Newcastle BAE Tank factory to close?

#2
Interesting.

So which is the best solution - the US version we look like we are buying, or the BAE version that protects jobs in Newcastle?

I personally would suggest that we should buy the "FRES" that offers the best protection for soldiers, not the best protection for jobs in Newcastle.

But maybe that is me being a bit too tactical and not thinking strategically.
 
#3
Will be a shame if Vickers goes, my uncle worked there for decades. Its the last thing we need in the west end of Newcastle.

British jobs for British workers eh.
 
#4
Bazz

Mate you have hit the nail very firmly on the fucking head, but just wait until Lord Voldemort Mandelbum gets his fucking oar in.

You can take odds on that we will be getting a British solution outsourced to Europe that will be delivered 15 years late and 6 Batallions and an Aircraft Carrier over budget. But fuck it the unions don't get cash if their workers are out of work and if the unions don't get cash, Labour don't get funded blah blah blah blah and LM can't be an advisor to the government if the government ain't labour. Soldiers lives only become an issue when they can't be buried by other bad news.

I'm in a fucking foul mood today

where's that sven cunt?
 
#5
vvaannmmaann said:
If this order goes to the Septics,it could mean the end for yet another British workforce.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/engineering/article7063234.ece
Okay and again we enter the world of fantasy...please try to read deeper than the press waffle.

The BAE product is the CV90 - it is designed and built in SWEDEN, until Monday morning the majority of production for FRES was going to be in - yes you guessed it - SWEDEN.

The GD product is the ASCOD - it was designed and built as a colaborative project between Spain and Austria, it is therefore built in Spain/Austria. The majority of production for FRES was going to be built in - no you have it wrong - DSG in the UK

So which option was the 'British' design again?

S_R
 
#6
Anyone wondering how it is that BAE continually get MoD contracts despite almost constantly delivering second rate products years late and massively over budget need look no further than this article. BAE suddenly remembers it has a factory in Tyneside only when it looks about to lose the competition on its merits.

I wouldn't mind, but just about every penny BAE has gouged from the UK taxpayer in the last decade or so has been spent buying up second and third tier US defence manufacturers in a desperate effort to shed whatever vestiges of Britishness BAE still has and become a US 'prime'. It only wants to be British when it thinks it can gouge yet more money out of the MoD.
 
#7
Sympathetic_Reaction said:
vvaannmmaann said:
If this order goes to the Septics,it could mean the end for yet another British workforce.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/engineering/article7063234.ece
Okay and again we enter the world of fantasy...please try to read deeper than the press waffle.

The BAE product is the CV90 - it is designed and built in SWEDEN, until Monday morning the majority of production for FRES was going to be in - yes you guessed it - SWEDEN.

The GD product is the ASCOD - it was designed and built as a colaborative project between Spain and Austria, it is therefore built in Spain/Austria. The majority of production for FRES was going to be built in - no you have it wrong - DSG in the UK

So which option was the 'British' design again?

S_R
I only cut and paste this stuff,what do I know?
 
#8
Both bids had about 70% of the supply chain in the UK, most of it assembly and integration either at Newcastle or DSG/ABRO. The main castings and heavy stuff would be made in the original factories. As SR says, both the CV90 and ASCOD2 are foreign designed and built, I wonder if they have resolved the intellectual property issues that scuppered the last General Dynamics attempt at FRES

This is just another page in the sorry tale of FRES, spanning all the way back to the late eighties with FFLAV, TRACER and MRAV

FRES makes Nimrod AEW look like a sane and well run project
 
#9
AndyPipkin said:
Anyone wondering how it is that BAE continually get MoD contracts despite almost constantly delivering second rate products years late and massively over budget need look no further than this article. BAE suddenly remembers it has a factory in Tyneside only when it looks about to lose the competition on its merits.

I wouldn't mind, but just about every penny BAE has gouged from the UK taxpayer in the last decade or so has been spent buying up second and third tier US defence manufacturers in a desperate effort to shed whatever vestiges of Britishness BAE still has and become a US 'prime'. It only wants to be British when it thinks it can gouge yet more money out of the MoD.

