News story: Novichok nerve agent use in Salisbury: UK government response

Let's recall Vienna convention on consular relations that is signed by the UK.
http://legal.un.org/ilc/texts/instruments/english/conventions/9_2_1963.pdf

Now HMG denies access of Russian consular officers to Yulia Skripal who is Russian citizen.
British MSM doesn't care to inform the British about such a rude violation of the Vienna Convention by HMG.
Does it mean that Russian authorities have now right not to respect the Vienna convention?
What sort of help can they provide to someone in intensive care?
 

Higgs_bosun

On ROPS
On ROPs
As you have no idea what information has been available to me, or what I have chosen to see, hear and read that's quite a silly statement.

Thanks for pointing out that just like every single other poster in this thread you aren't calling for a pre emtive strike (whatever that means in the context of a thread where posters are posting in REACTION to an event). :)
You claim to know here my information comers from...
I wonder if you know anything else. You are calling me silly... aaand ta ta.
 
Agreeing with everything that other people say is not being open minded...probably the opposite.
The same applies to condemning some action that you don't agree with based on evidence that you haven't seen.
Russia, the UK and the world is full of rogue elements...not all of them report to Putin.
That sounds 'conspiracy like' to me
A Russian invented nerve agent does not need to be manufactured in Russia nor does it indicate who used it or why.
A Soviet invented nerve agent can be used as a 'signature'. That would be closing your mind again.
I'm not blaming anyone...btw Sergei Skripal has been in UK for 8 years living under his own name.
You're dismissing. Hardly the actions with one who talks about law, and then dismisses 'balance of probabilities' or 'beyond reasonable doubt'. Hardly the actions of somebody with an 'open mind'.
The timing, and motivation for the attack is questionable. I'm not ignoring anything.
It's not questionable if you accept the facts. Your dismissal of the facts, let alone the assumptions are not the actions of somebody with an open mind.
Ditto... The UK along with the US have embarked on a massive policy of aggression covering two decades... but we have not stopped trading with Russia and the new generation go there for holidays.
Ditto? The Russian state ignored NATO for two decades? What do you mean 'ditto'? The rest pretty much shows you don't have an open mind to anything.

Trade? What trade do we currently have with Russia that they haven't embargoed? As for holidays, it still happens and is probably why so many come here and stay but rarely the other way round.
 
For what purpose do your Russian consular officers propose to visit Yulia Skripal unrequested?
What sort of help can they provide to someone in intensive care?
Apparently you don't understand my point.
Russian consulate has RIGHT prescribed by the Vienna convention and HMG has DUTY to allow access of Russian consular officer to Russian citizen. The Vienna convention doesn't require any explanation. So the right is unconditional.
So why HMG does apparently violate the convention?

As for reasons then it is quite natural to check conditions, to be aware about health, treatment. What if ms.Skipal is being kept in a dungeon with rats and is being prepared to be murdered to 'confirm' version about evil Russians that 'poisoned her'?
 
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The acess may be to observe the victims at close ( clinical ) Range.
Something went wrong, they were supposed to die horribly and send vlads message to the others. After a close peek the dose/ delivery system may need tweaking.
 
Apparently you don't understand my point.
Russian consulate has RIGHT prescribed by the Vienna convention and HMG has DUTY to allow access of Russian consular oficer to Russian citizen. The Vienna convention doesn't require any explanation. So the right is unconditional.
So why HMG does apparently violate the convention?

As for reasons then it is quite natural to check conditions, to be aware about health, treatment. What if ms.Skipal is being kept in a dungeon with rats and is being prepared to be murdered to 'confirm' virsion about evil Russians that 'poisoned her'?
Apparently you don't understand my point.
Russian consulate has RIGHT prescribed by the Vienna convention and HMG has DUTY to allow access of Russian consular oficer to Russian citizen. The Vienna convention doesn't require any explanation. So the right is unconditional.
So why HMG does apparently violate the convention?

As for reasons then it is quite natural to check conditions, to be aware about health, treatment. What if ms.Skipal is being kept in a dungeon with rats and is being prepared to be murdered to 'confirm' virsion about evil Russians that 'poisoned her'?
I would have thought that the doctors treating Ms Skripal have the right to deny access if it was not in the best interest of their patient and that this would take precedence over the Vienna Convention.

As to your contention that the conditions at Salisbury District Hospital may be akin to those of a dungeon I would beg to differ, on my last visit it was more akin to a Travelodge. Also it may be usual to hold people in such conditions in Russia and to murder them it is not routinely done in the Uk.
 
For what purpose do your Russian consular officers propose to visit Yulia Skripal unrequested?
To finish her off perhaps?
 
