Mrs May - whither (or wither) the Tory Party

The location is the UK and in the minds of people who didn't really know what they were voting for.

I will give your regards to Mrs BL. She likes idiots, too.
I assume then that she loves you.
 
You don't "do" current affairs, do you?

UKIP's "base" is & was mostly old style, working class, former labour voters.
The support UKIP received from former Conservatives, such as myself was a minority part, though a growing one. This disappeared once it appeared brexit had been accomplished, as did a great deal of broad spectrum support once it became plain where Batten intended to take the party.
No I don't "do" current affairs. So you left UKIP?

Good riddance, thanks for your input, it was very interesting.
 
No I don't "do" current affairs. So you left UKIP?

Good riddance, thanks for your input, it was very interesting.
Ah yes; wilful ignorance. Home for all too many who cannot differentiate the deal from the pine. :roll:

I'm confident that I invested far more in terms of time, money & effort in both UKIP & the Leave campaign than you ever did, so shove it up your arrse.
 
TR is not a member (not allowed) but as you say, he was hired as a consultant to advise the leadership on the Islamic paedophile grooming gangs as he is something of a subject matter expert. I understand that a lot of people are uncomfortable with that. What GB i able to do and already has been doing is tap into the working class vote. Every other party has ignored them for decades and through TR, UKIP have access to hundreds of thousands of disaffected working class voters whom have never had a voice in politics before.

I see this as important and positive. You may or may not like Tommy Robinson but it seems like throwing the baby out with the bathwater to dismiss an entire party because you don't like one person that was / is associated with them in a minor way.
There's one tiny flaw in that plan. Robinson has been in political parties before, and this 'Large block of disaffected working class votes' has utterly failed to materialise.
While I agree that there is large chunk of the voting base that gets ignored, and there are some issues that need disscussing, to which the current response is to scream 'RACIST!' and then ignore the worries. Which in turn pisses a person off. Robinson is not the answer.
 
Ah yes; wilful ignorance. Home for all too many who cannot differentiate the deal from the pine. :roll:

I'm confident that I invested far more in terms of time, money & effort in both UKIP & the Leave campaign than you ever did, so shove it up your arrse.
You wasted your time. Useful idiot indeed. Hahaha
 
There's one tiny flaw in that plan. Robinson has been in political parties before, and this 'Large block of disaffected working class votes' has utterly failed to materialise.
While I agree that there is large chunk of the voting base that gets ignored, and there are some issues that need disscussing, to which the current response is to scream 'RACIST!' and then ignore the worries. Which in turn pisses a person off. Robinson is not the answer.
I dont think that anybody thinks that Robinson is the answer but I have observed several political rallies in which GB has spoken to thousands of these people and they are very much there in the material sense. I agree with the second part of your statement.

The trouble with Tommy Robinson is that the smear campaign against him and his tenancy to take things a bit too far sometimes have created a radioactive, toxic atmosphere around him. Somebody only needs to mention his name here and the vitriol, bile and hate that follows from some members who are otherwise able to hold down a normal discussion is quite striking.

All of the poltical parties have associations with people who some would find unlikable. Labour and their communist, socialist and terrorist sympathisers, the Tories and their corporate banker, dictators and aristocrats, the Lib dems and their drunk driving, donors who were charged with money laundering, skipped bail and left the country.


Honestly though, at this point, pretty much everyone who reacts this way to the name "Tommy Robinson" is somebody that has not taken the time to look into it themselves, listen to what he is saying and draw their own conclusions. It seems that a lot of people just read the news and hear "Far Right extremist tommy robinson is a very bad person" and then leave it at that.

The danger is that it shows that the media really can control what people think and more importantly, how they feel about certain subjects.

I'm indifferent to him, personally but I have listened to him and I have read some of his work because something did not add up to me, something about the whole TR thing did not seem right to me so I looked into it and found nothing of any substance to warrant the media attention and hatred that he receives and was instead left with a cold feeling that his treatment by the media and the authorities is very concerning as his crime appears to be that he threatens the loose and stretched social cohesion of our multicultural utopia.

