National Service

#1
A couple of days ago I saw an interview with Sir Michael Caine during which he mentioned his National Service spent in BAOR and Korea. When asked, he replied that he would like to see the return of National Service to help combat youth violence and reiterating his comment: "I'm just saying, put them in the Army for six months. You're there to learn how to defend your country. You belong to the country. Then when you come out, you have a sense of belonging rather than a sense of violence."
This was followed by a few (probably well chosen) comments from some of Britain's youths, the cream of which was, "I'd rarver do me own fing, innit?"
What are the panel's thoughts?
 
#3
Providing there was a clear demarcation between Her Majesties' 'Proffessionals', and Her Majesties' 'Doing there bit' why not.

Plenty to do around the UK and lots of good character building stuff. Before you know it, we'd have a nice country.

Same as Holland ensure there is facilties for those who would 'rather do my own fing, innit' ie prison for double the service time :D

A rite of passage you could be proud of, instead of your first ASBO, glassing or happy slap on youtube.
 

Auld-Yin

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#4
National Service now would be a disaster for the Army, Navy & Air Farce. IMHO. Those that want to join are lining up at the recruiting offices and being turned away right now. Those what don't want to join and just "do their 'fing" would be nothing other than an admin nightmare, all of whom would "Know their rights, innit?"

Let's keep the Forces professional.

The pollies are spending enough time fecking up the forces with the SDSR without throwing this little chestnut in the firw.
 
#5
Bring back National Service but the NS men/women would be organised into public service Battalions and used for road building etc etc. No exceptions allowed for any reason.
 
#6
Sir Michael Caine came from an era where being a chopsy little twat saying he didnt want to do something involved some large NCO panelling him all over billet and then the chopsy little twat would get charged for damaging the NCOs knuckles, it wouldnt happen today.

As Sir Michael Caine served in BAOR did he say he deserved an NDM?
 
#7
Sir Michael Caine came from an era where being a chopsy little twat saying he didnt want to do something involved some large NCO panelling him all over billet and then the chopsy little twat would get charged for damaging the NCOs knuckles, it wouldnt happen today.

As Sir Michael Caine served in BAOR did he say he deserved an NDM?
NDM for Germany? Perhaps not, But for Korea, I cant see why not
 
K

Kirkz

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#8
I think some form of national service should be brought back, to give the low life scum infecting this once great nation some discipline and self worth!
Having a National Service where you could sign up to the Police force, Fire service, Ambulance service, Coast Guard or the Armed Forces if that's what you want to do might be a more realistic proposition :)
 
#9
It wouldnt work for the Police or Ambulance service, both jobs require a very specific type of person to do it, Would you want some of the Scum working anywhere near a PNC computer etc...? They would be looking up there targets for when they arent on NS. With the Army it took them out of circulation at the age where they where causing issues.

The same goes for the Ambulance service, would you want some of the Scum out and about on the streets today responsible for saving your life?

The firebrigade would be a good option, we could instill into todays youth what it means to strike for more money
 
#10
Bring back National Service but the NS men/women would be organised into public service Battalions and used for road building etc etc. No exceptions allowed for any reason.
This is something I fully agree with, 2 years service in a PSB as soon as you leave school and prior to College or Uni. The only exemption being joining HM Forces.
 

jim24

LE
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#11
It wouldnt work for the Police or Ambulance service, both jobs require a very specific type of person to do it, Would you want some of the Scum working anywhere near a PNC computer etc...? They would be looking up there targets for when they arent on NS. With the Army it took them out of circulation at the age where they where causing issues.

The same goes for the Ambulance service, would you want some of the Scum out and about on the streets today responsible for saving your life?

The firebrigade would be a good option, we could instill into todays youth what it means to strike for more money
Funny you should say that because it worked very well during WW2
 
#12
I believe NS ended 1960ish? and funnily enough virtually all the social problems of today can be traced back to the generation that was reaching its late teens in the mid 60's, coincidence possibly.

I blame my parents.
 
