Negative Russian behavior

What is a role of Russia in the international affairs?

  • Absolutely negative

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Mainly negative

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Rather negative

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Mixed

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Rather stabilising

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • On many points positive

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Highly positive

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0
#1
Recently US States Department issued 'Strategic Plan'

http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/82819.pdf

relations with russia: We pursue our third priority under increasingly difficult circumstances. We aim to work with
Russia on issues of common interest...
...
We will engage with Russia
where we can do so productively, while continuing to
stand firm—with the support of our European and other
allies—for the values of democracy, human rights, and
freedom and push back on negative Russian behavior.
 
#2
I'll translate:

"... negative Russian behaviour ..."
means
"... Russia refuses to bend over and accept whatever we tell them to ..."

In some regards I welcome the resurgence of Russia (and the emergence of China) as counterweights to the frankly barking foreign policy the US indulges in these days. It is becoming increasingly difficult to see having the US as an ally as an asset these days. I wish it were not so.
 
#3
One_of_the_strange said:
I'll translate:

"... negative Russian behaviour ..."
means
"... Russia refuses to bend over and accept whatever we tell them to ..."

In some regards I welcome the resurgence of Russia (and the emergence of China) as counterweights to the frankly barking foreign policy the US indulges in these days. It is becoming increasingly difficult to see having the US as an ally as an asset these days. I wish it were not so.
Have you ever in fact lived in the fluffy bunny liberal democracies of either Russia or China.....?
 

Biped

LE
Book Reviewer
#4
One_of_the_strange said:
I'll translate:

"... negative Russian behaviour ..."
means
"... Russia refuses to bend over and accept whatever we tell them to ..."

In some regards I welcome the resurgence of Russia (and the emergence of China) as counterweights to the frankly barking foreign policy the US indulges in these days. It is becoming increasingly difficult to see having the US as an ally as an asset these days. I wish it were not so.
Well one thing is for sure. You don't want to say bad things about resurgent Russia. It is exercising it's newfound wealth and freedoms very effectively. Cup of irradiated tea with bullet biscuits anyone?
 
#5
4(T) said:
One_of_the_strange said:
I'll translate:

"... negative Russian behaviour ..."
means
"... Russia refuses to bend over and accept whatever we tell them to ..."

In some regards I welcome the resurgence of Russia (and the emergence of China) as counterweights to the frankly barking foreign policy the US indulges in these days. It is becoming increasingly difficult to see having the US as an ally as an asset these days. I wish it were not so.
Have you ever in fact lived in the fluffy bunny liberal democracies of either Russia or China.....?
I was born in the Soviet union and live in Russia. There are some benefits: vodka and beer are much cheepier than in the UK. Russian women (at least some of them) are not ugly-looking. In Moscow's shops and supermarkets you can buy literally anything. There is one really very serious problem though - huge number of cars on the streets.

As for politicians then you have Blair-Brown-Prescott-Browne-and so on. We have Putin & facelees, stupid, corrupted idiots at power. It is possible that your politicians are much better than Putin's gang but unlikely. All politicians are the same.
 
#6
KGB_resident said:
4(T) said:
One_of_the_strange said:
I'll translate:

"... negative Russian behaviour ..."
means
"... Russia refuses to bend over and accept whatever we tell them to ..."

In some regards I welcome the resurgence of Russia (and the emergence of China) as counterweights to the frankly barking foreign policy the US indulges in these days. It is becoming increasingly difficult to see having the US as an ally as an asset these days. I wish it were not so.
Have you ever in fact lived in the fluffy bunny liberal democracies of either Russia or China.....?
I was born in the Soviet union and live in Russia. There are some benefits: vodka and beer are much cheepier than in the UK. Russian women (at least some of them) are not ugly-looking. In Moscow's shops and supermarkets you can buy literally anything. There is one really very serious problem though - huge number of cars on the streets.

As for politicians then you have Blair-Brown-Prescott-Browne-and so on. We have Putin & facelees, stupid, corrupted idiots at power. It is possible that your politicians are much better than Putin's gang but unlikely. All politicians are the same.
Jesus. Should this not be in the NAAFI bar?
Russian women not ugly??????
You can buy "almost" anything? What like a nuke? or as above some eradiated coffee? Or do you mean normal things like bread and milk are freely available now?
 
#7
EX_REME said:
KGB_resident said:
4(T) said:
One_of_the_strange said:
I'll translate:

"... negative Russian behaviour ..."
means
"... Russia refuses to bend over and accept whatever we tell them to ..."

In some regards I welcome the resurgence of Russia (and the emergence of China) as counterweights to the frankly barking foreign policy the US indulges in these days. It is becoming increasingly difficult to see having the US as an ally as an asset these days. I wish it were not so.
Have you ever in fact lived in the fluffy bunny liberal democracies of either Russia or China.....?
I was born in the Soviet union and live in Russia. There are some benefits: vodka and beer are much cheepier than in the UK. Russian women (at least some of them) are not ugly-looking. In Moscow's shops and supermarkets you can buy literally anything. There is one really very serious problem though - huge number of cars on the streets.

