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New UK Border force cant arrest drug or gun runners

#1
Another day another NuLiebour fcuk up

Officers from the new border force will not be able to arrest people caught with drugs or a gun, it has emerged.

Analysis of the legislation governing the force's powers shows that an officer can only detain a suspect for three hours and must then "arrange for a constable to attend as soon as is reasonably practicable".

The Conservatives said this could mean that someone found with drugs or a gun in a port who was not going through customs could not be arrested.
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Jacqui Smith, the Home Secretary, will unveil the 25,000-strong force on Thursday as part of the new UK Border Agency signalling a hardening approach to illegal immigration.

The agency was set up to protect Britain's 71 international and major regional airports, 10,500 miles of coastline and 27 major sea ports.
In full

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2008/04/01/nborder101.xml

is it just me or should every member of this 'Government' since 1997, be taken to an abattoir and be killed like rabid cattle.
 
#3
Surely a border force like this should have the same powers as a police force? Like the British Transport Police but specialising in the Border. I would even go so far as to request para-military status and a fully armed force such as the MoD Plod.
 
#4
If the force (can you use that word these days?) is going to be 25k in strength, where the fcuk is that money coming from? We are surely talking about many millions of pounds that are going to be spent doing a job that I thought Customs and Immigration did already.
 
#5
so your saying they have expanded the role of the PCSO's to include watching our borders. well it keeps them busy and stops them clogging up our streets i suppose

policing our borders with the equivalent of PCSO's is a cheap option that wont deal with the problems we have.
 
#6
chocolate_frog said:
Surely a border force like this should have the same powers as a police force? Like the British Transport Police but specialising in the Border. I would even go so far as to request para-military status and a fully armed force such as the MoD Plod.
I actually do not think a 'Border Patrol' type force is needed.

What is the mischief they are trying to target here? I am not sure. IIRC, this border force was aanounced in them midst of great media anxiety about immigration (most of which from the EU anyway). I think it is reasonable to surmise that this is a gimmick by the government to look as if it is doing something in the face of unremitting media pressure.

There is no reason for a border patrol type force because there is no mischief to be solved. This is an island for god's sake and the country is surrounded by people who have a right to enter the UK anyway. Therefore there isn't the problem of large numbers of people climbing fences etc to get over the border like other land-locked countries outside the EU.

With some report about immigration out today, I wonder what new gimmick the goverment will come up with...
 
#7
armchair_jihad said:
Another day another NuLiebour fcuk up

Officers from the new border force will not be able to arrest people caught with drugs or a gun, it has emerged.

Analysis of the legislation governing the force's powers shows that an officer can only detain a suspect for three hours and must then "arrange for a constable to attend as soon as is reasonably practicable".

The Conservatives said this could mean that someone found with drugs or a gun in a port who was not going through customs could not be arrested.
advertisement

Jacqui Smith, the Home Secretary, will unveil the 25,000-strong force on Thursday as part of the new UK Border Agency signalling a hardening approach to illegal immigration.

The agency was set up to protect Britain's 71 international and major regional airports, 10,500 miles of coastline and 27 major sea ports.
In full

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2008/04/01/nborder101.xml

is it just me or should every member of this 'Government' since 1997, be taken to an abattoir and be killed like rabid cattle.
this is Tory mischief-making - the Border people would get a police officer to do the arrest - they are obviously NOT going to be geared up for the many many hours of extra paperwork which would follow. I wish journos/politicians would think before slagging of people doing their best in difficuly conditions. :roll:
 
#8
We have an EU border security organisation called Frontex, they have been operational (or not) since 2005.
Their brief is to help member states coordinate their efforts to stop the floppys from entering the EU, however, they have so far been largely ineffectual.
Still, as a means to waste more money, they are currently inviting tenders for an audit of just how ineffective they have been.


Call for Tender: External Evaluation of Frontex

10-03-2008
Call for tenders for Frontex external evaluation study has just been launched. Interested parties are welcomed to request tender documentation and submit their offers by 16 April 2008.

The objective of the contract is to deliver an independent external evaluation study for the Management Board of Frontex. It will enable the Management Board to asses the implementation of the Council Regulation (EC) 2007/2004 by evaluating the working procedures, the effectiveness and the impact of the Agency. The assessment shall be done by taking into consideration the views of stakeholders, both on the European and on national levels.

This study will be composed of three phases: familiarisation, investigation and final report drafting. It will evaluate the organizational solutions and procedures carried out to achieve the objectives of the Agency. It will measure the effectiveness in achieving the agreed objectives. Last but not least it will assess the consequence of actions on the improvement of the integrated management of the external borders of the EU.

This evaluation study will allow for the identification of areas for improvement, and will provide the Management Board of Frontex with the necessary input to deliver recommendations to the European Commission.
www.frontex.europa.eu
 
#9
762baynet said:
If the force (can you use that word these days?) is going to be 25k in strength, where the fcuk is that money coming from? We are surely talking about many millions of pounds that are going to be spent doing a job that I thought Customs and Immigration did already.
Not when talking about the Police....it then becomes a 'Service'. :roll:
 
#10
IIRC the Army in NI had to arrange for the PSNI / RUC to pick up detained persons as well. How is this any different?

