New ruling - 24 hr patrols on weekend training

2/51

LE
Right chaps, there seems to be a new ruling that if cadets are away on a training weekend there must be someone awake through the night who must do patrols and check accommodation periodically during the hours of darkness.

Up until now there has been a duty Male and Female CFAV in the duty bunks who could be called upon during the night if need be.

Any thoughts on this?? How do you handle this, especially if you have limited numbers of adults in the first place?
 

chrisg46

LE
Book Reviewer
How many CFAV's would you have? Same principle as having a stag overnight - everyone does an hour or so each.
 

2/51

LE
Once you take out duty drivers etc, not enough!!

In reality, we would require 2 adults, one male, one female, and currently, it looks like everyone would have to do 2 stints.

Having spoken to several folk in the ATC and CCF, it appears this is an ACF thing only, or that the other organisations are ignoring the order???
 

Bris

LE
It makes sense to me as part of duty of care towards the children.

A lot can happen when te kids are left unattended for c. 8 hours overnight, even with an adult sleeping next door.
 

offog

LE
It makes sense to me as part of duty of care towards the children.

A lot can happen when te kids are left unattended for c. 8 hours overnight, even with an adult sleeping next door.
Ever been on a school trip?

Same thing different place. This is probably someone misinterpreting the rules/instructions.
 
I imagine that realistically you would be checking the exterior of the accommodation, so apart from doubling up on something the MGS are already doing, what would this gain? Unless the plan is to enter the billets and wake the kids every hour or so?
 
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Dredd

LE
Having spoken to several folk in the ATC and CCF, it appears this is an ACF thing only, or that the other organisations are ignoring the order???
Not strictly true - where Sea Cadets are providing overnight accommodation, unless the premises has an automated alarm system then there is a requirement for a fire watch to be held overnight by an adult. They wouldn't need to be uniformed (AFAIK) but it did mean that the individual would be unavailable for duties the following day. One creative response to that would be to use the duty driver for the home run and make sure they get adequate rest during the day so they are ready for the trip back.

Having considered it a bit further, then the idea of having it as stagging on makes sense. Everyone does their turn and after all, it is only for the weekend.
 

Dredd

LE
I imagine that realistically you would be checking the exterior of the accommodation, so apart from doubling up on something the MGS are already doing, what would this gain? Unless the plan is to enter the billets and wake the kids every hour or so?
You are assuming this takes place on an active base. Here in the North of Scotland, the bases are very much part-time and in the case of our County, training is often on the CTC which is solely ACF.


Edited: OPSEC
 
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Dredd

LE
Amendment to ACF Regulations..." a requirement to have individual(s) awake during silent hours for monitoring cadet activity and Fire duties"
That would tally with the changes to the Sea Cadets Regs a few years back then.
 
Amendment to ACF Regulations..." a requirement to have individual(s) awake during silent hours for monitoring cadet activity and Fire duties"
I've not seen it, but I'm guessing this doesn't apply if the accommodation is inside manned barracks with a full time guard?
 

2/51

LE
Sorry chaps...better make it clear...I pose the question as I am interested to see if others have implemented the change and if so, how did they approach the issue. Not questioning the rights and wrongs of it or the hierarchy. :)
 
Sorry chaps...better make it clear...I pose the question as I am interested to see if others have implemented the change and if so, how did they approach the issue. Not questioning the rights and wrongs of it or the hierarchy. :)
It's not something that has been promulgated where I am (yet) although as has been said, It makes sense where there is no permanent guard and as long as it's implemented intelligently. i.e. sufficient rest for staff supervising/undertaking safety critical activities the following day.
 
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2/51

LE
That would tally with the changes to the Sea Cadets Regs a few years back then.
I am used to having "Fire Pickets" at unmanned barracks, but I am talking regular and reserve soldiers with access to fags and booze billeted in accommodation that was pre war and made of wood...but they could not be trusted ;)
 
Things have gone downhill since CDT SGT Flaggie (age 16) was i/c fire picket at St Martin's Plain camp, with half a dozen even younger cadets under his "command." Even had a real fire to deal with, when overhead cables came down on the roof of a hut. Narrowly stopped my enthusiastic mob extinguishing it with the hose reel they'd just run out and connected.

In no way helps the OP solve his dilemma, but does highlight how successfully we all survived decades ago with far less stringent regulation.
 
I would suggest implementing that rule immediately, not only for fire watch which should have been always in place ("how did all those cadets burn to death?" "Well m'lud, we were all pissed and unconscious after spending all night getting shiters telling lies about non existent military careers", and it helps prevent vulnerable cadets from getting Savilled unless of course that's the idea!
 

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