As for politicians then you have Blair-Brown-Prescott-Browne-and so on. We have Putin & facelees, stupid, corrupted idiots at power. It is possible that your politicians are much better than Putin's gang but unlikely. All politicians are the same.
Jesus. Should this not be in the NAAFI bar?
Russian women not ugly??????
You can buy "almost" anything? What like a nuke? or as above some eradiated coffee? Or do you mean normal things like bread and milk are freely available now?
Freely? Not at all. Try to find a place for parking of your car first. And your wife will no doubt spend hours in so called butiks. As a result family budget would be damaged heavily. At last you won't have any ability to reach shelves with bread and milk.
 
#8
4(T) said:
One_of_the_strange said:
I'll translate:

"... negative Russian behaviour ..."
means
"... Russia refuses to bend over and accept whatever we tell them to ..."

In some regards I welcome the resurgence of Russia (and the emergence of China) as counterweights to the frankly barking foreign policy the US indulges in these days. It is becoming increasingly difficult to see having the US as an ally as an asset these days. I wish it were not so.
Have you ever in fact lived in the fluffy bunny liberal democracies of either Russia or China.....?
I have (PRC) and I'd agree with OOTS' point. Those countries are far from perfect, but their existence as world powers does act as a reality check on the worst excesses of US policy making and vice versa. Having them around is certainly better in my opinion than not.
How can this be a bad thing?
 
#9
I'd say the effect is mixed... like all nations, Russia has it's own priorities but it is mostly in it's interest to promote stability. Some might claim Putin wants to be a tzar but the truth is that he needed to aggressively counter the unscrupulous indutrialists who were driving that nation towards becoming an oligarchy. Commerce and industry are key to economic stability but when such is conducted without regard to laws... it's a scary situation.

KGB_resident is quite accurate with the statement that all politicians are the same of course...
 
#10
US foreign policy (or anyone else's for that matter) has nothing to do with the moral high ground going on and on about "those dreadful Russians" is hypocritical in the extreme, given that the US and ourselves do business daily with far more unsavoury and unpleasant characters.

Does Russia have laws forbidding women from driving ? No, the Saudis do and they're best friends because they've got oil.

Does Russia allow female circumcision among parts of their society ? No, the Kurds do and they're our friends as they kill Sunnis on behalf of the US.

Do the Russians starve their own people and threaten their neighbours with nukes ? No, the North Korean regime does and it is quite safe as the US will not spend blood and treasure to free them.

Do ... but you get the point.

The bottom line is, is it better or worse for UK interests to have the US counterbalanced ? I believe it is.
 
#11
OOTS, are you really a communist?
 
#12
EX_REME said:
OOTS, are you really a communist?
Good lord no, the avatar dates me as one of those who used to learn all about the Red Army ... so we could kill them. Think of it as the online equivalent of the trophies in the mess. Well, mine at any rate.

As for politics, I'd say conservative (small c) realist/cynic. Or grumpy old man if you listen to my wife.
 

OldSnowy

LE
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#13
One_of_the_strange said:
Do the Russians starve their own people and threaten their neighbours with nukes ? No, the North Korean regime does and it is quite safe as the US will not spend blood and treasure to free them.

The bottom line is, is it better or worse for UK interests to have the US counterbalanced? I believe it is.
Sorry, but this is just nonsense. To blame the US for N Korea, when one of their main supporters has always been the Russians seems perverse at best, and deliberately provocative at worse. If you haven't noticed, the US is trying to stop the NKs getting nukes, and we are supporting them in this. As to whether the Russians threaten their neighbours with nukes - they certainly do - that's why so many East Europeans - who were brutally enslaved by the Russians not so long ago - are so keen on getting Missile Defence there. As to Russians starving their own people - well, they started doing this as Policy under Lenin, and carried on for many decades since then. Finally, ask the people of Georgia if they feel threatened by Russia!

Is it best to have someone 'balance' the US? Possibly, but on many grounds it is probably not. Say what you will, the US is a Democracy, and Democracies do tend to be relatively rational in their behaviour, as opposed to the behaviour of de-facto dictatorships such as Russia, Libya, Sudan, Saudi Arabia, etc., which can change from one day to the next.
 
#14
One_of_the_strange said:
EX_REME said:
OOTS, are you really a communist?
Good lord no, the avatar dates me as one of those who used to learn all about the Red Army ... so we could kill them. Think of it as the online equivalent of the trophies in the mess. Well, mine at any rate.

As for politics, I'd say conservative (small c) realist/cynic. Or grumpy old man if you listen to my wife.
Oh, ok then. I was just wondering why anyone would subscribe to this philosophy and thought maybe you could enlighten me...
 
#15
One_of_the_strange said:
...

In some regards I welcome the resurgence of Russia (and the emergence of China) as counterweights to the frankly barking foreign policy the US indulges in these days. It is becoming increasingly difficult to see having the US as an ally as an asset these days. I wish it were not so.
God help us, I hope not, but you may rue those words someday.
 
