Mugabes Zimbabwe

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by tomahawk6, Oct 10, 2005.

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    October 10, 2005: Since 2000, economic conditions in Zimbabwe have steadily worsened. First came the attacks on "white farmers" and the "redistribution" of their farms. Attacks increased on the Matabele tribe, which had long been hostile to president Mugabe and his supporters. Food shortages began with crop failure (when the "white farmers" and their employees left the farms) but even the arrival of food aid didn't help. Robert Mugabe's government controlled food distribution, and Mugabe's supporters got food, his opponents didn't. Mugabe's personal involvement in the Congo War also came under scrutiny. There were numerous indications that Mugabe, and possibly some of his senior military officers, were renting out Zimbabwean military forces in exchange for cash and a cut of the Congo's resources. British and US church activists became active supporters of church leaders inside Zimbabwe who opposed Mugabe's policies. Mugabe stood fast because he could count on his political party's security forces and the military.

    Now there are apparently signs of in the 40,000 man army. Some troops are protesting food shortages. Another beef in the military seems to be cuts in pay. South African sources report that troops involved in the protests have been confined to their barracks and some will be court-martialed. Mugabe is a dictator who relies on batons and bayonets to stay in power. If he's failing to pay the troops (the bayonets) his government's economic problems are indeed very serious. Mugabe needs to be removed from power. South Africa and Great Britain are the two foreign powers most likely to act against him, and both have demurred. That means Mugabe will either go by military coup, civil war, or, like Stalin, retain power into a frail, paranoid old age. Civil war has always been a possibility, but it appears military coup is no longer out of the question. --Austin Bay
  2. Is this guy taking the urine? SA one of the foreign powers most likely to act against Ol' Bob?


    Mbeki wants to model his new 'land reforms' on the Zimbabwean model and has robustly defended Ol' Bob on numerous occasions when the 'honkey' has been critical of his method of government (if you can call it that!) Can't see him even contemplating sanctions never mind military action.
  3. Just invade the bloody country and get it over and with.
  4. Alternatively, cut all ties to the Dark Continent still in place, halt all aid and leave the Africans to go to hell in their own way (Which they will do anyhow), without us paying for it. We no longer have an empire, so when are we going to stop paying out money to former colonies?
  5. Where do you start? Mugabe and his Navy (the "war vets" were only semen when the bush war was being fought) could have me ranting all day. My brother-in-law, a serving soldier too, has recently lost his family ranch and stacks of former Army friends have left the country with their families to avoid violence and intimidation. We should invade the place to remove the despot and stop the deprivation, but that is only acceptable to our government when there is oil at stake and /or if the US President agrees to or demands our participation. Remember, Zimbabwe is just like many men, ruled by a knob.

    Pamwe Chete.
  6. Why not try it in a real country begins with Z and ends in imbamwe and actually help people.




    Just do it and save whats left of Sub-Saharan Africa.

    The North is lost.

    Nigeria is one of the poorest countries in the world ...but the 11th biggest producer of oil????

    So why is it so poor? Why does it need aid?
  7. The killing thing about Zimbabwe is that it would be so easy to do something about it. Even if one were to gather together the large numbers of old Colonials in the Forces, they alone could run Old Butcher Bob out of the country, and the people (what is left of them) would welcome it....but it won't happen. Pre-1994 South Africa might have done something about Mugabe's antics, but Mbeki and the rest of the ANC apparatchiks will sit on their hands and work out a way to do the same thing in South Africa.

    Pamwe far the country has fallen from the days when the Scouts ran rings about Mugabe and his mob.
  8. "the large numbers of old Colonials in the Forces"
    Old being the operative word, I'm old they will be ancient.
    "cut all ties to the Dark Continent still in place, halt all aid and leave the Africans to go to hell in their own way"
    Yes best suggestion I've heard on the overall situation.
  9. hmm... Before the invasion of Iraq we were told it would be a pushover. Remember all those statements that Iraqi oil will pay for the invasion etc etc. But it didn't turn out so easy. At least in Iraq we had tried other options to deal with Saddam and although not everyone would agree, war was perhaps the only choice.

    But Zimbabwe is different. No need to invade... yet at least. Any invasion would inevitably end up killing a lot of civilians and so we shouldn't be too keen. We should be putting economic pressure on the surrounding countries to force them to take a more proactive role. I think most South Africans see Mugabe for what he is - remember the SA unions who were not allowed to observe the Zimbabwean election? It's just Mbeki's circle who still support him - or at least refuse to say much in public.

  10. I agree tricam. Rushing to war over Zimbabwe when little if anything else up to now has been done would be precipitous and a little foolish bearing in mind that Iraq is the primary concern at present. However, is there any political will to do anything at all? Furthermore, no Western government will risk the wrath of the PC brigade by even suggesting sanctions against Zimbabwe. If the West waits any longer there will be precious little left saving in Zimbabwe at the rate that Mugabe is destroying the country and its people.
  11. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    I have to say I concur, but I go further than with parting just from Conrad's 'Heart of Darkness'. Let's get rid of the whole commonwealth (surely an oxymoron). The sooner all those High Commissions are Embassies the better in my opinion. It can be no coincedence that the letters FCO appear in the expression F*C* OFF, so let the 'C' depart and leave the UK with just a Foreign Office.
  12. No, apparently not. There certainly isn't inside the country. Everyone's too afraid.
    Yes, that's about right. Incidentally, the IMF threat was averted by the expedient of simply confiscating the FOREX reserves of one of the country's only serious foreign mining operators (RTZ) and passing the booty along to the IMF in partial payment of the debt. I haven't seen that in any newspaper yet (might not be watching the news hard enough, mind).
    Fuel: there is lots to be had if you know where.... Farmers, being the powerhouse of the economy :D , get fuel at a standard Government rate (about the same price as in the UK, actually). There are vast numbers of 'farmers', now, of course, who don't feel up to doing any actual farming; they sell their fuel instead, to the businesses who are still trying to make a go of it all, at a markup of something like 10,000%. Makes for a nice little earner as you sit on your newly acquired but mouldering estate, sipping your crap Lion beer.

    Or so I'm told. I live in Venezuela, honest.
  13. Sorry GG but I can't agree with this. The PC brigade are responsible for a lot of rubbish but we can't blame them for the lack of more aggressive action over Zimbabwe. I don't think there is any *mainstream* PC types opposed to tougher action on Zimbabwe. For example, Geoffrey Sachs - the economist brains behind Bono,Geldoff and company - has said clearly that all his aid, debt relief and free trade stuff does NOT apply to Zimbabwe stlye situations. Certainly, there may be one or two PC extremists out there who would see any sanctions as racist but there are muppets and fools in every political movement. I'm sure I could find a right-wing person with ridiculous tin foil hat views but that doesn't make all right-wingers idiots.

    For those that think we should just ignore Africa and let them get on with it. Well, besides the obvious moral questions and the economic arguments in favour of helping Africa it is also in our interest from a security point of view. Look at Afghanistan - left to rot after the collapse of the USSR and what happened? large numbers of terrorists were trained there threatening us. Highly persuasive argument don't you think?

  14. I think the way to go would be to hire a mercenary force to act as the catalyst for a revolt.