more trouble for wacky jacqui...

maguire

LE
Book Reviewer
#1
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/8069455.stm

'A Briton held on suspicion of terrorism in Bangladesh is to sue Home Secretary Jacqui Smith, alleging she allowed his torture, the Home Office has confirmed.

Former civil servant Jamil Rahman, who grew up in south Wales, claims he was interrogated by MI5 officers in between beatings by Bangladesh security forces.'

it never rains but it pours eh...
 
#2
He's Welsh. Where is the harm?

Chally
 
#3
chally2 said:
He's Welsh. Where is the harm?

Chally
Is he?
He has lived in Bangladesh since 2005
He was brought up in Wales, was he born there? Or was his settling in Bangladesh returning to his place of origin? I don't know, I can't find reference to where he came from but the article specifically says he grew up in Wales, not that he was from Wales.
The point of this is, he is a Bangladesh resident, is he actually a Bangladeshi with a convenient British passport? If so then it is precious little issue to us what the Bangladeshi's do with him. I would like a little more clarity before I jump on the bandwagon about what is being done to British people oversea's.
As much as I despise Jaqui Smith, if Jamil Rahman's British passport is a matter of convenience (he does not live here and hasn't for years) then I couldn't care less what becomes of him.
Upon his return he waited until he could import his Bagladeshi wife before he started the legal process.
I suggest this man is rubbing his hands wth glee at the prospect of a big payout. It has big earning potentilal doesn't it?
 
#4
They'll have to work any court dates around her existing court appearance next month. Guido is reporting that Jacqui is up before the beak at the end of next month on fraud charges relating to her expenses.

If Guido's correct, I don't know whether this has been instigated by the Met (unlikely) or by the bloke who tried to start a private prosecution against her.

Presumably she'll have to have her DNA taken like everybody else accused of an arrestable offence. Hopefully, they'll have run out of cotton buds at the nick so her DNA will be sampled by forcing a cactus into every orifice.
 
#5
jagman I completely agree with your brief on the situation. I do think that it will turn out to be a complete non event though.
As with many stories like this the evidence usually ammounts to very little and the allegations cannot be pinned down to one specific person. A government payout on this issue seems hugely unlikely though.
 
#6
maguire said:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/8069455.stm

'A Briton held on suspicion of terrorism in Bangladesh is to sue Home Secretary Jacqui Smith, alleging she allowed his torture, the Home Office has confirmed.

Former civil servant Jamil Rahman, who grew up in south Wales, claims he was interrogated by MI5 officers in between beatings by Bangladesh security forces.'

it never rains but it pours eh...
It's a bit difficult to prove that she allowed, or even knew of any alleged torture, unless he has actual proof that the Home Office said to the Bangladesh Authorities - 'go ahead - do what you want'.

It seems to be another attempt of a 'get rich' quick scheme. :x
 
#7
All British passports used to be convenient...with their little homily from the Foreign Sec. "Her Britannic Majesty's Secretary of State Requests and requires in the Name of Her Majesty all those whom it may concern to allow the bearer to pass freely without let or hindrance, and to afford the bearer such assistance and protection as may be necessary. " and the knowledge that the bearer was supported by many, many gunboats! Now it is unlikely that a RIB full of iPod wearing jollies is within 2000 miles. So he should indeed sue Jacqui and her cabinet colleagues for allowing the armed forces to be over-extended and under resourced - a neat trick if you can do it by the way!
 
#8
All British passports used to be convenient...with their little homily from the Foreign Sec. "Her Britannic Majesty's Secretary of State Requests and requires in the Name of Her Majesty all those whom it may concern to allow the bearer to pass freely without let or hindrance, and to afford the bearer such assistance and protection as may be necessary. " and the knowledge that the bearer was supported by many, many gunboats! Now it is unlikely that a RIB full of iPod wearing jollies is within 2000 miles. So he should indeed sue Jacqui and her cabinet colleagues for allowing the armed forces to be over-extended and under resourced - a neat trick if you can do it by the way!
 
#9
I don't know. How lucky are some people? How come some people get all the luck and get picked up, beaten and humiliated?

Some of us have to pay good money for that sort of thing..
 
#11
'I don't know. How lucky are some people? How come some people get all the luck and get picked up, beaten and humiliated?

Some of us have to pay good money for that sort of thing.. '

Are you an MP or something?
 
#12
maguire said:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/8069455.stm

'A Briton held on suspicion of terrorism in Bangladesh is to sue Home Secretary Jacqui Smith, alleging she allowed his torture, the Home Office has confirmed.

Former civil servant Jamil Rahman, who grew up in south Wales, claims he was interrogated by MI5 officers in between beatings by Bangladesh security forces.'

it never rains but it pours eh...
Wouldn't it be MI6 in Bangladesh? Seems pretty unlikely anyway. If we wanted information we'd probably do it ourselves rather than trusting a dodgy TPLIC.
 