K

Kirkz

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#13
It wouldnt work for the Police or Ambulance service, both jobs require a very specific type of person to do it, Would you want some of the Scum working anywhere near a PNC computer etc...? They would be looking up there targets for when they arent on NS. With the Army it took them out of circulation at the age where they where causing issues.

The same goes for the Ambulance service, would you want some of the Scum out and about on the streets today responsible for saving your life?

The firebrigade would be a good option, we could instill into todays youth what it means to strike for more money
I can see your point there JC! But surely they could for the police or ambulance service as cleaners,or in an admin role? Only the more exceptional ones after training would be allowed to actually join the elite ranks :)
 
#14
The police and the ambulance service is a different entity to what it was in WW2, as are the people who will be required to do national service
 
#15
Conscription into the Armed Forces, Police etc is not a good idea. It may have worked once but those days are long gone. Some form of obligatory 'public service' (and this as all just a play on words) might be seen as workable however there would be problems as to who would pay them? Would it just be an alternative to the dole? Would the unions agree to school leavers taking their members' jobs? And at the end of the day would it be beneficial?

It is worth remembering that during WW2 young women were conscripted to work in the factories and on the land... Some young men were called up and sent to work in the coal mines rather than the forces. But that was a national need in wartime, today's needs are different.

So in summary... No

However Voluntary Service Overseas is still avaliable to those who genuinely want to be useful.
 
#16
Bring back National Service but the NS men/women would be organised into public service Battalions and used for road building etc etc. No exceptions allowed for any reason.
Excellent, fully agree. You stand on this platform and you'll get my vote. BUT, as you say NO EXCEPTIONS, except, as said elsewhere in this thread, those who enlist in the armed forces.
 
#17
Caine, who served as part of the Royal Fusiliers, admits he came close to losing his life in Korea.

He says, "I was nearly killed. There were four of us on patrol in a valley in the middle of the rice paddies. The Chinese were closing in on us and the officer said, 'Let's run towards their line - they won't expect it because they'll be expecting us to run away towards our lines.' So we did that and we ended up going right around them. They couldn't find us because they were looking in the wrong place and we got away. But we'd faced that moment that we thought was the end.

"That night we went back to our bunkers and celebrated with a beer. We were just happy to be alive... I faced a moment when I knew I was going to die and I didn't run, I wasn't a coward, and it affected me deeply. I was at peace with myself and that's guided my life, not just in terms of whether someone's going to kill me, but in everything."

NDM nope least he did something
 
#18
A couple of days ago I saw an interview with Sir Michael Caine during which he mentioned his National Service spent in BAOR and Korea. When asked, he replied that he would like to see the return of National Service to help combat youth violence and reiterating his comment: "I'm just saying, put them in the Army for six months. You're there to learn how to defend your country. You belong to the country. Then when you come out, you have a sense of belonging rather than a sense of violence."
This was followed by a few (probably well chosen) comments from some of Britain's youths, the cream of which was, "I'd rarver do me own fing, innit?"
What are the panel's thoughts?
Being's as prisons and crime existed before,during and after National Service I'd say it was bollocks, and as FSJ said the army will be filled with pressed men and women who don't want to be there spoiling the profesionalism of the rest of the armed forces.
 

Auld-Yin

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#19
What most people don't seem to realise is that when national service was brought in, it was not just to stop young men from being naughty. Britain still had an Empire (albeit winding down), had just finished a really major war with some commitments to fulfill following that (BAOR for one) and the cold war was just starting with people not knowing what would happen. Britain needed a fairly large army and the cheapest way to get that was to have National Service. As the commitment reduced then NS went, leaving a purely professional, volunteer army, which is infinitely better than an army of conscripts. IMO

The Armed Forces were not there to sort out the nation's youth problems, they were there for a purpose.
 

seaweed

LE
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#20
The Armed Forces have a professional job to do, they are not a reform school. This idiotic idea, however and by whom repeatedly parroted shows utter want of understanding.

What is actually needed is better policing with a greater degree of common sense; laws which prioritise the protection of people's private homes and property; effective, detererent sentencing in the courts; and a prison regime that makes those who are sent there stark staring terrified of a second dose.
 

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