Nanny State (No First Aid For You)

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by Bowser-Mong, Mar 11, 2006.

Welcome to the Army Rumour Service, ARRSE

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial military website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Reading in the Dail Mail this morning about a school's refusal to put a plaster on a 9 rear old girls cut (sorry no link). The little girl concerned had cut her finger, the school tried to clean it up but stopped short of putting a plaster on it citing "a possible allergic reaction" to the plaster. Apparently the school was following local council guidlines but the council refute this saying the guidelines are merely "guidelines" ie not to be taken word for word. The girls mother had to come and put a plaster on her daughters finger.

    Personally I think it is a pretty sad state of affairs.
     
  2. And yet if you recall from last year, the school still has the right to take your daughter away for an abortion without telling the parents - but God help them if they need to administer a tablet or plaster !!
     
  3. Once again it goes to show that common sense is not all that common
     
  4. cobblers

    I did a first aid course about 15 years ago, at the time it was suggested that you check if someone is alergic to plasters first, before giving treament (*). Now in this case the school was bit ott, but this story is not news.

    (* same story for headache pills)
     
  5. Yeah put with Guardian Reader, first course just a few months ago. You should check someones allergic to a plaster before you put one on. Officially as well you shouldnt let young children share food with each as they might be allergic to something without knowing. Its just the school being Ott in application as opposed to the nanny state strikes again.
     
  6. School admin is fcuked then. All students have allergy sheets completed which cover things like food and medicine allergies, they should have been able to refer to that.
     
  7. My mother is a school matron and has to get waiver forms signed by every single parent listing every single product she is allowed to use on a child, including sticking plasters, aspirin, paracetamol, savlon, dettol et cetera.

    Without this, all she is legally permitted to do is run any wound under the tap.
     
  8. Under HSE guidelines you may apply an adhesive dressing to a wound provided it is suitable for the wound and there is no indication of allergy. ie the patient says something to the effect that they are not aware of being allergic to them. failing that use a non adherant dressing and tie securely.

    It must be a local policy to not treat an injury, which goes against HSE regs with the school being responsible for the wellbeing of the child while there.
     
  9. scaryspice

    scaryspice LE Moderator

    Phantom - not quite correct in saying it goes against HSE Regs.

    H&S Regs (note not HSE - they don't write the Regs only the Guidance) require provision to be made for first aid in the form of eqpt and trained personnnel - for EMPLOYEES.

    You will actually find that although it is obviously good practice and I don't know of a school that doesn't do it, there is NO legal obligation to make provision for first aid for non-employees. School pupils are not employees. Regarding the "it's OK if the patient says so" Do you really think most primary school children are able to give what amounts to informed consent in an injury situation?

    This is a classic example of a school going way over the top with interpretation of guidance which was given in good faith because someone, somewhere sued an organistion where a plaster was put on without checking if the child was allergic to the damn thing. It's got more to do with the increasing attitude in this country that goes "I don't want to take responsibility for my own life, find me someone to blame/sue" than with any regulations or guidance.

    So certainly over-reaction from the school in this case, but accompanied by an equal over reaction from the press as usual on such things. What if the child had been allergic to the plaster and suffered a serious reaction resulting in hospitalisation - the story then could have been "negligent school puts child in hospital".
     
  10. I hope the girl's mum sues the school for negligence.
     
  11. scaryspice

    scaryspice LE Moderator

    To sue someone you have to have actually suffered some loss or damage as a result of their failure to provide the duty of care that they owed you.... See my comment above about the sad state of our society where peoplel think sueing is the ultimate answer.

    I rest my case.
     
  12. Its precisely that attitude that causes the problem. I'm a first-aider, but I wont give anyone a plaster or an aspirin, they moan like hell, but lets face it, if an injury is so slight that they only need a plaster, they're gonna live.
    Weigh that against the possibility of them going into anaphalyactic (spelling?) shock and dying, whereupon, they're NOK would sue the pants off me, and the descision is a no-brainer.
     
  13. I think this is more to do with the legal side than the moral or medical side. We are encouraged to fall over at the first uneven paving stone and sue the council or whoever by a solicitor/lawyer/leech who knows he/she will get a nice cut (unintentional) when the process is completed satisfactorily.

    In Germany it is a legal requirement to stop and attend the scene of a motor accident. Most do but would not dare applying anything to anybody as incorrect application of said anything would result in a hefty lawsuit. The drill is to check the nationality of the victim(s), if they are of good Caucasian stock then rush and retrieve your first aid box. Open first aid box, ignoring the dried up insect larvae in the corner of the box and the absence of the gloves that you used last week for painting the porch. Without the gloves you are not now legally responsible for treating the wound of the victim(s) but are liable to be fined as they are a compulsory item in the first aid box. A bit of a quandary, so do nothing.

    Repeatedly say "there there" in German if you can but in case anybody is watching, unroll a bandage then roll it up again, repeat as neccessary. By this time somebody should have rung the ambulance services and the experts can take over. You later realise you could have touched the victim as he\she had been eating a Mueller Rice before the accident and it wasn't blood, it was strawberry jam. You are thanked profoundly and you reply it was nothing and it was nothing but you feel so proud that you were there to help but at least you're not going to get sued.

    Sorry went on a bit. As I said it's the legal implications that seem more important than the medical ones. I'd also like to add that the Caucasian stock bit was as a friend of mine treated a Turkish accident victim while many would not. Sad fact but thankfully we're not all like that.
     
  14. this is nonsense fair enough not handing out asprins or paracetamol .
    but a sticky plaster slightly over the top
     
  15. Unfortunately, there is a common allergy to the adhesive mass used in Elastoplast and Smith & Nephew brands of adhesive plasters. As a Paramedic , when I am on duty at community events the first question I ask is "ARE YOU ALLERGIC TO BANDAIDS OR ELASTOPLAST TAPE?" to CYA.