............What if ms.Skipal is being kept in a dungeon with rats and is being prepared to be murdered to 'confirm' version about evil Russians that 'poisoned her'?
She's in the UK, not Russia.

Nice to know you now have concern over your 'collateral damage'. Can't you just round up a couple of Chechens and blame them for it all?
 
Let's recall Vienna convention on consular relations that is signed by the UK.
http://legal.un.org/ilc/texts/instruments/english/conventions/9_2_1963.pdf

Now HMG denies access of Russian consular officers to Yulia Skripal who is Russian citizen.
British MSM doesn't care to inform the British about such a rude violation of the Vienna Convention by HMG.
Does it mean that Russian authorities have now right not to respect the Vienna convention?
Actually the newspapers have mentioned the consular access/Vienna convention issue. Days ago, if not weeks.

As you probably know.
 
Apparently you don't understand my point.
Russian consulate has RIGHT prescribed by the Vienna convention and HMG has DUTY to allow access of Russian consular oficer to Russian citizen. The Vienna convention doesn't require any explanation. So the right is unconditional.
So why HMG does apparently violate the convention?

As for reasons then it is quite natural to check conditions, to be aware about health, treatment. What if ms.Skipal is being kept in a dungeon with rats and is being prepared to be murdered to 'confirm' version about evil Russians that 'poisoned her'?
A chemical weapon was used, of Russian origin, you blinked first, all bets off regarding Geneva. We're playing it Vlads way and he doesn't like it.
 
Actually the newspapers have mentioned the consular access/Vienna convention issue. Days ago, if not weeks.

As you probably know.
If there's no mention of it in the brief Putin's_Mouthpiece was given, it never happened.....
 
I would have thought that the doctors treating Ms Skripal have the right to deny access if it was not in the best interest of their patient and that this would take precedence over the Vienna Convention.
The text of the Convention doesn't contain any this sort reservations. Anyway, HMG should present explanation of the access denial. There is no any explanation. At least, I'm unaware about any explanation.
As to your contention that the conditions at Salisbury District Hospital may be akin to those of a dungeon I would beg to differ, on my last visit it was more akin to a Travelodge. Also it may be usual to hold people in such conditions in Russia and to murder them it is not routinely done in the Uk.
They are very interesting observations but Russian consulate has right to know about ms.Skripal whereabout. Is she indeed in the Salisbury District Hospital or in another place and is she unconscious or just unlawfully detained agaist her will.
 
I was wondering who you guys were talking to, then I checked who gave out the dumbdumb rating on the last page, and it clicked.

HB Pencil. He is a card. I've had him on Ignore for months. And they've been nice.
 
Apparently you don't understand my point.
Russian consulate has RIGHT prescribed by the Vienna convention and HMG has DUTY to allow access of Russian consular officer to Russian citizen. The Vienna convention doesn't require any explanation. So the right is unconditional.
So why HMG does apparently violate the convention?

As for reasons then it is quite natural to check conditions, to be aware about health, treatment. What if ms.Skipal is being kept in a dungeon with rats and is being prepared to be murdered to 'confirm' version about evil Russians that 'poisoned her'?
The lucky bugger, we used to dream of being kept in a dungeon full of rates. Kids today just don't know the are born.:roll:
 
Explain where the chemical weapon you invented came from, and we may give you a supervised visit behind a glass screen if the patient gives permission.

Until then Foxtrot Oscar.
 
The text of the Convention doesn't contain any this sort reservations. Anyway, HMG should present explanation of the access denial. There is no any explanation. At least, I'm unaware about any explanation.

They are very interesting observations but Russian consulate has right to know about ms.Skripal whereabout. Is she indeed in the Salisbury District Hospital or in another place and is she unconscious or just unlawfully detained agaist her will.
Indeed the convention does not mention any reservations of this nature, therefore I would read it that the doctor's duties to their patients takes primacy. The details of the patients condition are therefore confidential and any statements should bear this in mind, revealing whether consular access has been denied/allowed could be considered an abuse of this confidentiality. I would suggest that in this situation it could be that the doctor in charge of treatment feels that a visit by a Russian Consul could be construed as being detrimental to the patient's health and wellbeing.

In your conjecture that Ms Skripal is being held unlawfully, that may be common practice in Russia but is not something that is routinely done in the UK.
 
You claim to know here my information comers from...
I wonder if you know anything else. You are calling me silly... aaand ta ta.
Oh dear oh dear.
Feel free to point out where I claimed to know 'here your information comers from' ( or even where your information comes from). Was it in the post where I gave you a like as you said you had missed any Russian obfuscation!
 

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