More Realistic Weapon Qualification For The US Army

#1
Interesting article on the proposed new weapon qualification method for the US Army. In my opinion, it sounds like a very good idea, and is a logical follow-on to the new upgraded basic training that they are now giving recruits.


....This is to give Soldiers a qualification standard that is more combat focused,” said Capt. Sammie Burkes, Company C commander. “It requires them to use those marksmanship skills they will encounter in a modern-day battlefield environment.”

L-shaped barriers have been placed in front of the berms on the firing ranges. At the start of the "Combat Shoot," Soldiers are given four 10-round magazines. As they walk down the range on a simulated patrol, targets pop up and a loudspeaker blares the sound of shots being fired at them. Soldiers are required to engage multiple targets at different distances. The targets require one to three hits before they will go down.


....
During the last three scenarios a new twist is added. A target painted white appears representing a civilian. If a Soldier shoots the civilian, he or she is automatically disqualified.

“It’s teaching the Soldiers to have a little bit of target discrimination,” Burkes said.

“We’ve placed the civilian 'target' in the middle of the others,” said Weeks. “The Soldiers have to look beyond it and aim in front and behind.”

Another twist is dummy rounds loaded in the Soldier’s magazine. They can be in one, two three or all four of the magazines. The dummy rounds are designed to simulate a weapons jam, requiring Soldiers to perform SPORTS (slap, pull, observe, release, tap, shoot) to their weapon in the middle of their BRM qualification.
Full article: http://www.army.mil/-news/2008/03/27/8162-jackson-testing-new-weapons-qualification-method/
 
#2
“It’s teaching the Soldiers to have a little bit of target discrimination,” Burkes said.
That would no doubt be appreciated by their allies and civis alike.
 
#3
rabid_hamster said:
“It’s teaching the Soldiers to have a little bit of target discrimination,” Burkes said.
That would no doubt be appreciated by their allies and civis alike.
Just got to get their pilots on a similar scheme and everyone will be happier.
 
#4
fecking 'ell been through better civi training after getting out years ago then what I got whilst in.

Marksmanship whilst in (90's era) was still entrenched in well trench warfare...shoot from a fox hole.

This is great news for recruits, especially since it directly translates into both long arms and hand guns.
 
#5
dingerr said:
rabid_hamster said:
“It’s teaching the Soldiers to have a little bit of target discrimination,” Burkes said.
That would no doubt be appreciated by their allies and civis alike.
Just got to get their pilots on a similar scheme and everyone will be happier.
Funny that. Considering I could probably find hundreds of British soldiers who are still here today because of US pilots, and only a few families who have lost loved ones to them.
 
#6
gimme-shelter said:
dingerr said:
rabid_hamster said:
“It’s teaching the Soldiers to have a little bit of target discrimination,” Burkes said.
That would no doubt be appreciated by their allies and civis alike.
Just got to get their pilots on a similar scheme and everyone will be happier.
Funny that. Considering I could probably find hundreds of British soldiers who are still here today because of US pilots, and only a few families who have lost loved ones to them.
Seconded. our troops on the ground are very grateful for the support the Yanks give us look at ross kemp in afghanistan they were confident even after the blue on blue which occured. shit happens
 
S

stabradop

Guest
#7
ctauch said:
fecking 'ell been through better civi training after getting out years ago then what I got whilst in.

Marksmanship whilst in (90's era) was still entrenched in well trench warfare...shoot from a fox hole.

This is great news for recruits, especially since it directly translates into both long arms and hand guns.
I agree although I would say an awful lot of the civvy stuff (outside of the police and security industry) has been around to make competitions more interesting and challenging and therefore attractive to sponsors. I used to know a British shooter (via ex-wife) who was at the top of the tree in the UK and near it worldwide. Unfortunately he now lives abroad as he was a pistol shooter.

stab
 
#8
stabradop said:
ctauch said:
fecking 'ell been through better civi training after getting out years ago then what I got whilst in.

Marksmanship whilst in (90's era) was still entrenched in well trench warfare...shoot from a fox hole.

This is great news for recruits, especially since it directly translates into both long arms and hand guns.
I agree although I would say an awful lot of the civvy stuff (outside of the police and security industry) has been around to make competitions more interesting and challenging and therefore attractive to sponsors. I used to know a British shooter (via ex-wife) who was at the top of the tree in the UK and near it worldwide. Unfortunately he now lives abroad as he was a pistol shooter.

stab
Actually the courses I have taken had nothing to do with competition. They were all taught by ex-plod and/or monkeys and were in combination with concealed carry, living in the Great State of Florida I get to carry a weapon for self-defense. All courses were 4 hours in length and dealt with a variety of engagements multi target, friend and foe, cover and concealment, single handed reloads, no sight shooting, simulate night engagements. We put anywhere from 800 to 1000 rounds down range during each training. Hell I was lucky to get 100 rounds for the once a year qual whilst in.
 