#16
One_of_the_strange said:
US foreign policy (or anyone else's for that matter) has nothing to do with the moral high ground going on and on about "those dreadful Russians" is hypocritical in the extreme, given that the US and ourselves do business daily with far more unsavoury and unpleasant characters.

Does Russia have laws forbidding women from driving ? No, the Saudis do and they're best friends because they've got oil.
Because the Saudis aren't exactly a liberal democracy you want to disrupt a long-time alliance by playing some 'great game' with a country which is slowly drifting towards Pinochet on the Volga?

Does Russia allow female circumcision among parts of their society ? No, the Kurds do and they're our friends as they kill Sunnis on behalf of the US.
It's an ignorant practice that Kurdish authorities have tried to stamp out. I've been to the Northern Kurd section of Iraq, they've tried like hell to establish a real elected parliament and a stable infrastructure and have done well considering.

Do the Russians starve their own people and threaten their neighbours with nukes ? No, the North Korean regime does and it is quite safe as the US will not spend blood and treasure to free them.
Ask the Ukrainians or the Baltic countries how they've being 'pressed' by the Russians.

How you blame NK on the US is something I'll leave you to explain.

Hopefully you'll mull this over a bit more.
 
#17
Whether the US's position is balanced by Russia, China, or whoever is largley irrelelavent, but the fact remains that the US's power needs, not neccersarily an opposing force, but one that will prevent the US from doing whatever it wants. That force is not going to be lil' old Britain or another country that has a 'special relationship' with them (not while GWB is at the wheel anyway).
 
#18
OldSnowy said:
One_of_the_strange said:
Do the Russians starve their own people and threaten their neighbours with nukes ? No, the North Korean regime does and it is quite safe as the US will not spend blood and treasure to free them.

The bottom line is, is it better or worse for UK interests to have the US counterbalanced? I believe it is.
Sorry, but this is just nonsense. To blame the US for N Korea, when one of their main supporters has always been the Russians seems perverse at best, and deliberately provocative at worse.
There is a difference between Soviet union and Russia. Russia is a newborn capitalist country with some sort of 'democracy'. Russia has own interests and any form of support of any country (including N.Korea) is caused by own interests.

OldSnowy said:
If you haven't noticed, the US is trying to stop the NKs getting nukes, and we are supporting them in this.
Rather by its aggressive policy USA stimulates development of nuclear weapons in many countries.

OldSnowy said:
As to whether the Russians threaten their neighbours with nukes - they certainly do - that's why so many East Europeans - who were brutally enslaved by the Russians not so long ago
Russian military action in Hungary happened in 1956. Exactly that time The UK and Co ... performed a ... peacekeeping operation in Egypt. While Soviet union 'brutally enslaved' the Hungarians the UK tried to bring ideas of democracy and human rights to Egypt without any selfish intentions.

OldSnowy said:
- are so keen on getting Missile Defence there.
Polls show that the peoples themselves are not eager to have any useless 'shields'. But according to the principles of true democracy the governments simply ignore opinions of their peoples.

OldSnowy said:
As to Russians starving their own people - well, they started doing this as Policy under Lenin, and carried on for many decades since then.
My father knows what this term 'starvation' means. He was a boy during WW2. But again, what is a connection with modern Russia?

OldSnowy said:
Finally, ask the people of Georgia if they feel threatened by Russia!
Really, ask them. Ask also the Irish, do they love the English. Georgia was a prosperous part of Soviet union. But now it is in arrsehole. Who is to blame? Of course the Russians.

OldSnowy said:
Is it best to have someone 'balance' the US? Possibly, but on many grounds it is probably not. Say what you will, the US is a Democracy, and Democracies do tend to be relatively rational in their behaviour,
Learned mr.Bush and rational style of thinking? First of all I would remove a word 'rational' (and also 'thinking' as well).

OldSnowy said:
as opposed to the behaviour of de-facto dictatorships such as Russia, Libya, Sudan, Saudi Arabia, etc., which can change from one day to the next.
Do you really believe that Russian society is much like ones in Libya, Sudan or Saudi Arabia?
 
#19
EX_REME said:
...
Jesus. Should this not be in the NAAFI bar?
Russian women not ugly??????
You can buy "almost" anything? What like a nuke? or as above some eradiated coffee? Or do you mean normal things like bread and milk are freely available now?
I can attest that there are well-stocked bakeries (and some very good ones) almost every few blocks in Moscow and St. Petersburg and. The Metro station kiosks do a land-office business with pastries and breads. Nowadays Russians will put up with a lot of things we wouldn't, but two things they won't put up with; a bad loaf of bread and bad soup. Never say any nukes at the kiosks though.

And no, Russian women are not ugly. Some of the best female specimens you'll ever encounter live in a wide swath from Kiev to Moscow to St. Petersburg. On the main street of St Pete's, Nevsky Prospect, you couldn't swing a dead cat without hitting a beautiful Russian woman upside the head.
 
#20
Have to say that the one visit I had to Russia was quite an enjoyable one... and that there were plenty of gorgeous gals in evidence. Sigh... to be single and carefree again. Naw... scrap that thought, I'm so used to my wife telling me what to do that I'd be no better than Mr. Magoo without her. :D
 

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