Our government know very well that a lot of people are unhappy with the current situation in the UK and view TR as an agitator who must be stopped.

I on the other hand believe in freedom of speech - as long as it does not incite violence and I believe in individual freedoms over the collective.

I despise communists, I have no respect for socialists but i'll never support any laws that prevent them from speaking freely.

Yesterday I walked through the middle of the climate change protest around Marble Arch where between 200 and 400 hippies and crusty lefties were sitting around, smoking and pontificating while blocking one of the busiest junctions in London. The socialist workers party had set up a stall and were signing people up to their party.

I think that they should have the freedom and the right to do this, even though I think that they are stupid, cruel and dangerous and in this case the dozen or so old bill that were there allowed it to happen and made no attempt to drag the demonstrators out of the road so that traffic could pass. It would have been very easy for them to do so and it seems that the Mayor or at least somebody in the Police felt that these hippies should be able to voice their concerns. I wondered what would have happened if it had been 200 - 400 UKIP supporters.

And for that reason, I don't have a problem with Tommy Robinson voicing legitimate concerns about Islam in the UK and in particular, shining a spotlight on the scale of the grooming gang problem thus becoming something on an expert of the matter. I don't see any reason why he should be disqualified from advising on the subject and I dont see any reason why GB of UKIP should not utilise this information and in turn speak to TR supporters (there are hundreds of thousands of them).

It's a long post, sorry about that but I want you to know that some thought and some research has gone into this and I have not simply glanced at a Guardian or Breitbart article about TR and made my mind up.

For the avoidance of doubt, yes, i know what his real name is, I know his legal history and I know that some people just dont like him. I also know that a lot of people dont like him because of what they have read ABOUT him and have never actually listened to him speak to determine if the narrative is accurate or not.
 
Yesterday I walked through the middle of the climate change protest around Marble Arch where between 200 and 400 hippies and crusty lefties were sitting around, smoking and pontificating while blocking one of the busiest junctions in London. The socialist workers party had set up a stall and were signing people up to their party.
Being Arrse I'm just surprised there isn't a "Climate Change Protesters you would" thread
 
1. I dont think that anybody thinks that Robinson is the answer.

2. The trouble with Tommy Robinson is that the smear campaign against him and his tenancy to take things a bit too far sometimes have created a radioactive, toxic atmosphere around him. Somebody only needs to mention his name here and the vitriol, bile and hate that follows from some members who are otherwise able to hold down a normal discussion is quite striking.

3. All of the poltical parties have associations with people who some would find unlikable. Labour and their communist, socialist and terrorist sympathisers, the Tories and their corporate banker, dictators and aristocrats, the Lib dems and their drunk driving, donors who were charged with money laundering, skipped bail and left the country.


4. Honestly though, at this point, pretty much everyone who reacts this way to the name "Tommy Robinson" is somebody that has not taken the time to look into it themselves, listen to what he is saying and draw their own conclusions. It seems that a lot of people just read the news and hear "Far Right extremist tommy robinson is a very bad person" and then leave it at that.

5. The danger is that it shows that the media really can control what people think and more importantly, how they feel about certain subjects.

6. I'm indifferent to him, personally but I have listened to him and I have read some of his work because something did not add up to me, something about the whole TR thing did not seem right to me so I looked into it and found nothing of any substance to warrant the media attention and hatred that he receives and was instead left with a cold feeling that his treatment by the media and the authorities is very concerning as his crime appears to be that he threatens the loose and stretched social cohesion of our multicultural utopia.

7. Our government know very well that a lot of people are unhappy with the current situation in the UK and view TR as an agitator who must be stopped.

8. I on the other hand believe in freedom of speech - as long as it does not incite violence and I believe in individual freedoms over the collective.

9. I despise communists, I have no respect for socialists but i'll never support any laws that prevent them from speaking freely.

