NBC training in CMSR TA - do we need so much?

#1
I'm well aware of the packed training programme required to fit in the CMS(R) into the limited number of weekends available - pretty major demands on the time of both recruits and instructors.

The idea, as I understand it, is to turn a recruit into someone able to go to eg. Catterick / complete their Special to Arm training.

Bearing in mind the current use of TA soldiers, is there any point in havinmg so much training time taken up in a subject that will not be used in OOTW, and even if soldiers are mobilised for warfighting then any pre-mobilisation NBC training is ignored and lessons start from the beginning?

BB
 
#2
Bravo Bravo, thanks to the benefits of multi culturism, you are as likely to come across WMD on a High Street near you than you are overseas. The army may need you to clear up the contaminated corpses of your fellow citizens...

Has that cleared up why you need to be NBC trained?
 
#4
We dont know what the next war will be .You can build a chemical weapon quite easily .Just cos the iraqes turned out to be a fantasy
apart from a few left over mustard gas shells dosent mean the next guy wont have them .
 
#5
woody said:
You can build a chemical weapon quite easily.
Go on then! No seriously, it's not really as easy as it looks - well to make anything particularly nasty. The Iraqi's had been trying for years, apparently, and aside from the Kurds they didn't get very far. Production, storage and delivery are all fairly tricky business.

Anyway, we need some NBC, of course - you never know when you'll need it, but perhaps not so much.. Then again it didn't seem like we did loads when I joined and that was at the begining of Telic.
 
#6
You have to be prepared for all eventualities if the TA is ill prepared for a possible NBC situation whats the point of the TA being deployed. Chemical weapons are easily constructed, they can be made in simple chemistry lab or kitchen so you must be prepared. Its like saying why do the Para still exist despite the fact that they haven't done a combat drop since Suez, it because the next war we may need that specific ability.
 
G

Goku

Guest
#9
It’s even easier to make a dirty bomb than a chemical weapon, all you need is an x-ray machine and a lump of C4 and bobs your mothers brother.

You can’t have enough NBC training with AQ minching about the streets of London, and North Korea and Iran sabre rattling.

Bloody silly of them to put the Q&A in the NBC MATT pdf though :wink:
 
#10
TA_sig said:
woody said:
You can build a chemical weapon quite easily.
Go on then! No seriously, it's not really as easy as it looks - well to make anything particularly nasty. The Iraqi's had been trying for years, apparently, and aside from the Kurds they didn't get very far. Production, storage and delivery are all fairly tricky business.

Anyway, we need some NBC, of course - you never know when you'll need it, but perhaps not so much.. Then again it didn't seem like we did loads when I joined and that was at the begining of Telic.

You're joking right?

Chemical Ali didn't get his name from gassing Kurds, y'know.

The Iranians reached the Shaat al-Arab during the Iran-Iraq war, and the only thing that stopped them was bucket loads of 'G' nerve agent. Up to the end of the UNSCOM inspections in '98 Iraq admitted producing 2,850 tonnes of mustard and 1000 tonnes of 'G' nerve. Of these quantities UNSCOM managed to account for and destroy only 600 and 100 tonnes respectively.

Production and storage are pretty easy, as long as you have a basic agricultural industry. Delivery is a bit more tricky (especially if you want a good battlefield weapon), but not impossible given the number of countries willing to sell their stockpiles of empty chemical shells. Asymmetric delivery is much easier, though - just ask all those Nips on the Tokoyo underground who looked like they were doing the saturday night dance after a bucket-load of coffee...
 
#11
Well pointed out Gassing_Badgers (you're not, are you?)

BB, could you honestly say you feel you could survive in a chemical environment as you are?

I dont think us Regs do enough.
 

chrisg46

LE
Book Reviewer
#12
thing is, if you ever need to use NBC your gonna have to use pretty damn quick. The more time and practice is put into it means more likely you can do the correct drills while being scared out of your mind. I dont know what the correct term is, but i call it muscle memory, when your body does everything correctly without having to think about it. Therefore, the sooner you start practicing, the better it will be on the day.

Plus CCRF maybe a farce, but one scenario envisaged for that is an NBC type incident. In that event, the CCRF will not have time to conduct major revision and training, it will be a case of GAS GAS GAS and get on with it...
 
#13
IMO there is far too little NBC training both in the Regs and TA, too often it is just given lip service to get that tick in the box. Just to clear a couple of points it is very simple (with the right equipment and skills) to produce chemical agents, the part that can be tricky is delivering the agent as was seen in Tokyo (if they'd known what they were doing there would have been many more fatalities.
You cannot build a dirty bomb out of an x-ray machine (Power off = no radiation) you'd be better off beating 'em to death with the lead screening. :lol:
 
#14
NBC - need so much? My recruits came back from their CMSR two months ago from Bassingbourn with almost no knowledge of NBC. They spent most of their time doing weapons - fair enough. Post CMSR training done in house has been mainly NBC and First Aid as they just touched on it. Which course do your lot go to?
 
#15
Having experienced my first full NBC Battle run on my last annual camp - Im pretty sure I would have been in deep thomas tit were it the real thing, just wasnt prepared for how badly the kit degrades you - never got my breath back during the run, didnt realsie how bad my field of vision was, how long it would take to get even a poor sight picture. My efforts at decontamination were well short of the mark about the only thing I did well enough was masking up - Oh yes - I practised that on my CMSR!
I think given that post CMSR NBC training depends so much on individual units perhaps more should be done in CMSR. :?:
 
#16
Don't forget that there are more ways to develop a chemical threat than using it as a weapon*. A major incident at a chemical plant could lead to a mass casualty incident and potentially the deployment of regular troops or the CCRF. At that point I'd like to know my mask fits, where the non training canisters are and how to operate in the threat environment.



* I know there's an acronym for non weapon chemical hazards but I can't remember it.
 
#17
B-S I think you may mean TIMs toxic industrial materials.

There is indeed a threat from terrorist use of material that can be found in many civilian chemical plants, often this material is much more dangerous, in the long term, than CWAs (think carcinogenic)

I am in the position of knowing my mask fits very well indeed, using it as I do at work, cant stand masks with the filters at the front just gets in the way. :lol:
 
#18
CBRN weapon is exactly that, a weapon just like any other, the difference being you can defend yourself against it if you have the kit and you are trained. You get hit by a bomb or a bullet it's going to hurt even with issued protection, CBRN on the other hand is the easiest weapon of all to survive. (Thermonukes notwithstanding)

These clown who are waging their jihad on us, see it as a "religious duty to aquire these weapons" to slightly misqoute infamous cnut and coward Bin Ladin. Do you really wanna make it easier for the b*stards by not being properly trained to deal with whatever they choose to throw at us? I don't know about you, I want to live so I can have sex, get drunk, watch footy and my firm favorite, despatching them to the paradise they so desire!
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
5 Army Reserve 11
J Army Reserve 25
E The Intelligence Cell 6

Similar threads

Latest Threads

Top