Command_doh

LE
Book Reviewer
#15
jagman said:
chally2 said:
He's Welsh. Where is the harm?

Chally
Is he?
He has lived in Bangladesh since 2005
He was brought up in Wales, was he born there? Or was his settling in Bangladesh returning to his place of origin? I don't know, I can't find reference to where he came from but the article specifically says he grew up in Wales, not that he was from Wales.
The point of this is, he is a Bangladesh resident, is he actually a Bangladeshi with a convenient British passport? If so then it is precious little issue to us what the Bangladeshi's do with him. I would like a little more clarity before I jump on the bandwagon about what is being done to British people oversea's.
As much as I despise Jaqui Smith, if Jamil Rahman's British passport is a matter of convenience (he does not live here and hasn't for years) then I couldn't care less what becomes of him.
Upon his return he waited until he could import his Bagladeshi wife before he started the legal process.
I suggest this man is rubbing his hands wth glee at the prospect of a big payout. It has big earning potentilal doesn't it?
He was brought up in Wales. So he qualifies for a British Passport. Check. He is a British National who has allegedly been tortured overseas in his (possible) country of origin (nobody has proved he was not born here yet), so is fully entitled to attempt recourse through the British Embassy/High Commission (even though he will be aware that we have limited powers when someone is detained in a country/region where they hold nationality of that state whilst simultaneously being dual nationals). Check. No issue so far.

As to the bolded, you (possibly) don't seem to understand the concept of Nationality. Regardless of where this person lives or originated from, he is a GBR national and this does not expire or lapse. Ever. Only if he is stripped of nationality (and I am struggling to recall a single instance where the UK has done this in modern times) would he not be a citizen of the United Kingdom.

So there is no 'convenience' in the matter at all. He is a citizen who is trying what has been tried already - attempting to clarify to what end British intelligence was complicit in the torture of its citizens/other terrorist suspects overseas. Much in the same way untold numbers are trying to to the same thing with the Americans. Sounds perfectly reasonable to me (regardless of my personal opinion on torturing terror suspects that is), especially in the litigious World we live in today.
 
#16
Command_doh said:
jagman said:
chally2 said:
He's Welsh. Where is the harm?

Chally
Is he?
He has lived in Bangladesh since 2005
He was brought up in Wales, was he born there? Or was his settling in Bangladesh returning to his place of origin? I don't know, I can't find reference to where he came from but the article specifically says he grew up in Wales, not that he was from Wales.
The point of this is, he is a Bangladesh resident, is he actually a Bangladeshi with a convenient British passport? If so then it is precious little issue to us what the Bangladeshi's do with him. I would like a little more clarity before I jump on the bandwagon about what is being done to British people oversea's.
As much as I despise Jaqui Smith, if Jamil Rahman's British passport is a matter of convenience (he does not live here and hasn't for years) then I couldn't care less what becomes of him.
Upon his return he waited until he could import his Bagladeshi wife before he started the legal process.
I suggest this man is rubbing his hands wth glee at the prospect of a big payout. It has big earning potentilal doesn't it?
He was brought up in Wales. So he qualifies for a British Passport. Check. He is a British National who has allegedly been tortured overseas in his (possible) country of origin (nobody has proved he was not born here yet), so is fully entitled to attempt recourse through the British Embassy/High Commission (even though he will be aware that we have limited powers when someone is detained in a country/region where they hold nationality of that state whilst simultaneously being dual nationals). Check. No issue so far.

As to the bolded, you (possibly) don't seem to understand the concept of Nationality. Regardless of where this person lives or originated from, he is a GBR national and this does not expire or lapse. Ever. Only if he is stripped of nationality (and I am struggling to recall a single instance where the UK has done this in modern times) would he not be a citizen of the United Kingdom.

So there is no 'convenience' in the matter at all. He is a citizen who is trying what has been tried already - attempting to clarify to what end British intelligence was complicit in the torture of its citizens/other terrorist suspects overseas. Much in the same way untold numbers are trying to to the same thing with the Americans. Sounds perfectly reasonable to me (regardless of my personal opinion on torturing terror suspects that is), especially in the litigious World we live in today.
Nice summing up. I think Abu Hamza al-Masri (he of the hooks) is the only person to have had his UK nationality withdrawn. In his case, on the grounds that he had "seriously prejudiced" the security of the nation.
 
#17
mnairb said:
'I don't know. How lucky are some people? How come some people get all the luck and get picked up, beaten and humiliated?

