National Defence Medal - "Not appropriate" apparently

#1
Reading in the Express today that the Gubment has kyboshed the idea, with Veterans Minister Kevan Jones stating it was 'inappropriate' It is, however, 'appropriate' to issue a tin lapel badge which looks like it fell out of a Christmas cracker. In fact, I think a National Defence Medal is far more appropriate and worthy than the Battle of Jubilee chocolate gong that was issued to every man and his dog.

Whilst I am totally against the idea of awarding medals for anything and everything vis a vis the US, I do think it is a shame that the National Service/Cold War Warriors have nothing to show on Remembrance Day Parades etc.

Plus, if they were to issue one, I could sew it on my police fleece and regale the boys in the canteen with tales of my derring do. Like when I singlehandedly held off the 3rd Soviet Shock Army on picket guard one night in Paderborn. :D

I just think it is totally indicative of the contempt shown by this gubment for anything or anyone that has ever served in the Colours. But that's my humble.
 
#3
Typical
It would be wll deserved by all those who served in the cold war. Not to mention Cyprus/Belize etc 6 month unaccompanied tours to safeguard nationl interest blah blah
every serviceman or woman should qualify. It might be the lowest of the low to some but for others it shows time served even if the bullets didnt fly
RC
 
#4
I don't really agree with a gong for Belize etc. Where would it all end. In fact I rather like the idea that the UK doesn't award tin for anything and everything. To do so would have a cheapening effect. But I think to deny many people a single medal for having served HMQ is petty minded and mean spirited
 
#5
marco_poloroid said:
I don't really agree with a gong for Belize etc. Where would it all end. In fact I rather like the idea that the UK doesn't award tin for anything and everything. To do so would have a cheapening effect. But I think to deny many people a single medal for having served HMQ is petty minded and mean spirited
I did a PFA today can I have another?
 
#6
spaz said:
marco_poloroid said:
I don't really agree with a gong for Belize etc. Where would it all end. In fact I rather like the idea that the UK doesn't award tin for anything and everything. To do so would have a cheapening effect. But I think to deny many people a single medal for having served HMQ is petty minded and mean spirited
I did a PFA today can I have another?
No, you qualify for a clasp
 
#7
marco_poloroid said:
spaz said:
marco_poloroid said:
I don't really agree with a gong for Belize etc. Where would it all end. In fact I rather like the idea that the UK doesn't award tin for anything and everything. To do so would have a cheapening effect. But I think to deny many people a single medal for having served HMQ is petty minded and mean spirited
I did a PFA today can I have another?
No, you qualify for a clasp
Happy days.
 
#8
Seconded.
I know an awful lot of people with campaign medals who led a fairly cushy existence on some of their "ops".
Including me :)
I know of others who went through an awful lot of hardship and self-sacrifice in so called non operational areas and got diddly squat. Consider also those that were killed or injured in Germany or on the UK mainland as a result of PIRA attacks, etc.
We have a General Service Medal already, so it wouldn't be that much of a step further to have either a "General Service" clasp for it or a separate medal in the same vein as the Golden Jubilee medal.
 

Fugly

ADC
DirtyBAT
#9
marco_poloroid said:
I just think it is totally indicative of the contempt shown by this gubment for anything or anyone that has ever served in the Colours. But that's my humble.
I'm all for bashing Labours "support" of us, but I'm afraid I disagree on this issue. Authorising a medal just so Cold War warriors can wear something just doesn't sit right. The next step will be a medal presented at Pirbright for passing phase 1. We'll end up looking like the septics.

If you weren't involved in Ops during your time, then maybe you should count yourself lucky.
 
#10
Fugly said:
marco_poloroid said:
I just think it is totally indicative of the contempt shown by this gubment for anything or anyone that has ever served in the Colours. But that's my humble.
I'm all for bashing Labours "support" of us, but I'm afraid I disagree on this issue. Authorising a medal just so Cold War warriors can wear something just doesn't sit right. The next step will be a medal presented at Pirbright for passing phase 1. We'll end up looking like the septics.

If you weren't involved in Ops during your time, then maybe you should count yourself lucky.
Fair enough, we kind of agree when you look at my post. My only disagreement would be the equivalence you draw with Pirbright phase 1 and some old chap who would be proud as punch to turn up on Remembrance Parade with something pinned to his chest to show for his service.
This is the same old chap that is much too proud to bling hmself up with those sh**e Waltyesque blingy medals you can buy from Soldier magazine for "BAOR Service" etc etc. He turns up anyway to show his respects. A single award, just one medal, for General Service, would make a big difference to him.

I don't really understand your viewpoint regarding loking like the septics. If you looked at the detail of my post, that was exactly the point I was making. I am talking about one medal for military service, nothing else.Surely my comments on the Battle of Jubilee medal indicate my viewpoint?

