only if you were getting the good acid. I saw Adolf Hitler playing with Howard the Duck in a park in Tandragee one time. It was most touching.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Can Northern Ireland be used as a successful template for peace and stability in Iraq or are we dealing with completely different variables?
What do you think you tube? For starters, most of the people in NI could read. Which meant their opinions didnt come from some bible thumping bearded loon.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Can any lessons from Northern Ireland be applied to Iraq and Afghanistan?
Yes. 'Dont put black polish on brown boots' works anywhere.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
Any thoughts and comments (preferably elaborated POVs) are welcome.
I've had it with fucking daft questions is my POV.

Technocratic_Turbine said:
FYI I'm not a journalist fishing for a story. Just an overly curious mind.
Yeah, and I'm the Sugar Plum Fairy. No honest. I'll lift me kilt. See?

Hope that helped?
:D :D :D :D :D :thumright:
 
#17
Technocratic_Turbine said:
Are there any parallels between the two groups? (without wishing to oversimplify)

Whilst Northern Ireland did not feature such 21st century (well in vogue for sadists) repugnancies as suicide bombing, bombing is bombing clearly. Did the British military face the same day to day challenges on the same frequency as Iraq & Afghanistan?

Were IEDs a prominent (if at all a) feature of the Northern Ireland landscape?

Was there a sense of surrealness patrolling streets and suburbs that largely looked the same as ones on the British mainland?

Can Northern Ireland be used as a successful template for peace and stability in Iraq or are we dealing with completely different variables?

Can any lessons from Northern Ireland be applied to Iraq and Afghanistan?

Any thoughts and comments (preferably elaborated POVs) are welcome.

FYI I'm not a journalist fishing for a story. Just an overly curious mind.
Read a book on the Troubles :twisted: What age are you - if you are more than 20, where have you been FFS :?

If you are a Journo, the book or article you are writing will be a revelation to us all - probably.

Google 321 EOD Unit and check the results.
 
#18
I tell you what, you try and be nice and advise people that perhaps their questions are not appropriate and they still carry on.
Then they have the audacity to get shirty with people who echo the same comments.
So Ill be blunt.


Fuck off you gopping civvy journo cunt. You have no right what so fucking ever to get shirty with people who have experienced things you so desperately seek to experience. If you want to know about it so much, join up.
If you cant join up, read books, research, whatever. Dont expect people to be open with a complete stranger on a public forum when some cant even open up to their own families.
Alles Klar? Good now fuck off.











And breathe.........
 
#19
suits_U said:
I tell you what, you try and be nice and advise people that perhaps their questions are not appropriate and they still carry on.
Then they have the audacity to get shirty with people who echo the same comments.
So Ill be blunt.


Fuck off you gopping civvy journo cunt. You have no right what so fucking ever to get shirty with people who have experienced things you so desperately seek to experience. If you want to know about it so much, join up.
If you cant join up, read books, research, whatever. Dont expect people to be open with a complete stranger on a public forum when some cant even open up to their own families.
Alles Klar? Good now fuck off.











And breathe.........

Well said that man!
 
#20
TheIronDuke said:
Always glad to help a journo who is stuck to his swivel chair.
I'm actually sitting on a 'director's chair'...oh and I'm not a journalist (I certainly don't get paid)

Five groups, Shirley?
Arithmetic dear fellow...two groups hence the '&'. I grouped Northern Ireland/Bosnia/Kosovo together, because they were pre-September the 11th. They're also on the European continent so more 'local' affairs.

The camel spiders are smaller in South Armagh and whilst there were no suicide bombings there were a few own goals.
You forgot to mention Guiness..

A full answer to this one would contravene the Official Secrets Act. Suffice it to say that the Institution of Engineering Designers 'Water Pulse' comms system was a masterstroke. You could recieve your morning briefing whilst dumping the groceries.
So sitting on a bog or 'khazi' whilst reading the paper and unloading the previous night's contents. Well good to know your water pulse worked. Although I'd suggest an WC exploits shouldn't be shared here if you'd be so kind.

Only if you were getting the good acid. I saw Adolf Hitler playing with Howard the Duck in a park in Tandragee one time. It was most touching.
Sounds rather tame...

What do you think you tube? For starters, most of the people in NI could read. Which meant their opinions didnt come from some bible thumping bearded loon.
Tube lol...I admit I can squeeze the life out of people but any other comparison to a cylindrical shape stops there. I also wouldn't pretend to know where all Iraqis get their information. Clearly the vast majority of Northern Irelanders could read (faux pas my friend)...just a question of which material they were reading.

Yes. 'Dont put black polish on brown boots' works anywhere.
Kiwi's needs to think about their branding...of course reading and looking at the tin might help.

I've had it with fucking daft questions is my POV.
Then don't reply to them...that's my POV

Yeah, and I'm the Sugar Plum Fairy. No honest. I'll lift me kilt. See?
I wouldn't wish to expose your phallic inadequacy, but if you insist..

Hope that helped?
Amusing :D
 

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