Agree with you on that mate, they have been stringing us along for years BAE is no more british than landrover/jaguar, they dont give a toss about their workforce, only the bottom line. Having said that no-one wants to be given kit that your life might depend on that has come from the lowest bidder, and not the best bidder.Interesting to see when lord M. decides to put his head above the parapet. Had some dealings over the last few years with the tech authorship side of this project a real can of worms(and possible lawsuits) with regards to intellectual property rights, we shall see.
 
#10
when the powers to be found out that gordon foxley had been taking back handers, and he was sent to prison for his crime, ro at chorley wasnt re opened....... most of are land vehicles are now american design..... money is the main drive. vickers, i hope will survive..
 
#11
And how many of BAe's total workforce are actually in the UK? Why aren't they in the UK?

I mean, they did drop the word British from their name for a reason, you know!

BAe's politiking may work well with the ignorant masses and the politicians, but...
 
#13
#14
BAE have continuously threatened to close the Newcastle site for a number of years. This kind of lobbying has come to an end. In an economic climate such as this, its about delivery of programmes on time, at a reasonable cost and getting the kit to the sharp end.

If GD can satisfy these demands, there is little doubt that they should rightly be awarded the contract. BAE have proved time and again that they cannot.
 
#15
la_singe said:
BAE have continuously threatened to close the Newcastle site for a number of years. This kind of lobbying has come to an end. In an economic climate such as this, its about delivery of programmes on time, at a reasonable cost and getting the kit to the sharp end.

If GD can satisfy these demands, there is little doubt that they should rightly be awarded the contract. BAE have proved time and again that they cannot.
Second that, every time a juicy contract comes up,they use the redundancy card, and our naff politicos fall for it, the guys at the sharp end get a heap of shite, served up cold, in no way knocking the people that work for BAE they are at the mercy of " investors"
 
#16
Very unfortunate about the site closure, however for those who are happy to relocate there should still be plenty of work available.

The Chassis and the chassis only for the FRES SV will be built in Europe, everything else (80% of the total build) will take place in the UK.

If anyone is directly affected by this drop me a PM, I might be able to assist.

:D
 
#17
GD have completely f*cked up Bowman, you think they are any better than BAE?

There should be no reason the best vehicle cannot be produced on Tyneside but whats one more nail in the coffin of British industry eh?

Its not as if we are going to have a country worth fighting for or even a country ar all in a few more years anyway.

Hard to imagine this is the same nation that produced The Spitfire and Lancaster Bombers... hell we would probably have contracted those out to the Germans if this lot had been in charge back then.
 
#18
Bazzinho1977 said:
Interesting.

So which is the best solution - the US version we look like we are buying, or the BAE version that protects jobs in Newcastle?

I personally would suggest that we should buy the "FRES" that offers the best protection for soldiers, not the best protection for jobs in Newcastle.

But maybe that is me being a bit too tactical and not thinking strategically.
Actually we could do both if we didnt have such a disgraceful and traitotous government.

Still, anything that costs the b*stards votes cant be all bad.
 
#19
Continue propping up a local monopoly or let someone else start up business in the country?
 
#20
InVinoVeritas said:
GD have completely f*cked up Bowman, you think they are any better than BAE?

There should be no reason the best vehicle cannot be produced on Tyneside but whats one more nail in the coffin of British industry eh?

Its not as if we are going to have a country worth fighting for or even a country ar all in a few more years anyway.

Hard to imagine this is the same nation that produced The Spitfire and Lancaster Bombers... hell we would probably have contracted those out to the Germans if this lot had been in charge back then.
Don't you think an entirely new system with enhanced growth capability (throughout the entire platform) will offer more opportunity in the UK than a rehash of the CV90?

As I said in my last post 80% of this vehicle will be produced in the UK and where the closure of this site is very sad it will open opportunity elsewhere.
 
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