Most Beautiful Aircraft

I did wonder, but of the not very many images I can find of her majesty's aircraft wasting perfectly good stores I can't find one that matches the aspect and approach angle... so if faked probably done at the time with old fashioned methods...

View attachment 408338
Pic 1 of your reply looks like it might plausibly have been taken further aft than the spectators in the original.
I can't see the rocket that is proceeding at a different angle (almost between the two 'bunches' of smoke trails in the original) in your pic 1 though.
 
The Mk II with Bristol Hercules radial air cooled engines. Initial service tests with 61 Sqdn in 1943 revealed an unexpectedly low service ceiling. On its first test, against Essen on 11/12 January, two Mk IIs joined a force of Mk Is. While the Mk I operated at 22,000 feet, the best the Mk II could achieve was an altitude of 18,400 feet, while the second aircraft only reached 14,000 feet!
A sadly now departed chap I knew and spent many happy hours with did a first tour in Merlin Lancs , was then sent to a training job.......decided he would rather be killed by the Germans than the young pilots he was tasked with teaching so did another tour on MK11 lancs...... he reckoned they never got to bombing altitude despite climbing all the way , had to sit under the main stream while bombs rained down from above and on one occasion on landing was sent to a far corner of the airfield and told "You're not supposed to bring the bloody bombs back Bristow " on looking an incendiary bomb was stuck in his wing .
He didn't have a high opinion of the MK11 ......although it did see him through another tour
 
It does depend on the viewpoint somewhat:

View attachment 408386
I think the Sagittario is quite beautiful and unique.
1564946781013.png


I'd never seen or heard of it before this thread.
It was clearly a MC202 or 205 inspired adaptation for the new jet tech. A good ancestry!
1564944064197.png

Just like the Yak 3...
1564944514236.png

became the Yak 15.
1564943955921.png

And being taildraggers, they both must have buggered up runways and taxiways and set fire to grass strips!
 
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chrismcd

Old-Salt
Some aircraft were meant for radials...

The Beau was one of them!

Regards,
MM
Apparently, the torque swing on takeoff went from bad to critical - with a very high minimum safety speed before the rudder was fully effective (200mph as I remember).

But, all the work that RR Hucknall did in developing the Merlin nacelles came in very handy when the Manchester transmogrified into the Lancaster.

Even the Lancs designer, Roy Chadwick, could not explain the increase in performance over the estimates.
HP Halifax II.jpg


The belief is that it is the lower thrust line and longer nacelle in the Lancaster - compared to the Halifax - gave less turbulence against the wing leading edge.
lancaster.jpg
 
Apparently, the torque swing on takeoff went from bad to critical - with a very high minimum safety speed before the rudder was fully effective (200mph as I remember).

But, all the work that RR Hucknall did in developing the Merlin nacelles came in very handy when the Manchester transmogrified into the Lancaster.

Even the Lancs designer, Roy Chadwick, could not explain the increase in performance over the estimates. View attachment 408680

The belief is that it is the lower thrust line and longer nacelle in the Lancaster - compared to the Halifax - gave less turbulence against the wing leading edge.
View attachment 408681
Never understood the insistence of the RAF in not having handed engines in big twin engined fighters. Am I right in saying they did it as well with the P38 Lightning, completely stuffing a brilliant Aircraft.?
 

chrismcd

Old-Salt
Never understood the insistence of the RAF in not having handed engines in big twin engined fighters. Am I right in saying they did it as well with the P38 Lightning, completely stuffing a brilliant Aircraft.?
Very true. The P-38 story is hidden in the mists of history. We definitely asked for non-handed engines. The "Why" is the question. Best theory is that we wanted commonality with the Allisons for the P-40's we ordered. Makes as much sense as anything else.

You get the impression that the Brits in general and aircraft engine manufacturers in particular thought handed engines were "too difficult".

Handed Merlins were produced for the dh Hornet, as part of a general clean up to fit into a very small nacelle. I have a feeling Rolls were embarrassed into doing it when they saw how it improved the P-38. Apparently, it was done in the final drive gearbox using idler gears and turned out to be quite simple!

List of Rolls-Royce Merlin variants - Wikipedia look at the Merlin 130/1
 

tiv

War Hero
I just checked in Whirlwind - Westland's Enigmatic Fighter which recounts that Petter was adament that handed engines were need even though tests with a Blenheim with counter rotating engines against a standard aircraft showed no difference. The second Whirlwind prototype was fitted with handed engines and compaired to the first prototype by two A&AEE pilots who reported no major differences between the two aircraft and that was that.
 

tiv

War Hero
I think the Sagittario is quite beautiful and unique.View attachment 408653

I'd never seen or heard of it before this thread.
It was clearly a MC202 or 205 inspired adaptation for the new jet tech. A good ancestry!
View attachment 408638
Just like the Yak 3...
View attachment 408640
became the Yak 15.
View attachment 408637
And being taildraggers, they both must have buggered up runways and taxiways and set fire to grass strips!
The Sagittario was said to be based on this Ambrosini S.7 - Wikipedia
 
I just checked in Whirlwind - Westland's Enigmatic Fighter which recounts that Petter was adament that handed engines were need even though tests with a Blenheim with counter rotating engines against a standard aircraft showed no difference. The second Whirlwind prototype was fitted with handed engines and compaired to the first prototype by two A&AEE pilots who reported no major differences between the two aircraft and that was that.
Whereas the Beaufighter was known for its pronounced swing on takeoff & willingness to ground loop on landing.
 
Very true. The P-38 story is hidden in the mists of history. We definitely asked for non-handed engines. The "Why" is the question. Best theory is that we wanted commonality with the Allisons for the P-40's we ordered. Makes as much sense as anything else.

You get the impression that the Brits in general and aircraft engine manufacturers in particular thought handed engines were "too difficult".

Handed Merlins were produced for the dh Hornet, as part of a general clean up to fit into a very small nacelle. I have a feeling Rolls were embarrassed into doing it when they saw how it improved the P-38. Apparently, it was done in the final drive gearbox using idler gears and turned out to be quite simple!

List of Rolls-Royce Merlin variants - Wikipedia look at the Merlin 130/1
Ta have an i. So really it was RR being a pain.
 

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