10. Yesterday I walked through the middle of the climate change protest around Marble Arch where between 200 and 400 hippies and crusty lefties were sitting around, smoking and pontificating while blocking one of the busiest junctions in London. The socialist workers party had set up a stall and were signing people up to their party.

I think that they should have the freedom and the right to do this, even though I think that they are stupid, cruel and dangerous and in this case the dozen or so old bill that were there allowed it to happen and made no attempt to drag the demonstrators out of the road so that traffic could pass. It would have been very easy for them to do so and it seems that the Mayor or at least somebody in the Police felt that these hippies should be able to voice their concerns. I wondered what would have happened if it had been 200 - 400 UKIP supporters.

11. And for that reason, I don't have a problem with Tommy Robinson voicing legitimate concerns about Islam in the UK and in particular, shining a spotlight on the scale of the grooming gang problem thus becoming something on an expert of the matter. I don't see any reason why he should be disqualified from advising on the subject and I dont see any reason why GB of UKIP should not utilise this information and in turn speak to TR supporters (there are hundreds of thousands of them).

12. It's a long post, sorry about that but I want you to know that some thought and some research has gone into this and I have not simply glanced at a Guardian or Breitbart article about TR and made my mind up.

13. For the avoidance of doubt, yes, i know what his real name is, I know his legal history and I know that some people just dont like him. I also know that a lot of people dont like him because of what they have read ABOUT him and have never actually listened to him speak to determine if the narrative is accurate or not.
1. Except perhaps TR.

2. There is no smear campaign against TR, he's brought all the vitriol upon his own head by his own words, deeds and associations.

3. Excepting Labour with their current anti-Jewish problems, none of the others have anything near what TR and his associates do.

4. I have taken the time to look into TR thanks, quite thoroughly in fact. I came to the conclusion that he was very clever in what he did, said and his manipulation of the media was second to none. Unfortunately his game is racist through and through and I'd guess most of his followers are too, for various reasons.

5. The media is to blame for a lot of things, I'm not one who is simple enough of mind that the media can manipulate me into any way of thinking (at least I hope not). I make my own mind up particularly about contensious issues by researching many different ways and means.

6. I doubt very much that you're indiferrent to TR, your post says the exact opposite to the point you appear to be a TR appeaser.

7. The government thinks TR should be stopped? Conspiraloon territory that.

8. Freedom of speech is fine but what TR does is not exactly incite violence, he leaves that to his cohorts to interpret what he's saying and does absolutely nothing to counteract their doing so.

9. Big deal.

10. So you think it OK for a small group of zealots to bring a city to a standstill affecting jobs, businesses and people moving about freely because of freedom of speech? It may have skipped your attention but most of their actions had little to do with speech of any kind, particularly those that put through windows at Shell. The Old Bill did arrest a good number but dragging people out of the road would have inflamed matters and could have led to much more damage and people getting hurt, I think they managed it quite well.

11. If you seriously believe that TR should be allowed to continue his couse of undermining the Law of the land and be used as a consultant on the alleged and proved grooming of underage and vulnerable children then you must be a Rotherham Welfare worker.

12. I'd suggest the next time you research a subject you take your rose tinted TR glasses off first.
 
Being Arrse I'm just surprised there isn't a "Climate Change Protesters you would" thread
There are not many, I should have taken photo's. It was mostly kids who should have been at school (easter holidays I suppose?) and the elderly. The sort of elderly who retired to Brighton. It was all a bit wet to be honest. Not at all edgy or dangerous, I was surprised to see the news this morning that it supposedly kicked off last night, It was easily the tamest demo I have ever been in (I was not taking part, was just in the area and walked among them to see what was going on).
 
1. Except perhaps TR.

2. There is no smear campaign against TR, he's brought all the vitriol upon his own head by his own words, deeds and associations.

3. Excepting Labour with their current anti-Jewish problems, none of the others have anything near what TR and his associates do.

