Multiculturalism, Europe and Islam - what are the options now?

The BBC doing their bit to promote ISlam in Eastenders as 'Bobby Beale' converts to Islam following a stint in jail:

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Look forward to a bumper mass casualty attack, in the Eastenders Christmas Special.
 
There's a cogent argument to be made that, in addition to demographic drivers and local political advantage, multi-culturalism and immigration have been endorsed at the highest levels in Europe as a way of breaking down the strength of identity of nation states in order to encourage the continent's populace to embrace a wider primary identification as European.

As a perverse effect, we now have imported a significant minority which identifies itself in religious terms, which cannot be broken down in the same way and which is proving highly resistant to integrating with indigenous communities.

There was an excellent article posted by Graculus on page 68 of the Paris shooting thread:

What ISIS Really Wants

which I thoroughly recommend as one of the best articles I've read on anything recently. It points out that, however repugnant the actions it inspires, ISIS ideology is orthodox and that, unless we understand that, we cannot understand its appeal and, by extension, how to oppose it. The Koran provides a doctrinal straight jacket akin to concept of the Infallibility of the Pope but even harder to renounce because of the associated doctrine of the perfection of the book. Essentially, the doctrinal reforms which eventually took the murderous steam out of Christianity are not available to Islam.

If this article is right, two things seem to flow from it. Firstly, actively embracing western culture and conforming to Islamic values may actually be mutually exclusive, in which case we are condemned at best to an uneasy truce and the creation of parallel societies. Secondly, that events like the Paris massacres can be justified in the context of Islamic orthodoxy may create a situation whereby an individual can be personally appalled by an act whilst accepting that it has legitimacy in the context of their faith - intellectually and emotionally a very difficult place to be, though it possibly explains why some of the condemnations after these events are not necessarily as unequivocal or supported by decisive action as perhaps we might wish.

There are no moral or civilised mechanisms for reversing immigration, therefore how do we make real progress with integrating Islamic minorities for whom such integration may actually be anathema, what are the implications for Europe's governing elites if they have to concede the failure or even limits of multicuturalism and will they be prepared even to consider developing policy on that assumption if doing so threatens their objective of an ever closer Europe?

I know that this was 2015 and presumably someone else has pointed it out but the Muslims aren't here because Europe.

Fyrdman.... in the intervening years have you begun to understand the difference between 'EU free movement' and 'British immigration policy '?
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
I know that this was 2015 and presumably someone else has pointed it out but the Muslims aren't here because Europe.

Fyrdman.... in the intervening years have you begun to understand the difference between 'EU free movement' and 'British immigration policy '?
Why don't you do detail for once and read the thread - then you'll understand that all the caveats and contexts are in there and that the various policy interactions which define the problem have not been conflated into blaming everything on the EU as you're trying to pretend.
 
Why don't you do detail for once and read the thread - then you'll understand that all the caveats and contexts are in there and that the various policy interactions which define the problem have not been conflated into blaming everything on the EU as you're trying to pretend.
I'm not pretending any such thing. I read your post.

If you've developed your understanding since you posted the Adrian Mole level OP, great.
 
Why don't you do detail for once and read the thread - then you'll understand that all the caveats and contexts are in there and that the various policy interactions which define the problem have not been conflated into blaming everything on the EU as you're trying to pretend.
Merkel in Sept 2015 invited the whole of the MENA into Germany and hence the EU.
This was backed by Junker and Tusk with absolutely no democratic input.
That is the major problem we are suffering from.
And why we must leave.
 
Oh the joys of multiculturalism...

Victim of forced marriage escapes husband while on honeymoon | Metro News

Pretty sad state of affairs for the nation when check-in staff and cabin crew at airlines, are being trained to spot victims of forced marriage, FGM and modern slavery at our ports of entry / departure.

Still, it the Lefties wouldn't want it any other way.
If she is rescued in that way, surely he should be taken to Court charged with rape, and her parents charged with ....maybe Slavery ?
 
Oh the joys of multiculturalism...

Victim of forced marriage escapes husband while on honeymoon | Metro News

Pretty sad state of affairs for the nation when check-in staff and cabin crew at airlines, are being trained to spot victims of forced marriage, FGM and modern slavery at our ports of entry / departure.

Still, it the Lefties wouldn't want it any other way.
Leading article on sky news on Monday. Interviewed a number of experts who gave various advice on how to spot potential victims. I was left unclear which group are likely the main perpetrators - it sounded like a typical British family problem...have I misunderstood this?
 
Oh the joys of multiculturalism...

Victim of forced marriage escapes husband while on honeymoon | Metro News

Pretty sad state of affairs for the nation when check-in staff and cabin crew at airlines, are being trained to spot victims of forced marriage, FGM and modern slavery at our ports of entry / departure.

Still, it the Lefties wouldn't want it any other way.
Why are you bothered about people being trained to spot victims of forced marriage?
The only reason I cam think of is because you're in favour of forced marriage.

You nasty little thing, you.

And despite your whining about the Lefties, it's the Tories that are in charge.

Supporting forced marriage.

You despicable wretch.
 

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