Mysterious British aircraft crash in eastern Anatolia (Turkey) rediscovered

#2
It was G-ARGH (a perhaps unfortunate registration if said as a word...) heading for Bahrain. 12 POB (all killed), with the conclusion being that a failure to recognise that strong winds sent it off its intended track leading to CFIT.

The aircraft was heading to Woomera as its intended final destination, hence the mysterious cargo angle. There's some info here

The National Archives files don't seem to be closed, although given the suggestions f a cover-up, weeding could have taken place.
 
#3
Hurriyet Daily News just posted this intriguing headline and photos of the wreckage of a British aircraft that crashed in 1959, claiming it was carrying a nuclear cargo.

Wreckage from British aircraft with ‘mysterious cargo’ discovered near Turkey’s Van Lake

Lake Van is pretty remote and mountainous. I’ll do some digging around today to see if I can find out any more information.
1959 Air Charter Turkey crash - Wikipedia

It is a big probability that there were nuclear war heads in the cargo.
Great English, and seemingly no source info, Also the premise seems suspect, to whit Cancer confirms the presence of nuclear warheads. Instead of just hey this villager has a cancer! Also no mention of the RAF types who were setting off explosives around the site catching cancer. Added by some chap called Caglarkarademir.

So without a bit more evidence, one has to be suspicious.
 
#4
claiming it was carrying a nuclear cargo.
I'm hardly an expert but in the article @Archimedes has posted the RAF MRT used explosives to destroy the wreckage. I don't imagine they would have done that had there been a nuclear cargo!
Woomera was used by the British and Australians for long range weapons testing, so I wouldn't be surprised if the cargo was something to do with that (of course long range weapons testing in the 50's was undoubtedly connected to nuclear warheads, but that doesn't mean any were on board this particular flight)
 
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AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
#5
1959 Air Charter Turkey crash - Wikipedia



Great English, and seemingly no source info, Also the premise seems suspect, to whit Cancer confirms the presence of nuclear warheads. Instead of just hey this villager has a cancer! Also no mention of the RAF types who were setting off explosives around the site catching cancer. Added by some chap called Caglarkarademir.

So without a bit more evidence, one has to be suspicious.
Avro Tudor crashes? No news here. Me mum could have anticipated that following her flight to Colombia in 1947 in a Lancastrian.
 
#6
Also worth noting Ankara's current hard on for anything western, US and UK in particular - propaganda will be going full steam ahead with every cancer, birth defect, missing cat and broken toe nail being blamed on the vile Brits and the day they nuked Turkey...
 
#7
Also worth noting Ankara's current hard on for anything western, US and UK in particular - propaganda will be going full steam ahead with every cancer, birth defect, missing cat and broken toe nail being blamed on the vile Brits and the day they nuked Turkey...
The UK is about the only western friend that Turkeyand more specifically, Erdoğan has. The UK is pivotal to their National Fighter Programme which is gaining more importance now that Turkish participation in the F35 programme is in jeopardy.

I expect Sir Dominick Chilcott, our new chap in Ankara, will be preparing defensive lines.
 
#8
If I get time later, I’ll see if there are any clues as to what might have been under test at Woomera at the time. There were some minor tests on nuclear material (Test Kittens and Test Rats spring to mind - no kittens were harmed...) which might correlate, but guided weapons or classified test kit is equally possible.
 
#9
If I get time later, I’ll see if there are any clues as to what might have been under test at Woomera at the time. There were some minor tests on nuclear material (Test Kittens and Test Rats spring to mind - no kittens were harmed...) which might correlate, but guided weapons or classified test kit is equally possible.
Given the remoteness of the site and the proximity of the Soviet border, destroying the wreckage was the logical thing to do. Çaglarkarademir - Callers of the blacksmith, is my translation of the Republican Turkish name.
 
#10
If I get time later, I’ll see if there are any clues as to what might have been under test at Woomera at the time.
British nuclear tests occurred at Maralinga (part of the Woomera Range Complex) between 1956 and 1963.

ETA - possibly Plutonium?