T C
 
#11
Would it really be so hard to train a proper "Border Police Force" There are so many simple example models outside of normal county forces.

British Nuclear Plod
British Transport Plod
Mod Plod

In Scouse Land we have 'The Port of Liverpool Police' and i'm sure other places have similar affairs.

This is just more Pointless Labour drivel in order to dodge the Prison crisis!

I also agree that any Border force should be an almost Para military affair. Armed to the teeth with weapons and patrol boats.

In an ideal world these people would be backed up by tough legislation and 'Rules of engagement' for punishing drug runners/human trafficing/illegal activity in British Waters/shores/Airfields.

I make my self laugh! :roll:
 
#12
Well instead of spending more money on creating a new force to do this, why not expand current agencies that already have the required knowledge?

Why can we not expand the MOD Plod and MPGS to do the patrolling and the RN to do the boat type stuff. They already have the existing infrastructure so it would be just a case of building up the equipment and troop numbers.

T C
 
#13
It is window dressing/spin by this governement. Basically it is HM Immigration Service, elements of Customs and special branch. They have just 'spun' it into a completely new organisation, giving the impression that there are 25k more border officers being produced, when in fact, they are already there.
 
#14
Highflight said:
It is window dressing/spin by this governement. Basically it is HM Immigration Service, elements of Customs and special branch. They have just 'spun' it into a completely new organisation, giving the impression that there are 25k more border officers being produced, when in fact, they are already there.

Spin! Spin you say! I am shocked to discover this .................. :roll:

liabour :x
 
#15
Closet_Jibber Don't forget are mighty Tunnel police! Cones were in danger of being nicked from the tunnel until this elite force of obese ex bus inspectors stepped up to the mark!
Equipped with everything the Police force have they are truly a waste of time money and skin!
 
#16
Many seem to be missing the point. This is NOT a 'new' force. It is an existing force, amalgamating customs, immigration (UKBIA) and UK visa's.

The idea of a 'unified' border force, and the second 're-branding' of the (old) UK Immigration Service is happening around me (literally). There are many legal complexeties, as we have 'exported' our borders abroad (Northern France etc.) regards 'arresting' offenders. No one knows what the future holds, other than expected decreases in budget with an ever increasing workload for existing staff.

One needs to remember that (for 'immigration') a two month training course followed by six month on the job training (and for customs an equivalent) that it will take years, literally before we will have a fully'unified' force. Customs law and immigration law inparticular is extreemly complex, and the initial 'hope' that we could learn each others skills and experiences quickly, thus enabling us to become fully 'unified' was quicky realised an impossibilty.

In essence, there are huge shake ups, and a 'unification' in name, soon to be (?) in uniformity, but the working practices will take a decade to fall in line.

I (personaly) believe a 'uniformed' border police, with individual specialist agencies, sharing information and working closely alongside each other is the way forward (Like the French PAF and Duoune).

Only time will tell wether this will be achieved. My thoughts on its success will remain just that, mine. :roll:
 
#17
DarkNinja said:
Closet_Jibber Don't forget are mighty Tunnel police! Cones were in danger of being nicked from the tunnel until this elite force of obese ex bus inspectors stepped up to the mark!
Equipped with everything the Police force have they are truly a waste of time money and skin!
Yeah I purposely left them out as I was trying to be positive.

Come on think positive thoughts.

Paint pretty Pictures!
 
#18
I thought we had a border protection force in Britain, tasked with keeping undesirable elements etc in check, it is called HM Customs. Still this new lot seems to be PCSO's (spin: dead cheap) to the HMC
 
#19
theslayerofmen said:
Many seem to be missing the point. This is NOT a 'new' force. It is an existing force, amalgamating customs, immigration (UKBIA) and UK visa's.

The idea of a 'unified' border force, and the second 're-branding' of the (old) UK Immigration Service is happening around me (literally). There are many legal complexeties, as we have 'exported' our borders abroad (Northern France etc.) regards 'arresting' offenders. No one knows what the future holds, other than expected decreases in budget with an ever increasing workload for existing staff.

One needs to remember that (for 'immigration') a two month training course followed by six month on the job training (and for customs an equivalent) that it will take years, literally before we will have a fully'unified' force. Customs law and immigration law inparticular is extreemly complex, and the initial 'hope' that we could learn each others skills and experiences quickly, thus enabling us to become fully 'unified' was quicky realised an impossibilty.

In essence, there are huge shake ups, and a 'unification' in name, soon to be (?) in uniformity, but the working practices will take a decade to fall in line.

I (personaly) believe a 'uniformed' border police, with individual specialist agencies, sharing information and working closely alongside each other is the way forward (Like the French PAF and Duoune).

Only time will tell wether this will be achieved. My thoughts on its success will remain just that, mine. :roll:
Totally agree with you. A 'beefed up', truly National Ports Special Branch as a
backup and intelligence provider would enhance a uniformed border agency.
 
#20
As I asked above, wtf would you need a border police? The UK is surrounded by countries the citizens of which have a right to enter.

If this is about immigration, then one should point to that elephant in the room that no one dares to mention - the EU. Otherwise, perhaps one should accept that things are the way they are and not try to implement money wasting projects that are to no purpose.

This is a daft idea that has no merit whatsoever, save for PR purposes.
 
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