4. I have taken the time to look into TR thanks, quite thoroughly in fact. I came to the conclusion that he was very clever in what he did, said and his manipulation of the media was second to none. Unfortunately his game is racist through and through and I'd guess most of his followers are too, for various reasons.

5. The media is to blame for a lot of things, I'm not one who is simple enough of mind that the media can manipulate me into any way of thinking (at least I hope not). I make my own mind up particularly about contensious issues by researching many different ways and means.

6. I doubt very much that you're indiferrent to TR, your post says the exact opposite to the point you appear to be a TR appeaser.

7. The government thinks TR should be stopped? Conspiraloon territory that.

8. Freedom of speech is fine but what TR does is not exactly incite violence, he leaves that to his cohorts to interpret what he's saying and does absolutely nothing to counteract their doing so.

9. Big deal.

10. So you think it OK for a small group of zealots to bring a city to a standstill affecting jobs, businesses and people moving about freely because of freedom of speech? It may have skipped your attention but most of their actions had little to do with speech of any kind, particularly those that put through windows at Shell. The Old Bill did arrest a good number but dragging people out of the road would have inflamed matters and could have led to much more damage and people getting hurt, I think they managed it quite well.

11. If you seriously believe that TR should be allowed to continue his couse of undermining the Law of the land and be used as a consultant on the alleged and proved grooming of underage and vulnerable children then you must be a Rotherham Welfare worker.

12. I'd suggest the next time you research a subject you take your rose tinted TR glasses off first.
I cant be bothered to read and address what you have written to be honest but a cursory glance confirms what I thought you would do. You are making a fool of yourself. I so rarely use the negative post buttons on here but it seems to be the way you communicate your ideas best so I've applied the that most closely describes your capacity for political discourse.

All anyone need do is whisper "Tommy Robinson - ner ner ner ner" in your ear and you explode into a tirade of anger and hate It's hilarious. Don't you think it's weird that two those two words are enough to make you blood pressure rise?

Do you understand that it is possible to discuss, describe and explore a topic (or person) without actually advocating for it?

Your attacking somebody and you don't know why, dont get me wrong, It's very funny but it's also kind of sad too.

I don't know why we are even talking about Mr TR either, I said "UKIP" a few posts back in relation to Brexit and then that was enough for you to "engage Tommy Robinson mode".

Anyway, At least I know how to ruin your day now, so not a wasted 5 minutes after all.
 
I cant be bothered to read and address what you have written to be honest but a cursory glance confirms what I thought you would do. You are making a fool of yourself. I so rarely use the negative post buttons on here but it seems to be the way you communicate your ideas best so I've applied the that most closely describes your capacity for political discourse.

All anyone need do is whisper "Tommy Robinson - ner ner ner ner" in your ear and you explode into a tirade of anger and hate It's hilarious. Don't you think it's weird that two those two words are enough to make you blood pressure rise?

Do you understand that it is possible to discuss, describe and explore a topic (or person) without actually advocating for it?

Your attacking somebody and you don't know why, dont get me wrong, It's very funny but it's also kind of sad too.

I don't know why we are even talking about Mr TR either, I said "UKIP" a few posts back in relation to Brexit and then that was enough for you to "engage Tommy Robinson mode".

Anyway, At least I know how to ruin your day now, so not a wasted 5 minutes after all.
You really need to get out more often.
 
Robinson is electoral kryptonite. Regardless of anyones views on the causes he expouses that alone disbars him from any party wishing to attract mainstream votes.
 
Quite happy with what I posted thanks, he may be a TR appeaser but I don't have to be, nor does another thread need to be derailed/infected by TR and his sycophants.
Strong words. I’m not a scholar of the alleged wrongdoings of TR. educate me. Educate us. You are happy to have a thread change direction on the back of your fervent beliefs so... show evidence. Also show how TR differs from others who may have had mention on arrse but you have failed to “dive in” regarding their publicity.

I’m all ears.

Edit: in fact - why not do your duty and address teddybear’s post point by point. Show your working.
 
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