From Wiki:

'In addition to the major tests, a large number of minor trials were also carried out, from June 1955 and extended through to April 1963.[7] Although the major tests had been carried out with some publicity, the minor tests were carried out in absolute secrecy.[27] These minor tests left a dangerous legacy of radioactive contamination at Maralinga.[28][29]

'The four series of minor trials were codenamed 'Kittens', 'Tims', 'Rats' and 'Vixen'.[27] In all, these trials included up to 700 tests, with tests involving experiments with plutonium, uranium, and beryllium.[30] Operation Kittens involved 99 trials, performed at both Maralinga and Emu Field in 1953–1961.[31] The tests were used in the development of neutron initiators, involving use of polonium-210 and uranium, and generated "relatively large amounts of radioactive contamination."[31] Operation Tims took place in 1955–1963, and involved 321 trials of uranium and beryllium tampers, as well as studies of plutonium compression.[31] Operation Rats investigated explosive dispersal of uranium.[31] 125 trials took place between 1956 and 1960.

'The Vixen minor trials (Vixen A and Vixen B) were formulated to investigate what would happen to a nuclear device which burnt or was subject to a non-nuclear explosion.[27] 31 Vixen A trials between 1959 and 1961 investigated the effects of an accidental fire on a nuclear weapon, and involved a total of about 1 kg of plutonium.[32] Twelve Vixen B trials, between 1960 and 1963, attempted to discover the effects of high explosives detonating a nuclear weapon in a fire (typical of conditions which would occur in aviation accidents) and involved 22 kg of plutonium.[32] They produced "jets of molten, burning plutonium extending hundreds of feet into the air."[33] It was the lack of subsequent disposal of the plutonium from these minor trials – Vixen B especially – which created the major radiation problems at the site.[33]

'The Vixen experimental tests used TNT to blow up simulated nuclear warheads containing plutonium-239. In total, Vixen B scattered 22.2 kg of plutonium around the Maralinga test site known as Taranaki, in particles of widely divergent size. Plutonium is not particularly dangerous externally - it emits alpha particles which are stopped by 9 cm (3.5 in) of air, or the dead layer of skin cells on the body, and is not a very intensive source of radiation, due to its long half-life of 24,000 years. It is most dangerous when it enters the body, in the worst case by breathing, and therefore tiny particles, often the result of such explosion testing, are the worst threat. The extreme biological persistence of plutonium's radioactive contamination and the cancer threat posed by alpha radiation occurring internally together establish plutonium's dangers.[34]

'In terms of regular nuclear testing, Kittens represents bomb component testing, while Tims and Rats were early subcritical hydronuclear tests. Vixen is "safety testing" of a bomb; assuring that the core would not accidentally undergo criticality in the event of a fire or unintended crash. These are always messy (see the US equivalent at Plutonium Valley in Project 56), for a successful test subjects the core fuel to high explosives in the hope that it simply scatters rather than undergoes criticality. The differences in the sort of dangers presented by major vs the minor tests is that there was no critical explosion in the minor tests. In the major tests, the bomb cores reached critical mass; the plutonium or uranium fissile materials "burned" into highly radioactive fission products, and those, along with the unspent fuel and activated bomb case, tower and soil if the explosion was close to the ground, are lofted into the stratosphere to be dropped eventually as fallout globally. In Vixen, an equivalent amount of plutonium fuel was simply smashed by explosives and spread about much more locally. In Kittens, Tims and Rats, smaller amounts of various materials were similar exploded locally and spread about.'

British nuclear tests at Maralinga - Wikipedia
 
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#11
Mho, is that nuke warheads seldom went by air unless ready for deployment for the very reason that overflight with nuke cargoes was generally frowned upon by governments. It would also be effing hard to explain if a crash happened.
Much safer to stick it in HMS X-ray where it can be safely kept under armed lock and key, be in international waters for most of the time and delivered safely to a friendly navy base.
 
#12
I'm hardly an expert but in the article @Archimedes has posted the RAF MRT used explosives to destroy the wreckage. I don't imagine they would have done that had there been a nuclear cargo!
You read some of the things they had military personnel doing in nuclear areas back then, I'm not so sure. I suspect the claim is pure fantasy, but this isn't one of the better arguments against.
 
#13
Considering that the aircraft instrumentation of that era used radium paint ( ditto radios etc ) it's entirely possible that suitably sensitive equipment could pick up "evidence"
 
#15
Also worth noting Ankara's current hard on for anything western, US and UK in particular - propaganda will be going full steam ahead with every cancer, birth defect, missing cat and broken toe nail being blamed on the vile Brits and the day they nuked Turkey...
Nuke Turkey? Now theres a thought...;)
 

seaweed

LE
Book Reviewer
#16
...
I expect Sir Dominick Chilcott, our new chap in Ankara, will be preparing defensive lines.
I hope his butler isn't riffling through his safe.
 

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