No brexit, how would it work?

#1
A lot of chatter on no brexit in the other thread so probably deserves it's own discussion. Personally I think there is more chance of platting fog but lets have a look at the legal, political and practical issues around achieving a no brexit and preventing it.

To open the chat on a legal basis, the European Communites Act 1972 has been repealed by parliament, how would that be unrepealed?
 
#4
Potentially depending on the outcome of the ECJ and Supreme court cases coming up, A50 might be able to be repealed unilaterally by the UK.


he UK government will go to the Supreme Court in an attempt to stop the European Court of Justice hearing a case on whether the UK can unilaterally revoke its decision to leave the EU. The ECJ is due to hear a court case later this month on the legal question of whether the UK’s Article 50 notification can be unilaterally revoked by the country, in a case brought by politicians including Andy Wightman, a Scottish Green MSP. The ECJ hearing is due to take place on November 27 and its ruling could be significant for the UK government, which has insisted there can be no revocation of Article 50. In September, Scottish courts ruled the question should be referred to the ECJ, and the Scottish appeal court subsequently refused to allow the government’s appeal against the decision. The Department for Exiting the European Union has now applied to the Supreme Court for permission to appeal against the decision. The court said on Friday it would consider whether to hear the appeal. It did not give a date, but indicated it was aware of the urgency of the matter. The case of whether Article 50 can be reversed is backed by the Good Law Project, set up by anti-Brexit barrister Jo Maugham.

Should parliament take control somehow or another, this is a possible route
 
#5
Ok so first Uk SC then ECJ definative rulings will be required. How long do you think that will take?
 
#7
A lot of chatter on no brexit in the other thread so probably deserves it's own discussion. Personally I think there is more chance of platting fog but lets have a look at the legal, political and practical issues around achieving a no brexit and preventing it.

To open the chat on a legal basis, the European Communites Act 1972 has been repealed by parliament, how would that be unrepealed?
The ECA 1972 has not been repealed.

A repealed Act cannot be unrepealed. A new Act must be brought in going through the usual process of bringing a bill through Parliament.

The referendum on leaving the EU is not legally nor constitutionally binding, however, as shown, it is politically toxic.
 
#8
The ECA 1972 has not been repealed.

A repealed Act cannot be unrepealed. A new Act must be brought in going through the usual process of bringing a bill through Parliament.

The referendum on leaving the EU is not legally nor constitutionally binding, however, as shown, it is politically toxic.
It was specifically repealed by the EU withdrawal act 2018.
 
#11
Ok so no 1 obstacle is repeal EU withdrawal act 2018 before it kicks in. How will that work?

(And thanks to dinger and NI for the info)
 
#12
Ok so no 1 obstacle is repeal EU withdrawal act 2018 before it kicks in. How will that work?

(And thanks to dinger and NI for the info)
No need to, it only applies on exit day, no exit then nothing in the act applies.
 
#13
A lot of chatter on no brexit in the other thread so probably deserves it's own discussion. Personally I think there is more chance of platting fog but lets have a look at the legal, political and practical issues around achieving a no brexit and preventing it.

To open the chat on a legal basis, the European Communites Act 1972 has been repealed by parliament, how would that be unrepealed?
Look, I'm an old sod who voted for Brexit. I've refrained from calling remainers remoaners, but it can be difficult. I can't count the number of times the party I've voted for were beaten. Did I complain? No, because no barsteward was interested. In this country, like it or not, (and I'm not,) it's first past the post that wins.

Funnily enough I suspect most of us who voted for Brexit were also thinking of future generations, so the moral high ground is not the prerogative of the Remainers. Whereas I accepted when the vote went against me, what happens in the future when it goes against you? Oh, we've seen that already, moan, ask for a "*peoples" vote, go to parliament so they can decide. Aye, right! All of you remainers, who don't accept the result, do NOT believe in democracy! Well, only when it agrees with your side of the argument. Everybody else is wrong!!