For your information I do have an operational medal, but that wasn't the point I was making. And yes, I suppose it was another excuse to bash the gubment :wink:
 

Fugly

ADC
DirtyBAT
#11
marco_poloroid said:
My only disagreement would be the equivalence you draw with Pirbright phase 1 and some old chap who would be proud as punch to turn up on Remembrance Parade with something pinned to his chest to show for his service.
This is the same old chap that is much too proud to bling hmself up with those sh**e Waltyesque blingy medals you can buy from Soldier magazine for "BAOR Service" etc etc. He turns up anyway to show his respects. A single award, just one medal, for General Service, would make a big difference to him.
Beret and Regimental Blazer then, surely. Along with Veterans badge, however "christmas cracker" you might view it.

If asked why no medals, surely the old boy would reply along the lines of "lucky enough not to get sent away", or some such.

It's nice to wear them, but I don't see why we should for all sorts of miscellaneous reasons to justify issuing a new one. As for the issue of BAOR and UK Mainland casualties due to PIRA, then that is just - and this may sound incredibly callous - unfortunate. The Elizabeth Cross was recently introduced, but that award only goes so far back retrospectively. Introducing yet another award would.... and so it goes on. Hence my comment about looking like septics.
 
#12
The medals thing has always been a fiasco. YOu can do 6 months in the Falklands in '83 and get bugger all, yet do 30 days in Cyprus and get the chocolate gong. Likewise, a lot of my mates served in the '70s and got bugger all for their time. There are a lot who left after 22 years with nothing to wear on their blazers
 

oldbaldy

LE
Moderator
#13
Top_Man said:
The medals thing has always been a fiasco. You can do 6 months in the Falklands in '83 and get bugger all, yet do 30 days in Cyprus and get the chocolate gong. Likewise, a lot of my mates served in the '70s and got bugger all for their time. There are a lot who left after 22 years with nothing to wear on their blazers
Not all UN Cyprus tours were a beach holiday, I was there in 1974!!!!!
I've also done a 6 months in the Falkland. The UN tour had far the most 'soldiering'.
 
#14
I went to Berlin - it was very tense on the Military Train, facing down the enemy guards at the checkpoints. Do I get an extra medal for that?
 
#16
Interestingly the Australian govt has got into the medals for all act over the last few years, I'm entitled to another 3 (which would double my count) but haven't claimed them! So far both my former RSM and a 2* general have told me I'm improperly dressed, I think I'm also entitled to a CIB, which is one way of differentiating from the pogos. From this you can deduce that I'm not particularly in favour of military bling, which is what I think afterthought medals are. That said during the 1960s Brit units in various parts of the world did fire the odd angry shot where no campaign medals were awarded.
 
#17
polar69 said:
I served on the Western front, Benbecula could get quite dicey if the bread hadn't been delivered to the Naafi
I refer you to the officer who was medically discharged following an unfortunate accident on St Kilda. A frozen turkey being delivered in an underslung helicopter load, took off on the drop with the velocity and trajectory of one of Barnes Wallis's bouncing bombs and hurtled down the hill from the LZ and through the Landrover window, in which the unfortunate officer was sitting, causing severe damage to the shoulder on impact.

Dangerous place, the Western Isles.
 
#18
oldbaldy said:
Top_Man said:
The medals thing has always been a fiasco. You can do 6 months in the Falklands in '83 and get bugger all, yet do 30 days in Cyprus and get the chocolate gong. Likewise, a lot of my mates served in the '70s and got bugger all for their time. There are a lot who left after 22 years with nothing to wear on their blazers
Not all UN Cyprus tours were a beach holiday, I was there in 1974!!!!!I've also done a 6 months in the Falkland. The UN tour had far the most 'soldiering'.
Operation ABLAUT. Me too - and I deserve a "P1ssing in a Desert Rose for 6 months" medal
 
#19
oldbaldy said:
Top_Man said:
The medals thing has always been a fiasco. You can do 6 months in the Falklands in '83 and get bugger all, yet do 30 days in Cyprus and get the chocolate gong. Likewise, a lot of my mates served in the '70s and got bugger all for their time. There are a lot who left after 22 years with nothing to wear on their blazers
Not all UN Cyprus tours were a beach holiday, I was there in 1974!!!!!
I've also done a 6 months in the Falkland. The UN tour had far the most 'soldiering'.
Bearing in mind that some (not me) were still clearing mines and losing limbs in the Falklands in 1983 ... IMO those guys should have got the SA Medal less rosette with a 'mine clearance' clasp ... or some such like.

I personally would like to see some form of medal for service. Do away with the LS&GC and replace it with a service medal awarded after 6 years with 'long service' clasp after 15 and 'exemplorary service' clasp on completion of 22 years with undetected crime. That way all service, especially long service (but a bit naughty) is recognised.
 
#20
Bumper said:
polar69 said:
I served on the Western front, Benbecula could get quite dicey if the bread hadn't been delivered to the Naafi
I refer you to the officer who was medically discharged following an unfortunate accident on St Kilda. A frozen turkey being delivered in an underslung helicopter load, took off on the drop with the velocity and trajectory of one of Barnes Wallis's bouncing bombs and hurtled down the hill from the LZ and through the Landrover window, in which the unfortunate officer was sitting, causing severe damage to the shoulder on impact.

Dangerous place, the Western Isles.

You weren't there man :crying: the long summer night, the skirl of the pipes ....and the wind, the endless f£$%^ing wind
 

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