#9
tommy_cooker said:
gimme-shelter said:
dingerr said:
rabid_hamster said:
“It’s teaching the Soldiers to have a little bit of target discrimination,” Burkes said.
That would no doubt be appreciated by their allies and civis alike.
Just got to get their pilots on a similar scheme and everyone will be happier.
Funny that. Considering I could probably find hundreds of British soldiers who are still here today because of US pilots, and only a few families who have lost loved ones to them.
Seconded. our troops on the ground are very grateful for the support the Yanks give us look at ross kemp in afghanistan they were confident even after the blue on blue which occured. s*** happens
I saw the soldier's reactions after the deaths in that series. After all the media stories and some savage posts on Arrse I was shocked to see they weren't angry at the US Air Force at all.
 
#10
Virgil said:
I saw the soldier's reactions after the deaths in that series. After all the media stories and some savage posts on Arrse I was shocked to see they weren't angry at the US Air Force at all.
Says a whole big bunch about you.
 
S

stabradop

Guest
#11
ctauch said:
stabradop said:
ctauch said:
fecking 'ell been through better civi training after getting out years ago then what I got whilst in.

Marksmanship whilst in (90's era) was still entrenched in well trench warfare...shoot from a fox hole.

This is great news for recruits, especially since it directly translates into both long arms and hand guns.
I agree although I would say an awful lot of the civvy stuff (outside of the police and security industry) has been around to make competitions more interesting and challenging and therefore attractive to sponsors. I used to know a British shooter (via ex-wife) who was at the top of the tree in the UK and near it worldwide. Unfortunately he now lives abroad as he was a pistol shooter.

stab
Actually the courses I have taken had nothing to do with competition. They were all taught by ex-plod and/or monkeys and were in combination with concealed carry, living in the Great State of Florida I get to carry a weapon for self-defense. All courses were 4 hours in length and dealt with a variety of engagements multi target, friend and foe, cover and concealment, single handed reloads, no sight shooting, simulate night engagements. We put anywhere from 800 to 1000 rounds down range during each training. Hell I was lucky to get 100 rounds for the once a year qual whilst in.
Ah I stand corrected. I do apologise. Must be handy being able have a concealed carry, I hear some parts of Florida can be somewhat nasty.

stab
 
#12
stabradop said:
Ah I stand corrected. I do apologise. Must be handy being able have a concealed carry, I hear some parts of Florida can be somewhat nasty.
stab
An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.
Robert A. Heinlein
 
#14
PassingBells said:
ctauch said:
stabradop said:
Ah I stand corrected. I do apologise. Must be handy being able have a concealed carry, I hear some parts of Florida can be somewhat nasty.
stab
An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.
Robert A. Heinlein
And such polite people live in Florida.

PIAT gun seized in police raid
They are all sitting in goal at the moment and never used it. I contend they didn't know how or could have ever known how. Furthermore had they trotted out in publc with it they would have been shot dead before they could have engaged any viable target let alone armed it.

Either way what's your point? Taken a peak around Manc lately?
 
#15
Let me summarise for you:
ctauch said:
An armed society is a polite socity.
PassingBells said:
No it's not.
And you obviously missed this bit of the article:
According to investigators several witnesses told them that Carden and Gilmore actually fired the anti tank weapon into Lake Parker in Lakeland.
Does having lots of guns loose in Manchester make it a safer city? I don't really think so. Do you?
 
#16
PassingBells said:
Let me sumarise for you:
ctauch said:
An armed society is a polite socity.
PassingBells said:
No it's not.
And you obviously missed this bit of the article:
According to investigators several witnesses told them that Carden and Gilmore actually fired the anti tank weapon into Lake Parker in Lakeland.
Is BS I live in the area ;-) it was not fired.

Want my addy to finger it out?
 
#18
Does having lots of guns loose in Manchester make it a safer city? I don't really think so. Do you?
No it doesn't seeing the law abiding are not allowed to lawfully own arms. Only the chavs, pikeys and kaffers can posses illeagally aquired arms to torment the civpop.

Is a bit off topic though!
 
#19
ctauch said:
Virgil said:
I saw the soldier's reactions after the deaths in that series. After all the media stories and some savage posts on Arrse I was shocked to see they weren't angry at the US Air Force at all.
Says a whole big bunch about you.
Fixed it for you.

Yeah, that's what I get for believing what arrse posters think.
 
#20
Virgil said:
ctauch said:
Virgil said:
I saw the soldier's reactions after the deaths in that series. After all the media stories and some savage posts on Arrse I was shocked to see they weren't angry at the US Air Force at all.
Says a whole big bunch about you.
Fixed it for you.

Yeah, that's what I get for believing what arrse posters think.
As opposed to forming a logical opinion of your own!

There are times when Blue on Blue is clearly due to negligence or stupidity. At such times anger is appropriate. Other times it is genuine "fog of war" and it is important to realise and accept that "shit happens".
 

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