Some of us have to pay good money for that sort of thing.. '

Are you an MP or something?
If I were an MP I'd be getting my kicks on expenses, so not technically paying for it. No I'm just your average perverted Highwayman :D
 
#18
jagman said:
chally2 said:
He's Welsh. Where is the harm?

Chally
Is he?
He has lived in Bangladesh since 2005
He was brought up in Wales, was he born there? Or was his settling in Bangladesh returning to his place of origin? I don't know, I can't find reference to where he came from but the article specifically says he grew up in Wales, not that he was from Wales.
The point of this is, he is a Bangladesh resident, is he actually a Bangladeshi with a convenient British passport? If so then it is precious little issue to us what the Bangladeshi's do with him. I would like a little more clarity before I jump on the bandwagon about what is being done to British people oversea's.
As much as I despise Jaqui Smith, if Jamil Rahman's British passport is a matter of convenience (he does not live here and hasn't for years) then I couldn't care less what becomes of him.
Upon his return he waited until he could import his Bagladeshi wife before he started the legal process.
I suggest this man is rubbing his hands wth glee at the prospect of a big payout. It has big earning potentilal doesn't it?
Nothing like a few assumptions is there...bloody foreigners with their bloody British passports that jagman seems to know, from one bbc article, is clearly one of convenience :roll:
 
#19
drain_sniffer said:
jagman said:
chally2 said:
He's Welsh. Where is the harm?

Chally
Is he?
He has lived in Bangladesh since 2005
He was brought up in Wales, was he born there? Or was his settling in Bangladesh returning to his place of origin? I don't know, I can't find reference to where he came from but the article specifically says he grew up in Wales, not that he was from Wales.
The point of this is, he is a Bangladesh resident, is he actually a Bangladeshi with a convenient British passport? If so then it is precious little issue to us what the Bangladeshi's do with him. I would like a little more clarity before I jump on the bandwagon about what is being done to British people oversea's.
As much as I despise Jaqui Smith, if Jamil Rahman's British passport is a matter of convenience (he does not live here and hasn't for years) then I couldn't care less what becomes of him.
Upon his return he waited until he could import his Bagladeshi wife before he started the legal process.
I suggest this man is rubbing his hands wth glee at the prospect of a big payout. It has big earning potentilal doesn't it?
Nothing like a few assumptions is there...bloody foreigners with their bloody British passports that jagman seems to know, from one bbc article, is clearly one of convenience :roll:
You missed the bit where I ased for more clarity on the details before climb on a bandwagon did I not?
I asked questions, given that the man has been living in Bangladesh etc etc they are pertinent to the subject.
Kindly re-read my post and take note of the question marks.
I ask questions, you call them assumptions. The story doesn't add up so I question it. I am entitled to do so and will continue to do so.
Feel free to slag me off if it suits you but I shall continue to feel free to ask questions
 
#20
ashie said:
Command_doh said:
jagman said:
chally2 said:
He's Welsh. Where is the harm?

Chally
Is he?
shortened for ease
He was brought up in Wales. So he qualifies for a British Passport. Check. He is a British National who has allegedly been tortured overseas in his (possible) country of origin (nobody has proved he was not born here yet), so is fully entitled to attempt recourse through the British Embassy/High Commission (even though he will be aware that we have limited powers when someone is detained in a country/region where they hold nationality of that state whilst simultaneously being dual nationals). Check. No issue so far.

As to the bolded, you (possibly) don't seem to understand the concept of Nationality. Regardless of where this person lives or originated from, he is a GBR national and this does not expire or lapse. Ever. Only if he is stripped of nationality (and I am struggling to recall a single instance where the UK has done this in modern times) would he not be a citizen of the United Kingdom.

So there is no 'convenience' in the matter at all. He is a citizen who is trying what has been tried already - attempting to clarify to what end British intelligence was complicit in the torture of its citizens/other terrorist suspects overseas. Much in the same way untold numbers are trying to to the same thing with the Americans. Sounds perfectly reasonable to me (regardless of my personal opinion on torturing terror suspects that is), especially in the litigious World we live in today.
Nice summing up. I think Abu Hamza al-Masri (he of the hooks) is the only person to have had his UK nationality withdrawn. In his case, on the grounds that he had "seriously prejudiced" the security of the nation.
I am simply enquiring about more details on this man. More detail is central to his motives and legitimacy.
Simply because this man lived in Bangladesh and has returned to Britain, waited until he has moved his Bagladeshi family here and now launched a legal challenge that appears to be largely motivated by the quest for cash.
The points I have queried may not be pleasant or PC but they are relevant.
I fully grasp the consept of nationality, Im not entirely sure this gentleman does and I want to know more.
The article is vague about his background, I suspect deliberatly so. His background is central to the issue for the reasons you mentioned. Whats so wrong about asking for more detail?
 

Similar threads

Latest Threads

Top