Incidentally, I voted us in the last time, but what I signed up for was not what I got! Google is supposed to be your friend, well use it! You are far more capable than me of using the net. Dig into what the EU says and what it actually does. A recent example, 5/6 years ago(?), they were refuting having a European Army. Now? Dig deep. Do your own research, not mine or what you read, then reach your own conclusions.

*Does this only apply to people who vote the "right" way?
 

RP578

LE
Book Reviewer
#16
No need to, it only applies on exit day, no exit then nothing in the act applies.
Up to a point Lord Copper. Parliament has actually done two separate things: Firstly, voted to trigger Article 50, which binds both the UK and EU into withdrawing the UK from the EU. Secondly, Parliament has passed the European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018, which includes: section 20(1) defining "exit day" as "29 March 2019 at 11.00 p.m" and commits us to exit on that date.

Moreover the Meaningful Vote is a 'Take Note Motion' and therefore unamendable. I suppose MPs could try and vote through an Opposition Motion, but that wouldn't be legally binding either. It's bit of a game of high stakes poker for Remain (especially Labour Remainers) MPs who want to block the Government at all costs, but still want a close arrangement with the EU, as they risk defaulting to a WTO Brexit.

Repealing Article 50 would only be the first step. The EU (Withdrawal) Act 2018 would also need to be overturned. Realistically, this could be done as part of the same Bill? Probably I suppose, but who knows.
 
#17
Look, I'm an old sod who voted for Brexit. I've refrained from calling remainers remoaners, but it can be difficult. I can't count the number of times the party I've voted for were beaten. Did I complain? No, because no barsteward was interested. In this country, like it or not, (and I'm not,) it's first past the post that wins.

Funnily enough I suspect most of us who voted for Brexit were also thinking of future generations, so the moral high ground is not the prerogative of the Remainers. Whereas I accepted when the vote went against me, what happens in the future when it goes against you? Oh, we've seen that already, moan, ask for a "*peoples" vote, go to parliament so they can decide. Aye, right! All of you remainers, who don't accept the result, do NOT believe in democracy! Well, only when it agrees with your side of the argument. Everybody else is wrong!!

Incidentally, I voted us in the last time, but what I signed up for was not what I got! Google is supposed to be your friend, well use it! You are far more capable than me of using the net. Dig into what the EU says and what it actually does. A recent example, 5/6 years ago(?), they were refuting having a European Army. Now? Dig deep. Do your own research, not mine or what you read, then reach your own conclusions.

*Does this only apply to people who vote the "right" way?
Shame I can only give you one like for that.

However, I was thinking along the lines of re-invading France, skipping round the end of the Maginot line, taking out Bruussels with a Tac-Nuke and moving on to Berlin with a surprise package for Frau Merkel...
 
#18
As I understand it, the law has been passed by an act of parliament to take us out of the EU. Therefore, to stop us from leaving that law would need repealing to allow us to remain in the EU. This would also require an act of parliament.

Although not insurmountable, it would be difficult to get passed given the amount of opposition that would arise from any attempt to do so, as well as there is little time in which it could be enacted before the withdrawal date.
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
#19
Technically, Article 50 has been activated so, come the happy day in March and absent of any agreement, we're out of the EU and free to spend the rest of eternity farting through silk or swapping recipes for rock soup, depending on which propaganda package you subscribe to.

Based on what's happened so far, about the only certainty is that no-one's going to let this to go to no deal so, one way or another, some way will be found to kick the can down the road and create the necessary space at the expense of constitutional procedure. Technically all the remaining EU Members have to agree to an extension, which would be quite a cat-herding exercise, but the court case referenced earlier might present a more elegant and achievable fix and remove the necessity of chucking the more opportunist EU members a bung.

Ultimately it's going to become increasingly harder to pretend that due process is being observed, those on all sides involved in the coming fiasco are going to haemorrhage credibility and everyone else is going to get even angrier and even more vehement - if that were possible.

I'm now increasingly of the view that both the UK and the EU are holed below the waterline and that those in authority will be guided by what they have the power to do rather than what they have the responsibility to do.
 

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